Alta Demo Day, April 9, 2016

[marzNC]

The 2016 Alta Demo Day included about 20 brands, including several indies (4FRNT, ON3P, Ramp, Sego, KFSkis) who brought really fat powder skis. I tried the several models from Head and K2, also Atomic, Blizzard, Nordica, and Fischer. Forgot about the Dynastar Glory line. The other brands included Volkl, Rossingnol, Elan, Scott, Armada, and Salomon. For this demo day, I was mainly trying out skis that I thought I would like as all-mountain with a powder bias, so was looking at 90-100 underfoot. But as always I was open to checking out something wider or narrower as well.

My observations are probably more useful for petite skiers who like Rossignol or Dynastar or other brands that tend to make softer skis, as opposed to stiffer skis like Volkl. I’m an older skier (over 55), 5’0”, 115 lbs, was an adventurous intermediate who became a solid advanced skier in the last ten years, not that interested in speed but willing to go fast on groomers when the slopes aren’t crowded, tend to ski 60% off-piste out west when conditions are decent, and 75% when conditions are good. I’m not sure how to review skis in terms of describing how a ski acts. After doing a couple demo days (Massanutten, Alta) every season for several years, I can tell fairly quickly which skis are fun for me.

At an Alta Demo Day, I mostly look for skis that would be fun to rent during a trip out west when I get lucky and catch a big snowstorm. I do fine with my all-mountain Blizzard Black Pearls, 88 underfoot, 159cm, even in a foot of fresh powder but usually rent when there is over six inches.

Conditions changed over the course of the day as it warmed up into the 50s at the base. No fresh snow for over week, decent spring skiing conditions. In the morning, the groomers were firm on the upper mountain and pretty nice towards the bottom. Anything ungroomed was frozen and not worth skiing. I mainly skied Mambo (wide blue) and Collins Face (wide black) in the morning. After lunch, it was warm enough to go off into the ungroomed on the lower mountain so I did a few runs in the gully below Watson’s and on the soft bumps on Lower Rustler. For most skis, I took one nonstop run from the top of Collins (about 2000’ vertical). In the afternoon, I did a second run for a few models. Demo Day ended around 3:00, which is when the sun came out and it was much more fun off the groomers.

MORNING on firm groomers

*** Blizzard Black Pearl, 159
Atomic Vantage 95, 162
*** Atomic Vantage 90W, 161
Fischer Trinity, 155, 118-68-100 R12
Nordica Santa Ana 93, 161 - too long

AFTERNOON on groomers and soft spring snow, including bumps

Head Total Joy, 153 - too short on groomers, easy on bumps
*** Head Total Joy, 158
Head Super Joy, 158 - too long
** K2 OoolaLUV 85, 163
** K2 FulLUVit 95, 163
*** K2 Remedy 92 twintip, 163

*** most fun
** fun

 

[marzNC]

Comments about the skis that I liked more.

ATOMIC VANTAGE 90W, 161; VANTAGE 95, 162
The Vantage 90W was the most surprising model I tried this trip. Rented the 90W for half a day after a 10-12 inch powder storm that ended the day before. Good fun in cut up powder off the groomers and very stable and easy to get on edge on groomers. Took a quite run down the groomers in the morning to confirm that I liked it. I was surprised when the rep said the 90W contains metal but the 95 does not. The Vantage 95 was okay but not a model I would ask for when renting. Atomic uses an unusual binding. Rep was explaining something about the U-shape toe piece being more responsive.

BLIZZARD BLACK PEARL, 159
Had heard that the BP was a bit different for 2017. Only took one run first thing in the morning on fresh groomers. Held perhaps a little better than my 2011 BPs, but didn’t really feel much different. I could be happy getting another pair of BPs in a year or two.

HEAD TOTAL JOY, 153 and 158
I’d demo’d the Total Joy at Massanutten and liked it. Took out the 153cm just to see how the shorter length would feel. Did not feel as stable on groomers, as expected. Certainly easier to turn in soft bumps (Lower Rustler). I took exactly the same route down afterwards on the 158cm. Even though I had to concentrate more in the bumps, it’s pretty clear that 158cm is the right length for me since I want skis that are pretty versatile. Between the Total Joy 158 and the BP 159, it’s a toss up which one I like better. The bindings used on the Joy line are much easier to use than the Marker Squires that were on the Blizzard skis.

HEAD SUPER JOY, 158
I knew the Super Joy at 158 would probably be too long. I was right. Had not had a chance to try them before but liked the Absolut Joy enough to buy them last summer for Mid-Atlantic skiing. The day before, I rode up the Sugarloaf lift with an older woman who had relatively short Super Joys, probably 143. She could carve really well on them at pretty high speed on the groomers. We did a couple runs together. As it turned out she is 5’1”, 108 lbs . . . and 72 years old. Learned to ski in her 40’s, moved to SLC 15 years ago from the northeast with her husband, and been working really hard on technique with private lessons to improve off-piste for more versatility now that she has carving all figured out.

K2 OoolaLUV 85, 163; FulLUVit 95, 163
Have liked the K2 skis I’ve rented the last few years. They hold on groomers well regardless of how wide they are. Even at 163, doing soft bumps was reasonable for the OoolaLUV and the FulLUVit. I think I might like the OolaLUV better in the 156 length. 163cm is the shortest FulLUVit available. The names are hard to remember.

K2 Remedy 92 twintip, 163
It was getting late by the time I returned the FulLUVit to the K2 tent. I didn’t feel like going anywhere else. I’d been on the Remedy 117 last season for an afternoon after a snowstorm and had been surprised how well it held on firm groomers. The Remedy 92 was quite fun on groomers and good in the soft bumps too. Different feel since the tip and tail rocker are relatively short, and there is plenty of camber underfoot. Makes me curious about the Remedy 102.

 

[santacruz skier]

Great write up. I'm older and around your size (little taller and lighter).
Interested in Nordica Santa Ana in 153 and k2 remedy 102 in similar size. My Saffron 7's are 162, Sambas are 152, and older Kenjas 149 ( non rockered).
Was told I wouldn't like Black Pearl but why not?

 

[VickiK]

Thx, @marzNC . Just curious, what's the widest ski waist you like, of the skis you've been on?

 

[marzNC]

Thx, @marzNC . Just curious, what's the widest ski waist you like, of the skis you've been on?

Last April at Alta, I went out on two fat skis. The first was the K2 Remedy 117, 159cm, during the afternoon when there was 8-10 inches of fresh powder in the morning. I had the Cham107, 166cm, in the morning out on Catherine's (short hike, untracked). Since I knew I would be taking it easier after lunch, I asked for something wide that would also hold on groomers. The Remedy 117 certainly was good on packed powder groomers. Now the Remedy line includes 92, 102, 112.

For the 4/15/15 dump (25" in the morning, 12" more during the day), I went with the Rossi Savory 7, 106 underfoot, 162cm, in the morning. Wasn't enough. After lunch I took out the Armada VJJ, 115mm, 165cm. Liked the VJJ enough that I also used them the next morning.

For a powder lesson at Alta this season, there was 12-14 inches of fresh the day before. My instructor preferred that I rent skis around 100mm. I got my favorite, the DPS Nina 99, 158cm. Now DPS has the Zelda 106 Foundation, which I tried for a day at Snowbird. Great in deep soft snow, but the Nina 99 is better for me when I'm also going to end up on groomers.

 

[VickiK]

Thanks, @marz

 

[marzNC]

Great write up. I'm older and around your size (little taller and lighter).
Interested in Nordica Santa Ana in 153 and k2 remedy 102 in similar size. My Saffron 7's are 162, Sambas are 152, and older Kenjas 149 ( non rockered).
Was told I wouldn't like Black Pearl but why not?

Thanks. Always helps me remember my impressions if I write things down.

The Santa Ana 93 at 161 was definitely too long for me on groomers. They didn't have a shorter length. The tips are so rockered that they flapped a lot on the groomers. Can see why they could be good in crud or soft snow.

Since you like the Saffron 7's, you might like the BPs. My impression is that usually skiers who like Volkl Kenjas don't like the BP much. When I started demo'ing several years ago, I couldn't bend any Volkl enough for them to work well at all. Now I can get Volkl skis to turn but it's more work compared to softer skis so they are never likely to end up on a To Buy or To Rent list for me.

How did you decide to get the Samba at 152?

 

[VickiK]

I rented a powder ski at Powder Mountain during Diva West a few years ago. It had a width of 115, and I couldn't bend those things for the life of me, meaning I could not put it on its edge. I had trouble initiating a turn and used a weight shift to smooosh a turn. It felt like 2 planks attached to my boots. That's why I was curious what width you liked best, @marzNC . You're a little shorter and much lighter than I am. It seems you're fine on a ski like the DPS (99) and the VJJ (116). So in thinking back to my uncomfortable experience, it could be my skill level, leg strength, that particular ski, or some combo thereof. This is on my mind because I'm considering buying a pair of wider skis, and whether to choose a wider all-mountain ski (e.g. Samba, Aura) or a true powder ski (e.g. DPS Nina).

 

[santacruz skier]

@marzNC typically I don't demo unless looking /thinking about getting new skis. Demoed the Samba 152 2 years ago for 3 days. Then last year demoed the Saffron 7 162. BF has the Soul 7 and said how light it was.. Anyhow decided to purchase Rossis. Also was told by 2 demo shops if you like the Kenjas ( I have 2012's) that I would not like the black Pearl. So a few weeks ago the demo shop had the Sambas for $300. Heavy bindings I just replaced w marker squires ($280 binding for $119 on ski essentials). But my good friend who is in her early 70's and an expert aggressive skier told me she demoed the Black Pearls in Crested Butte and really liked them. The ski shop told her they were nor getting good feedback about the sambas. She also loved DPS99 or ninas? Did you try sambas or saffron?

 

[santacruz skier]

I rented a powder ski at Powder Mountain during Diva West a few years ago. It had a width of 115, and I couldn't bend those things for the life of me, meaning I could not put it on its edge. I had trouble initiating a turn and used a weight shift to smooosh a turn. It felt like 2 planks attached to my boots. That's why I was curious what width you liked best, @marzNC . You're a little shorter and much lighter than I am. It seems you're fine on a ski like the DPS (99) and the VJJ (116). So in thinking back to my uncomfortable experience, it could be my skill level, leg strength, that particular ski, or some combo thereof. This is on my mind because I'm considering buying a pair of wider skis, and whether to choose a wider all-mountain ski (e.g. Samba, Aura) or a true powder ski (e.g. DPS Nina).

@VickiK What about the Nordica Santa Ana? @marzNC I want to try the Nordica Santa Ana 100 cm in a 153. Yesterday when I picked up my skis saw the shop had them.. Seems in Tahoe no one skis a width less than 90. Tons of Kenjas at Northstar ..

 

[marzNC]

I rented a powder ski at Powder Mountain during Diva West a few years ago. It had a width of 115, and I couldn't bend those things for the life of me, meaning I could not put it on its edge. I had trouble initiating a turn and used a weight shift to smooosh a turn. It felt like 2 planks attached to my boots. That's why I was curious what width you liked best, @marzNC . You're a little shorter and much lighter than I am. It seems you're fine on a ski like the DPS (99) and the VJJ (116). So in thinking back to my uncomfortable experience, it could be my skill level, leg strength, that particular ski, or some combo thereof. This is on my mind because I'm considering buying a pair of wider skis, and whether to choose a wider all-mountain ski (e.g. Samba, Aura) or a true powder ski (e.g. DPS Nina).

What I've learned this season is that as my technique improved, I don't need as much width underfoot to have fun in powder. I skied 14 inches of fresh at Alta in late Jan on my BPs, 88mm, because the canyon road was closed and the Alta Ski Shop wasn't open first thing in the morning. Later that trip, I used the BPs at Snowmass for a run down Hanging Valley in steep trees than had pretty deep snow left from powder storm a day or two before.

Always knew it was possible to ski all-mountain skis in deep powder because ski buddy Bill does it all the time. A couple weeks ago he was skiing thigh deep, untracked, powder at Snowbird with a couple friends on his RTM 84 skis.

Pic of Bill at Snowbird from the friend's trip report:



I stuck to groomers that morning because I was really tired from not sleeping for the first couple nights at 8000 ft. Did the Snowbird free mountain host tour and got a better sense of the frontside. Had the DPS Zelda 106, which were pretty good on the groomers and fun in the afternoon in the powder left over on the blacks off the Baby Thunder lift.

 

[contesstant]

I rented a powder ski at Powder Mountain during Diva West a few years ago. It had a width of 115, and I couldn't bend those things for the life of me, meaning I could not put it on its edge. I had trouble initiating a turn and used a weight shift to smooosh a turn. It felt like 2 planks attached to my boots. That's why I was curious what width you liked best, @marzNC . You're a little shorter and much lighter than I am. It seems you're fine on a ski like the DPS (99) and the VJJ (116). So in thinking back to my uncomfortable experience, it could be my skill level, leg strength, that particular ski, or some combo thereof. This is on my mind because I'm considering buying a pair of wider skis, and whether to choose a wider all-mountain ski (e.g. Samba, Aura) or a true powder ski (e.g. DPS Nina).

I'd get the Santa Ana 100 and call it good! I got mine out in legit powder today, and they are FUN! They kind of have a similar feel to the BP's but yet are VERY turny, and easy to turn, way more forgiving in the cut up stuff than the Sambas. Yet, as things got tracked out and, being spring, quickly turned to concrete, they were fun on that, too. Really surprised to hear that @marzNC felt that the 161's were too long in the 93, because others have felt the 93's ski even shorter than the 100's. I wonder if mounting them a bit forward would have helped her. (I'm pondering mounting mine a couple cm forward, but will ski them more next year first, since they are mounted with non-demo bindings.)

 

[VickiK]

The Santa Ana's are on my radar too. I should draw up a short list.

 

[surfsnowgirl]

@VickiK What about the Nordica Santa Ana? @marzNC I want to try the Nordica Santa Ana 100 cm in a 153. Yesterday when I picked up my skis saw the shop had them.. Seems in Tahoe no one skis a width less than 90. Tons of Kenjas at Northstar ..

I was just curious why you went with 162 with your saffrons but 153 with your sambas. Are the saffrons that much more rockered. The Santa Ana is pretty rockered in the tip and IMO skis short so would you try the 161 also for comparison.

 

[vanhoskier]

I'm taller and weigh a lot more than marzNC, but I too have discovered that the newer K2's are quite a fun ski. I ended up getting this year's FulLUVit, which is 98 underfoot instead of next year's 95. Despite being on the softer side, it holds a very respectable edge on groomers and is super manueverable, poppy, and fun in soft snow. One doesn't have to be a lightweight to enjoy the new K2's. :-)

I think more Divas should check them out!

Even though marzNC is petite, I think all the skis reviewed here (Heads, K2's, Nordicas, Atomics)....can be loved by skiers of all sizes.

Incidentally, I checked out the Santa Ana and there's too much tip rocker for my taste. (Western skiers would feel differently). I do own the La Nina which is 113 underfoot, and that is a VERY fun ski, but purely a Western ski. That one is rockered at the tip and tail, resembling a twin tip.

 

[santacruz skier]

I was just curious why you went with 162 with your saffrons but 153 with your sambas. Are the saffrons that much more rockered. The Santa Ana is pretty rockered in the tip and IMO skis short so would you try the 161 also for comparison.

Saffrons ski very short and rockered. Also 162 was the shortest length made. Sambas do not ski short so at my height and weight are perfect ... I love them and find them very easy to ski in Tahoe . I know many other divas do not agree with me except @WaterGirl who also skis in California .. I would try the 153 in Santa Ana unless contact point is low like the Saffrons. Remember I am 5'1 and 102...but after changing bindings on Sambas, I just had a blast and skiing very fast today. Mostly very good skiers on runs today so that helps with speed..

 

[santacruz skier]

What I've learned this season is that as my technique improved, I don't need as much width underfoot to have fun in powder. I skied 14 inches of fresh at Alta in late Jan on my BPs, 88mm, because the canyon road was closed and the Alta Ski Shop wasn't open first thing in the morning. Later that trip, I used the BPs at Snowmass for a run down Hanging Valley in steep trees than had pretty deep snow left from powder storm a day or two before.

Always knew it was possible to ski all-mountain skis in deep powder because ski buddy Bill does it all the time. A couple weeks ago he was skiing thigh deep, untracked, powder at Snowbird with a couple friends on his RTM 84 skis.

Pic of Bill at Snowbird from the friend's trip report:

View attachment 5452

I stuck to groomers that morning because I was really tired from not sleeping for the first couple nights at 8000 ft. Did the Snowbird free mountain host tour and got a better sense of the frontside. Had the DPS Zelda 106, which were pretty good on the groomers and fun in the afternoon in the powder left over on the blacks off the Baby Thunder lift.

Hanging valley is double black .. BF and I skied it last time at snowmass.. Did a bit of falling leaf in some sections on my k2 lotta luvs !!! Yes quite steep!

 

[surfsnowgirl]

Saffrons ski very short and rockered. Also 162 was the shortest length made. Sambas do not ski short so at my height and weight are perfect ... I love them and find them very easy to ski in Tahoe . I know many other divas do not agree with me except @WaterGirl who also skis in California .. I would try the 153 in Santa Ana unless contact point is low like the Saffrons. Remember I am 5'1 and 102...but after changing bindings on Sambas, I just had a blast and skiing very fast today. Mostly very good skiers on runs today so that helps with speed..

Glad you are having a blast on the sambas. I wasn't questioning your judgement. The Santa Ana also has a big ol tip rocker and skis short so i was just curious is all as to the lengths you picked.

No worries, keep having fun. Yes these ladies are a bad influence arent they i used to think one pair of skis would be enough......

 

[santacruz skier]

Glad you are having a blast on the sambas. I wasn't questioning your judgement. The Santa Ana also has a big ol tip rocker and skis short so i was just curious is all as to the lengths you picked.

No worries, keep having fun. Yes these ladies are a bad influence arent they i used to think one pair of skis would be enough......

I didn't think you were questioning my judgement.. Yeah those skis are 10 cm different so good question. Remembering I used to ski on skinny 183's in the 90's..

 

[marzNC]

@marzNC typically I don't demo unless looking /thinking about getting new skis. Demoed the Samba 152 2 years ago for 3 days. Then last year demoed the Saffron 7 162. BF has the Soul 7 and said how light it was.. Anyhow decided to purchase Rossis. Also was told by 2 demo shops if you like the Kenjas ( I have 2012's) that I would not like the black Pearl. So a few weeks ago the demo shop had the Sambas for $300. Heavy bindings I just replaced w marker squires ($280 binding for $119 on ski essentials). But my good friend who is in her early 70's and an expert aggressive skier told me she demoed the Black Pearls in Crested Butte and really liked them. The ski shop told her they were nor getting good feedback about the sambas. She also loved DPS99 or ninas? Did you try sambas or saffron?

I was on the Samba at 166cm last year the afternoon after the 4/15 dump of 37". Demo'd the Saffron at 162cm at the 2015 Alta Demo Day when it was pretty much a groomer day. In general, I like any Rossi so wasn't a surprise that I liked both of them. I tend to skip over Rossi at a demo day because I know any Rossi ski would be fine to rent.

I checked out the Kenja at 156cm for the first time at a Mid-Atlantic demo day. I've become strong enough and skilled enough to make turns on the Kenja on groomers (only terrain available), but definitely takes more work than with a softer ski. I would never buy a Volkl.