Any technique tips/ things to know about switching to flat pedals?

[Moonrocket]

I bought some flat pedals and some flat shoes- I have not ridden not clipped in other than to the coffee shop in 10 years or so.

Are there any tips to getting good pedal strokes etc?

I want to get ready for my Dirt Series Camp I signed up for and try some new stuff.

I just got pretty basic pedals- so nothing fancy https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B008RIFFFM/ref=oh_details_o07_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

[geargrrl]

The foot position is different. If you've been riding clipped in, you are used to having the pedal axel more forward. Riding flats, you want the pedal axle under the arch of the foot, not close to the ball as it would be clipped in. This is hard for clipped in riders to get used to. This is probably most important, everything else ( balance and pressure) follows the correct foot position. If your foot is forwad, you can't balance correctly because you are on your toes ( so to speak) , you can't pressure correctly, and you can't get your heels down which is used in certain situations to ensure stablity and balance.

Don't worry about pedal stroke, that will come naturally. For me, the biggest difference was learning to start on a hill.

 

[bounceswoosh]

I suggest wearing lightweight shinguards the first few times. Although I actually seem to hit my calves more often than my shins - something about the way I come to a stop. They're also nice to have for the Dirt Series - you'll be doing some things there that push your limits, whatever your limits are.

Pedal stroke doesn't really change. If you have good technique, you won't lose much (if any) efficiency climbing on flats vs. clipped in. Honestly, I was amazed at how grippy traction pins are with the right shoe - it's not like you can slide your foot around on the pedal. Once you place your foot, it's locked in unless you consciously pick it up and reposition it. Actually, I *gained* efficiency on anything moderately technical - because I no longer spend as much time waffling about whether to stay clipped in or clip out. Instead I'm actually pedaling right up to and over the obstacle.

If you'd like, we could meet up at VBP after work some day and pedal around some?

 

[geargrrl]

Oh yeah, shin guards. Forgot about those. I love my POC but there is lots out there to try.

 

[Moonrocket]

Meeting up at VBP sounds great Monique!
do you know anywhere local or in WP that stocks shin guards I can try?

thanks for all the great tips!

 

[bounceswoosh]

Meeting up at VBP sounds great Monique!
do you know anywhere local or in WP that stocks shin guards I can try?

thanks for all the great tips!

Next week for VBP, after work?

Just east of VBP on Valmont is a bike shop called The Fix. It carries a few brands of protective gear, although I don't think any are women's-specific models. I have a pair of G-Form shin guards that are too small for me and a pair of women's RaceFace as well - XL I believe - you're welcome to have the RaceFace and/or try on the G-Form.

 

[SnowHot]

I just bought Five Ten Freerider shoes, switching from SPD's. I am waiting for the pedals that I ordered so I'm only riding with stock aluminum pedals at the moment, but I did a short demo ride with some pedals with tons of pins and LOVED them.

Where others have said that shin guards are a must when you switch over, I didn't find a need for them when I demo's. I felt strong and solid on the pedals. The pins gripped to an extent that I never felt as though I'd slip off.
That being said, I may wear my shin guards when I get my HopeTech pedals.
Its a small thing to do while I'm getting used to them.

@Moonrocket what shoes did you get?

 

[SnowHot]

The foot position is different. If you've been riding clipped in, you are used to having the pedal axel more forward. Riding flats, you want the pedal axle under the arch of the foot, not close to the ball as it would be clipped in. This is hard for clipped in riders to get used to. This is probably most important, everything else ( balance and pressure) follows the correct foot position. If your foot is forwad, you can't balance correctly because you are on your toes ( so to speak) , you can't pressure correctly, and you can't get your heels down which is used in certain situations to ensure stablity and balance.

Don't worry about pedal stroke, that will come naturally. For me, the biggest difference was learning to start on a hill.

This is a technique that we worked on in the Downhill 101 course at Northstar. It was amazing the amount of maneuverability you get by changing your foot position on the pedal. Perhaps that is why I didn't have an issue with my foot slipping off when I demo'd

 

[geargrrl]

Here an interesting article. For the flat pedal haters, well they hate Bike James too. The info in here just made sense to me. My advice to is to try it, see if you like it. There will always be haters no matter which way to go. Or, rather than haters, people that are happy with their choice and are convinced it's the only way to go. I am an xc rider and a lot of the folks I know, who have been riding XC forever, just don't get it. The very first ride I did on flats felt so good, and eliminated tons of issues with my riding.

https://www.bikejames.com/strength/...-how-to-improve-your-riding-with-flat-pedals/

 

[Moonrocket]

I am so glad I asked this! I tried out the pedals this weekend (sans shin guards- still need a pair).

Geargrrl- your advice was Sooo helpful. I wasn't feeling that stable on them- then I remembered your advice and realized just the ball of my foot was on them. When I moved my foot more forward all of a sudden I felt so much better on them!

And they were 100% better for the 1/4 hoof up the steep loose trail to the start of the good stuff.

SnowHot, I don't think my shoes are the best, but they worked great. I found a pair of Teva Fuse-ions on clearance- they are meant to be water shoes, but have the sticky spider rubber on them. They actually were really nice as they feel ventilated. They were $20 on a clearance rack, so I figured they would be an okay starter and if I liked the flat pedals I could upgrade at some point.

 

[bounceswoosh]

Where others have said that shin guards are a must when you switch over, I didn't find a need for them when I demo's. I felt strong and solid on the pedals. The pins gripped to an extent that I never felt as though I'd slip off.

Yeah, those shin guards are not for slipping off. If slipping off were an issue, we wouldn't be advocating for the pedals. No, shin guards are for when you slam your pedal into your shin if/when you do go down. Alternately, for confidence that you don't need to worry about your shins if you do fall.

That being said - I don't wear them for my usual XC anymore. The G-Forms are nice because they're very small and you can slip them into your pack in case you do start feeling like you could use the confidence boost.

Make no mistake - traction pins definitely can hurt. When I started using them, it seemed like everyone on the trail had a story about flaying a shin to the bone using those pedals. Of course, they were usually doing BMX or some other fancy business, not just riding along on a trail.

 

[altagirl]

Or when you are waking next to your bike. Haha, I bled all the time coaching, because I'd bump my shins into the pedals while standing around talking. D'oh!

But yeah, I use flats all the time now and don't use shin guards unless it's like lift served DH, out technical shuttled riding.

But they help to start with for most people.

 

[CarolB]

It's great to hear the positive reviews on flat pedals. I'm always told that you need to be clipped in to ride more technical trail but I just didn't like being clipped in and don't feel confident with not being able to put my foot down quickly if it gets ugly. I got up most of the stuff that the people I rode with anyhow and they assumed I was clipped in so clearly not such an obvious gain (in my group) by being clipped in.

I also didn't like be clipped in going downhill as I tend to want to position my feet differently on the pedals depending on the slope/turns (is that a bad thing?) and it felt awkward when being stuck in one position when clipped in.

I'm a newer rider so maybe all that would change but I've just had hip surgery and am not comfortable at all with the thought of putting in the time and maybe doing the fall over thing to get better at being clipped in now. I just bought some 5.10s and Flat pedals so am looking forward to trying them out, although it sounds like they may be too sticky for me to use for awhile?

 

[bounceswoosh]

It's great to hear the positive reviews on flat pedals. I'm always told that you need to be clipped in to ride more technical trail but I just didn't like being clipped in and don't feel confident with not being able to put my foot down quickly if it gets ugly. I got up most of the stuff that the people I rode with anyhow and they assumed I was clipped in so clearly not such an obvious gain (in my group) by being clipped in.

I also didn't like be clipped in going downhill as I tend to want to position my feet differently on the pedals depending on the slope/turns (is that a bad thing?) and it felt awkward when being stuck in one position when clipped in.

I'm a newer rider so maybe all that would change but I've just had hip surgery and am not comfortable at all with the thought of putting in the time and maybe doing the fall over thing to get better at being clipped in now. I just bought some 5.10s and Flat pedals so am looking forward to trying them out, although it sounds like they may be too sticky for me to use for awhile?

Why would they be too sticky for a while? What have you been using before you got the new gear?

How are you positioning your feet differently as you ride?

 

[geargrrl]

Yes, please explain "too sticky". That doesn't make any sense to me. The term sticky refers to the softer rubber staying in place via foot pressure and not slipping. There is actually nothing "sticky" about it.
As for the "you must ride clipless for <efficiency, better control, technical trails>" they can all go jump in the lake as far as I'm concerned. Most of the people I know with that sentiment haven't tried anything new with their mountain biking since 2001.

 

[CarolB]

Right now I'm just using my regular pedals and my mtn bike shoes but with no clips so just foot pressure keeping me on.

I've read, several times, that the 5.10s, along with good flat pedals (I bought some Precision Loaded AmX), are almost as "sticky" feeling as being clipped in and so you have to do a little foot lift to "release" your foot.

So that's what I meant by sticky. Sorry for not being clearer. I'm a fairly new rider too so am still feeling my way around

 

[CarolB]

How are you positioning your feet differently as you ride?

With my current setup (bike shoes/regular pedals but not using clips) it feels like I want/can move my toes on the pedal further forward of the crank when starting to uphill and then move to more the arch of my foot when downhilling. I sometimes feel like I widen my stance too. Tiny movements when done. I do this alot on my DirtBike as well. Maybe that's all wrong and maybe I even do it because my hip arthritis (very internally rotated/tilted on one side) made it more comfy to do that way. Since surgery I'm pretty much re-learning to walk so I'm sure my biking/skiing will be different as well.

I sure enjoy the technical aspects of XCR mountain biking and have had a blast doing the Blue level (no features though) Downhill stuff at Silver Star Resort near us. We have some fun trails in Baja (ride that Nov-Dec) that are climbs into the canyons and then XCR/Downhill to the water. I'm really looking forward to getting stronger/better at this sport but having fun along the way is the most important thing, I'm not interested in getting hard on myself or too competitive so no rush.

 

[geargrrl]

Right now I'm just using my regular pedals and my mtn bike shoes but with no clips so just foot pressure keeping me on.

I've read, several times, that the 5.10s, along with good flat pedals (I bought some Precision Loaded AmX), are almost as "sticky" feeling as being clipped in and so you have to do a little foot lift to "release" your foot.

So that's what I meant by sticky. Sorry for not being clearer. I'm a fairly new rider too so am still feeling my way around

Hi Carol, please excuse the directness but that is one of the more ridiculous pedal things I've heard lately, and I read everything I can get my hands on. I've been riding flats for 2-3 years now, former clipless rider, and I can't think of movement that I or others do that even remotely resembles unclipping. It's all about pressure. Either you are pressured , or not. You can vary the pressure but as for having to unstick like unclipping- that's just strange.
Having ridden unclipped standing on my pedals with clipless shoes for many years, (think combo platform spd pedal) trust me in that the kind of pressure you are using to keep your foot from bouncing off is really different that the kind of pressure that you would use in a correct flat pedal shoe and pedal combination.

With my current setup (bike shoes/regular pedals but not using clips) it feels like I want/can move my toes on the pedal further forward of the crank when starting to uphill and then move to more the arch of my foot when downhilling. I sometimes feel like I widen my stance too. Tiny movements when done. I do this alot on my DirtBike as well. Maybe that's all wrong and maybe I even do it because my hip arthritis (very internally rotated/tilted on one side) made it more comfy to do that way. Since surgery I'm pretty much re-learning to walk so I'm sure my biking/skiing will be different as well.

One of the great things about not being clipped in is that you CAN vary your foot position and angle. I had ongoing hip pain for years that went away within weeks of getting rid of spd pedals on my mountain bikes. It's easier to move your knee for cornering, widen stance (aka Cowboy Knees) and other fun stuff. That being said, the "correct" position for flat shoes looks something like this. Keeping the pedal behind the ball of the foot is more stable than having the pedal under the ball of your foot, and it doesn't change for climbing. Have fun getting your new pedals and shoes set up. When you get to a true flat pedal set up you should really like it.

example

 

[bounceswoosh]

I may have said something about the stickiness. My observation is that I have to consciously unweight my foot to move it around on the pedal - I can't just slide it to another position. But that doesn't mean it's in any way like having to unclip to dismount. Dismounts are free.

 

[CarolB]

No worry with the directness, it does sound kinda funny but hey, seriously, I've read it several times. It's probably more like what bounceswoosh said - you don't slide around but need to consciously lift your foot. Here's a link that talks about it but I first read something on a Mtn Bike forum.

https://www.dieselbikes.com/tech/product_reviews/review_002.htm

Seeing as I've yet to be able to swing my leg over my bike I guess I'm still a little ways away from finding out just how sticky "sticky" really is! I got my shoes on EBay for $25 (almost brand new condition) so thought it worthwhile to give it a shot. They're pretty freakin' heavy duty, much to my surprise.

You guys have me hyped about the flat pedals, sounds like a good fit for my style (or the style I'll hopefully develop!)