Buying demo skis...

[TiffAlt]

Are you demoing the Yumi 80 or 84? I bought my daughter a pair of the 84s at the beginning of the season--she's 16 and 5'3 ish 100 pounds and they've been great for her. She's on the 154 which took some getting used to, but she takes them everywhere without hesitation. I think Volkl has hit a home run with the Yumi for smaller people.

The extra length at 154 didn't bother you at all, it sounds like?

It's the 84. I had no trouble with the length at all! Interesting...

Volkl Yumi 154 vs Blizzard Black Pearl 88

I am comparing the specs on soothski.com and the running length on the 154 Yumi is actually shorter than the Blizzard Pearl even at 147. I think this is effective edge - so minus the rocker. 107.3cm for the Yumi and 116.7 for the BP.

Overall, maybe it's the stiffness of the BPs you're not liking as well?

I don't think it's the dimensions of the ski, but the construction. Cores are different, so the Yumi, maybe softer to flex.

The new Black Pearl is definitely stiffer than the Yumi!

I definitely think it must be the stiffness. I am just not advanced enough to properly handle the stiffness the BPs offer. Maybe in time as I build the correct muscle? Soothski seems to say the Yumi has more bending stiffness, but I disagree. I think it's softer.

I was actually in to see my bootfitter yesterday about one last pressure point along the shin and we got talking about this issue. He actually wondered if instead I should look into a more freeride oriented ski for the specific issues I had. He's heard me talk about my inability to turn well/pivot a lot by now, lol. He was interested to see how I liked the Yumi - which I told him I was demoing - and wondered about the Sheeva 9 which is even more frontside oriented than the Yumi. I balked at going up to 90mm, though he thought I shouldn't dismiss it out of hand.

Could this freeride oriented type of construction be the difference?

 

[TiffAlt]

I think Volkl has hit a home run with the Yumi for smaller people.

YASSS. Maybe I'm a Volkl girl

 

[TiffAlt]

Sheeva 9 which is even more frontside oriented than the Yumi. I balked at going up to 90mm, though he thought I shouldn't dismiss it out of hand.

FREERIDE oriented and 92mm, sorry!

 

[TiffAlt]

And yes I am back from skiing open to close. I scampered off the last run to make sure the rental store was still open and I could buy them - that exact pair, with the bindings. There was a snowboarder right in front of me also buying his demo and a guy that came in behind me with his demos to also buy them. Guess a lot of people are taking them up on the demo today, get your demo price off purchase.

BTW, these demo bindings are Marker Squire 11 TCX and they are so much smoother. I think those of you who advised me that I may just have gotten a sticky pair with the ones on my BP, I'm inclined to agree. I still wonder if the binding delta had anything to do with me liking the Yumi, but since I was able to buy the demo as a whole package, I guess I'll never know!

 

[TiffAlt]

Specs are pretty similar, but the Yumis narrower waist would give it a bit more sidecut than the BP 88.

Just saw this on evo.com and this exactly what I felt today. It was really easy to dynamically make changes in turns even while in them. I could do this with the BP by pulling it under me, but used a lot more energy doing it!

 

[Abbi]

These are my bored ramblings b/c I'm avoiding cleaning my house. lol

i’m gradually packing up my apartment for the winter, so happy to read your ramblings to avoid packing!

 

[NewEnglandSkier]

BTW, these demo bindings are Marker Squire 11 TCX and they are so much smoother. I think those of you who advised me that I may just have gotten a sticky pair with the ones on my BP, I'm inclined to agree.

Squire 11 demos come with the TCX heel---while the Squire 11 retail version don't have that heel (to get the TCX heel in a retail version you need to get the Squire 12 TCX)

 

[xxs_skier]

I’m currently at the mountain demoing the 2023 Yumi in 154 and I LOVE THEM.

That's so great to hear! I think most petite people love the Yumi. I think the BP tends to be more polarizing.

I also didn't realize the BPs were heavier, I do prefer a lightweight ski.

 

[alude]

The new Black Pearl is definitely stiffer than the Yumi!

I think you have to be a bit careful with such statements. The shorter lengths of the Yumi 84 are clearly stiffer than the shorter lengths of the Black Pearl 88. This trend is reversed for the longer lengths. You can see here. The stiffness scaling is not uniform amongst brands/models.

 

[tinymoose]

I think you have to be a bit careful with such statements. The shorter lengths of the Yumi 84 are clearly stiffer than the shorter lengths of the Black Pearl 88. This trend is reversed for the longer lengths. You can see here. The stiffness scaling is not uniform amongst brands/models.

This is an interesting site and a whole rabbit hole. I briefly pulled up the Faction Agent 1X, Volkl Yumi, and BP 88 in the 153-154 lengths as I’ve recently tried all. It’s saying the Factions are the stiffest followed by the Yumis and then the BPs. Just based on memory of my recent demoing I would not have guessed that at all.

 

[alude]

This is an interesting site and a whole rabbit hole. I briefly pulled up the Faction Agent 1X, Volkl Yumi, and BP 88 in the 153-154 lengths as I’ve recently tried all. It’s saying the Factions are the stiffest followed by the Yumis and then the BPs. Just based on memory of my recent demoing I would not have guessed that at all.

When you say that you would not have guessed that, is that from hand flexing or your on-snow feels from demoing them?

 

[tinymoose]

When you say that you would not have guessed that, is that from hand flexing or your on-snow feels from demoing them?

On snow feel

 

[alude]

On snow feel

Well, the first time I tested skis on snow I ranked them in reverse order of their true bending stiffness (blind test). This might not be what is happening here, but at the time my mental image of what bending stiffness was doing was actually reversed. I thought a stiff ski would be like a tank and smooth down the terrain, being super comfy. I found that stiff skis actually transmit every little bit of the terrain to my boot and were not that comfy. Since then, I have been looking for relatively soft-bending skis!

 

[SkiBam]

YASSS. Maybe I'm a Volkl girl

Another Yumi lover here! I had never been on a Volkl I liked and only tried the Yumi a few years ago by chance. Wow. Ended up buying them and never have regretted it. Mine are now a few years old but last week while skiing I was enthusing about how much I LOVE my skis! I can't describe this from a technical point of new - just a feeling. (I also have the Super Joys which are great but I can't ever remember extolling my love for them!) So, yes, for small light women, especially somewhat advanced, for sure try the Yumi.

 

[shadoj]

There's also a factor of *where* the ski is stiff vs. how you like to ski (and how you pressure the ski).
Bending profiles from skis @tinymoose mentioned, plus BP82s from this year and last (I own the 21/22s). I'll see if I can get my hands on current Yumis next season, even if only for the sake of short-people science!

 

[TiffAlt]

On snow feel

That's my perspective too - from on snow feel, I think the BP in 147 feel stiffer than the Yumi in 154.

Well, the first time I tested skis on snow I ranked them in reverse order of their true bending stiffness (blind test). This might not be what is happening here, but at the time my mental image of what bending stiffness was doing was actually reversed. I thought a stiff ski would be like a tank and smooth down the terrain, being super comfy. I found that stiff skis actually transmit every little bit of the terrain to my boot and were not that comfy. Since then, I have been looking for relatively soft-bending skis!

Well that makes some sense - I really felt every bump in my BPs and it was jarring to my balance!

 

[TiffAlt]

There's also a factor of *where* the ski is stiff vs. how you like to ski (and how you pressure the ski).
Bending profiles from skis @tinymoose mentioned, plus BP82s from this year and last (I own the 21/22s). I'll see if I can get my hands on current Yumis next season, even if only for the sake of short-people science!

View attachment 20905

Besides where being a very good point, I'm wondering if we should also consider the weight to be a factor too. I'm not 100% sure how they measure the stiffness, but a lighter object is usually easier to bend than a heavier one

 

[scandium]

I think you have to be a bit careful with such statements. The shorter lengths of the Yumi 84 are clearly stiffer than the shorter lengths of the Black Pearl 88. This trend is reversed for the longer lengths. You can see here. The stiffness scaling is not uniform amongst brands/models.

Oh, how interesting! Definitely not how they felt under foot on snow with the more recent iterations - although I am comparing a 154 Yumi to 159 BP 88 which is not really apples with apples. The older BP 88 (2020?) felt softer than the Yumi for sure to me.

 

[shadoj]

That's my perspective too - from on snow feel, I think the BP in 147 feel stiffer than the Yumi in 154.


Well that makes some sense - I really felt every bump in my BPs and it was jarring to my balance!

Stiffness != dampness. Heavier skis tend to be damper in general. Heavier skis generally absorb/cut through chop and even out terrain variation better than lighter skis. Wider skis help smooth out unevenness, too. Certain core materials absorb vibrations better than others. Stiff skis just take more force to bend than soft skis. Stiff skis generally have a stability advantage at speed, whereas soft skis are easier to bend at slow speeds (moguls / park / super-lightweights). Find what works best for you and the terrain/conditions you ski most!

It's kinda hard to compare numbers until you've demoed a bunch of skis, and start to see patterns emerge.

 

[alude]

Well that makes some sense - I really felt every bump in my BPs and it was jarring to my balance!

To think about how easy a ski is to maneuver you need to consider a few things, but it all comes down to how much pressure (force) you have at the tip and tail. The more you have, the more it will engage quickly and the harder it will be to release.

To create pressure at the tip and tail you need to look at the stiffness (more stiffness increases the pressure), the camber (more camber increases the pressure), the sidecut radius (less sidecut radius increases the pressure) and the length from center to tip/tail (more length will decrease the pressure but will increase the lever arm, so not that simple). More edge angle will also increase the pressure at the tip/tail.

The BP has more camber, a lower sidecut radius and a longer running length. But honestly, it is not an easy comparison based on specs alone, especially because the Yumy has a very long early rise, which is hard to say if it will engage or not the snow.

More mass doesn't increase the pressure, but will make the ski harder to pivot (maneuver around with light pressure on snow), will cut through crud easier and will also make the ski more stable at speed (it is not damping as an engineer would use the term, but it is how it is described by skiers).

If you describe a bit more what you feel on snow, I could continue describing which parameters are important.