Spring skiing advice... mushy, crusty, snow

[Sheena]

After skiing this weekend, I realized that I have to learn to ski a completely new type of conditions on the slopes - crusty, mushy, spring snow. I attempted to ski some of the fresh powder that fell Wednesday and Thursday night, which had become crusty and heavy and mushy. At one point, I made one turn, but got stuck in the crust, and could not for the life of me make my skis turn in the other direction. I ended up getting frustrated, which did lead us to try skiing the trees were there was some nice soft powder.

In my mind, I know I should just power through it, but somehow my skis did not get the message. Now, any tips to help me get over this hurdle?

I also know that most of my problems are 95% mental, which makes we put on the breaks quite a bit.

 

[Pequenita]

I know this sounds weird, but have you noticed your boots fitting/functioning differently in the warmer conditions? I found that with my ill-fitting boots, which only increase in sloppiness when they warm up, I'm overflexing (or otherwise just wasting energy) and need a lot more muscle to transfer the power needed to slice through crud/mush. Just a thought. Or it could be just me.

 

[SueNJ]

I know this sounds weird, but have you noticed your boots fitting/functioning differently in the warmer conditions? I found that with my ill-fitting boots, which only increase in sloppiness when they warm up, I'm overflexing (or otherwise just wasting energy) and need a lot more muscle to transfer the power needed to slice through crud/mush. Just a thought. Or it could be just me.

Funny you should mention this--my afternoons in Utah ended up like this most days because the ungroomed (mostly tracked up) stuff got heavier and gloppier as the day warmed up. It was exhausting! As a result, I'm being fitted for Intuition liners this Friday in VT. I was amazed at how sloppy my boots got in the afternoons, and trying to tighten them down just created painful pressure points. We used some moleskin to take up some of the space on either side of my feet, but it really didn't fix the problem enough.

 

[MaryLou]

I'm a mush-lover lol. But I used to hate it. So I feel your pain.

Unfortunately, I'm horrible at describing technique, and it's been nearly a year since I've had much time in mush (unfortunately, still hard fast packed powder/crust here). So I'm not sure I can explain it to you until I try it again.

BUT...you have to put more weight forward than normal. Unnaturally forward I think. All I know is once you 'get' it, it is not exhausting at all. Instead...I find the weight of the snow actually slows me down. In fast/hard conditions I spend so much energy trying to slow down, but in the glop I find it slows me down with little effort. I suggest you try moving your weight around to try to balance your skis differently until you find the perfect stance/sweet spot - I have to do this with every type of condition to get my body to remember how to move - you cannot use one stance for all conditions.

Spring snow piles up into mounds. You cannot ever plan to move a mound, you have to bump off it and let it absorb your speed, and then go for the next. I wish I could describe it. But once you get it, it's sweet...b/c you can then enjoy it and the sunshine...and the empty slopes.

 

[Sheena]

I know this sounds weird, but have you noticed your boots fitting/functioning differently in the warmer conditions? I found that with my ill-fitting boots, which only increase in sloppiness when they warm up, I'm overflexing (or otherwise just wasting energy) and need a lot more muscle to transfer the power needed to slice through crud/mush. Just a thought. Or it could be just me.

My problem was more I either glided on top of the crust, or barely broke through, or I had one ski break through the top layer of crust and the other glided on top, which set me off balance. I am sure I am doing something wrong... the crud I have learned to deal with, however, this really fairly heavy crusty stuff. GAH!

 

[MaryLou]

My problem was more I either glided on top of the crust, or barely broke through, or I had one ski break through the top layer of crust and the other glided on top, which set me off balance. I am sure I am doing something wrong... the crud I have learned to deal with, however, this really fairly heavy crusty stuff. GAH!

Heavy crust...different than heavy mush lol. Not as fun, and I have yet to find an easy way around it (besides avoidance). You figured out what you can't do - let your skis go 2 different ways, so you have to concentrate on keeping your legs parallel and close. Someone will correct me if I'm wrong - but I have 30 years experience on stick skis and 5 on shaped, and I know with the shaped skis you aren't supposed to be so parallel/close (or something...haven't studied it) - but in bumps/crud if you let your skis separate much, there's a chance they'll go 2 different ways, and you're doomed. Doesn't happen to me on groomers, just bumps and crud. I tried de-crusting a nice spot that was covering some soft powder (typical NE snow/rain/freeze event) a month ago...man...that was tough. Gave up after about 10 turns...lol...and that had powder underneath, not heavy stuff.

 

[CMCM]

Yesterday was my first day this season on the mushy soft stuff....I definitely did better than last year, when I was catching edges all over the place due to my wedgy type turns I was doing then. What I discovered yesterday was that this mushy snow was somehow forcing me back too much.....I don't know why, because I haven't had this problem at all this year until yesterday...and I realized I had to REALLY get down low and stay there to be more solid and forward than previously. MaryLou (above) is right about having to get almost unnaturally forward. My first long run really tired me out...especially my ankles....but then I stayed well forward and it got easier again and I didn't tire out like before when I was more upright. My boots were also feeling sloppy for some reason. I hated conditions in the beginning of the day, but more or less adapted as the day progressed. However, I found myself skiing slower and more carefully than before. I really prefer COLD middle of winter skiing for the snow quality you get then!!

 

[Gina23]

I'm a mush-lover lol. But I used to hate it. So I feel your pain.

I'm this way this year... last year I even made a post on her (one of my first) asking "how in the heck do I ski in those mashed taters?"

And there is one thing that stuck out to me, I think Wendy is the one that said it that I still think of to this day when I'm skiing that surface, you have to be 60/40 on your downhill/uphill ski instead of 70/30 like normal.

So whoever told me that, it worked. And just keep skiing it... you'll get it. Make sure you are letting your skis do the turning and not your legs. It's a weird feeling, but it will come. Trust your skis, they'll bust through that junk.

As far as the hard pack stuff, I have no advice, engage your edges and hold on to your britches!

 

[lisaski]

Hi Sheena,

I resonate with MaryLou above. That crust with soft snow beneath that you either break through or can ski on top of is "death snow". I have not found a good way to ski it other than making kick turns. I would avoid it. Really, is it worth risking injury to ski bad snow like that?

Lisa

 

[CMCM]

Hi Sheena,

I resonate with MaryLou above. That crust with soft snow beneath that you either break through or can ski on top of is "death snow". I have not found a good way to ski it other than making kick turns. I would avoid it. Really, is it worth risking injury to ski bad snow like that?

Lisa

I agree....there comes a point where I feel uneasy and it's tiriing and not so fun.....when I start worrying about risking injury in the stuff, time to stop!

 

[tradygirl]

The secret to spring skiing is not how to ski the crappy snow, but how to sniff out the good snow! Learn the art of aspect-chasing.

If the temps dropped below freezing at night and skies were clear, you should be able to find some nice re-crystallized powder on all northeast to northwest aspects. Hunt those stashes out before the sun gets too high. One the sun starts hitting stuff, you need to keep a close eye on things - ski the aspects that are sheltered from the sun early in the day first (west, northwest). East and south-facing will get sun-affected quickly. Just keep chasing the north aspect dial throughout the day until everything turns to mush (then call it a day and drink a beer on the patio in the sun ). If you still haven't had enough, remember that groomers are extremely skiable even after being sun-affected for a while - just watch for the dreaded shade-sun transistions that will put the brakes on unexpectedly.

Sadly, most ski resorts are north-facing and close before true corn snow can develop. There needs to be a nice long warm streak with cold nights to allow a large part of the upper snowpack to melt and refreeze over and over. Sometimes you can find some good south-facing aspects inbounds that will corn up in early April (like Mineral Basin at Snowbird). If you do find corn conditions, you want to do the opposite - chase the sun! Corn will be boilerplate hard in the morning and you need to bide your time waiting for the east aspects to warm up. Usually you have a good hour or two on one aspect before it gets too gloppy. Move to the south-facing and the west-facing aspects as they warm up throughout the day.

If any of you local girls want a true corn tour this year, I'd be happy to show you the goods. I might be back on my skis as early as April 19 and I'd love to get out as much as possible. We have TONS of snow, so corn season should be nice and long if the nights continue to stay cold into May. BTW - corn season skinning is much easier than skinning in powder. It's like walking on a sidewalk, albeit a steep sidewalk.

 

[altagirl]

That's pretty much what I was thinking. While yes - keeping your feet together as a platform might help a bit in skiing breakable crust - the bigger key is to learn to avoid that snow.

I've asked pro skier coaches about death crust or situations where there are nasty ice bumps you cant see due to zero visibility or dust on crust and the answer is.... "don't ski it!" Yes, there are a handful of techniques for getting out of it in one piece, but the real key is to learn which aspects will have better snow, or what time of day is going to have softened things up on certain slopes, or where the fresh snow might be hidden in the trees or shade, or where the wind buffed things out...

 

[MaryLou]

The secret to spring skiing is not how to ski the crappy snow, but how to sniff out the good snow! Learn the art of aspect-chasing.

If the temps dropped below freezing at night and skies were clear, you should be able to find some nice re-crystallized powder on all northeast to northwest aspects. Hunt those stashes out before the sun gets too high. One the sun starts hitting stuff, you need to keep a close eye on things - ski the aspects that are sheltered from the sun early in the day first (west, northwest). East and south-facing will get sun-affected quickly. Just keep chasing the north aspect dial throughout the day until everything turns to mush (then call it a day and drink a beer on the patio in the sun ). If you still haven't had enough, remember that groomers are extremely skiable even after being sun-affected for a while - just watch for the dreaded shade-sun transistions that will put the brakes on unexpectedly.

Sadly, most ski resorts are north-facing and close before true corn snow can develop. There needs to be a nice long warm streak with cold nights to allow a large part of the upper snowpack to melt and refreeze over and over. Sometimes you can find some good south-facing aspects inbounds that will corn up in early April (like Mineral Basin at Snowbird). If you do find corn conditions, you want to do the opposite - chase the sun! Corn will be boilerplate hard in the morning and you need to bide your time waiting for the east aspects to warm up. Usually you have a good hour or two on one aspect before it gets too gloppy. Move to the south-facing and the west-facing aspects as they warm up throughout the day.

If any of you local girls want a true corn tour this year, I'd be happy to show you the goods. I might be back on my skis as early as April 19 and I'd love to get out as much as possible. We have TONS of snow, so corn season should be nice and long if the nights continue to stay cold into May. BTW - corn season skinning is much easier than skinning in powder. It's like walking on a sidewalk, albeit a steep sidewalk.

It's so funny to hear about spring skiing conditions outside of New England. Ahhh... you said "There needs to be a nice long warm streak with cold nights to allow a large part of the upper snowpack to melt and refreeze over and over. " Here, it's been thawing and refreezing since January lol...after getting tons of snow, there was a good rain in late Jan. (I think). Then some more snow. Then in Feb. (our kids' vacation) it snowed, then rained good for a day (I got out that day after it stopped and before it froze...awesome soft wet snow) and then was cold and windy for 3 more straight days. Then some snow..then some rain... By now the mountain is pretty much solid crust - the 6" they get every now and then just doesn't stick around forever or gets groomed into crust. Even woods were getting crusty.

We are so ripe for an awesome spring season - just has to warm up a bit more - still real cold at night. My mt is supposed to close on April 27...but I haven't had a day of spring skiing yet...wah... at least the snow is being nicely preserved, hopefully it doesn't start softening up on April 26 lol...I'm tired of groomed crust.