Question: Have a say in my future! Where should we move?

[ikkin]

Hiya ladies!

Did a quick search and I've been following the "are you happy where you are?" thread but I haven't found exactly what I'm looking for.

Long story short, hubby and I have been talking about moving back to a mountain town for awhile now, and things are finally falling into place in a way that will make that possible. It's looking like my new job will let me live wherever I want as long as it has an airport nearby. Hubby will do whatever- he works in the lumber industry (sales) right now but doesn't really want to do that long term.

So here's what we want, in rough order of importance:

1. A mountain town with some culture and charm
2. Within an hour of a decent airport...I will need to fly to the east coast relatively cheaply on a regular basis
3. Relatively affordable...aka...not Aspen. The next up and coming spot would be perfect, of course. We do want to have a family someday...
4. West of the Mississippi, east of California/Washington
5. Not too big (Salt Lake), but not too small (Warren, VT) either
6. Excellent backcountry skiing, and/or stellar resort skiing within 45 minutes

To give you an idea, here's what's on our list so far:
1. Bozeman (or maybe Livingston?)
2. Jackson (only because we both love it. We might suck up the expense for the skiing)
2. Driggs, ID (a bit small, but growing)
3. Whitefish, MT (are the mountains too small? I want rocky peaks!)
4. Crested Butte/Gunnison?

Any spots we're overlooking/forgetting? Thanks you guys! We feel so blessed to be in this position and want to make sure we end up in the right spot...can't wait to hear your suggesstions...

 

[ski diva]

Omigod, the world is your oyster! I have no suggestions, but I just wanted to comment about how much everyone here will envy you.

 

[Gloria]

All are great places to live, but...check the number of days you can actually fly out of the airports in the winter. Fog grounds alot of flights in Montana. FWIW Whitefish is pretty much the same region as Glacier National park, no lack of rocky peaks, but I think Kalispell regional has or had alot of winter groundings. Some have added fog reduction systems have no idea what that consists of or even if they work. Bozeman/Jackson/Driggs are on the other side of the divide and don't get as much fog so may be more viable options.

 

[oragejuice]

My vote is for Crested Butte. I've heard fantastic things about the town. Would be totally jealous if you moved there.

 

[alta_gal83]

Nothing out of the airport at Jackson is cheap ....

 

[sibhusky]

All are great places to live, but...check the number of days you can actually fly out of the airports in the winter. Fog grounds alot of flights in Montana. FWIW Whitefish is pretty much the same region as Glacier National park, no lack of rocky peaks, but I think Kalispell regional has or had alot of winter groundings. Some have added fog reduction systems have no idea what that consists of or even if they work. Bozeman/Jackson/Driggs are on the other side of the divide and don't get as much fog so may be more viable options.

While we definitely have fog, we either have so many fog delays the paper never reports them or we don't have that many.

The Northern Rockies are lower than the Colorado Rockies. Because of that, altitude adaptation is easier. We also are normally skiing BELOW tree line, which means that tree skiing is the "thing to do". The snow quality is lighter on average in Colorado, but we have less sun, which means our snow lasts a good long time without getting heavier.

There are few ski resorts in Colorado with home prices still sort of reasonable.

On the other hand, we're pretty far from an interstate so that causes a lack of contact with economies outside the Flathead Valley. This impacts job availability, as you won't want to commute to Missoula or Spokane from here.

We used to be a timber economy so there are a lot of unemployed loggers these days.

Whitefish is small, but the county is the fastest (or sometimes 2nd fastest) growing county in Montana. The other county is Gallatin down by Bozeman. Bozeman is FAR FAR FAR more built up than Whitefish. BUT, you have a university there so there is more "culture". We have several theater companies in the area, but they're not Broadway.

Skiing is CLOSE. The airport is CLOSE. The train is CLOSE.

The town of Whitefish itself is about 7500 people, but the county is up to 86,000, with a density of 17 people per square mile. The median county income is somewhere in the $40k's.
https://www.kalispell.com/downloads/Local%20Quick%20Facts%209-08.pdf
The cost of living index is 90.0 (less than average, U.S. average is 100)
The demographics are overwhelmingly WHITE, with Native Americans being the next biggest racial group at 2%. If you come from an urban area, this may take some getting used to. The median age is 39. https://www.city-data.com/county/Flathead_County-MT.html

We seem to have a LOT of crime related to drinking issues based on my reading of the Police Blotter. https://www.clrsearch.com/RSS/Demographics/MT/Whitefish/59937/Crime_Statistics As you can see, lots of fights...

 

[pinto]

Durango CO
Sandpoint ID
Steamboat CO

Don't know how "stellar" the skiing is at Purgatory or Schweitzer, but I know people who love those places.

 

[Lola]

Have you thought about Ogden, UT? SnoBasin ski area is real close to town, and you can catch a train in less than an hour, directly to the Salt Lake City airport. Low cost of living, and the town is in the midst of a major renovation and investment, so real estate is relatively cheap right now and should appreciate well. SnoBasin also has plans to build a gondola right from the center of town directly to the top of the mountain. Plus, many ski industry manufacturers (Salomon, Descante, Atomic, suunto, etc.) are relocating there, so I am pretty sure there would be some good sales jobs for hubby.

 

[abc]

Park City? Not cheap but not Aspen either.

 

[ikkin]

thanks everyone for the input!! durango and steamboat are definitely on the list. not sure about Sandpoint only because I've heard sad things about arayan nation activity up there. But that could just be a rumor.

sibhusky, thanks for the GREAT info about whitefish. do you like living there?

any other places? we're also thinking of silevrton, CO. although silverton is a long way from ANYTHING....

fun exersize, eh?

 

[sibhusky]

thanks everyone for the input!! durango and steamboat are definitely on the list. not sure about Sandpoint only because I've heard sad things about arayan nation activity up there. But that could just be a rumor.

sibhusky, thanks for the GREAT info about whitefish. do you like living there?

Yes, everything is close except box stores. I have to confess that, given my injury rate lately and my problems with my dogs' health over the last two years, I've started to worry a bit about access to quality health care. I think that my orthopedic surgeon is fine, but I notice reading the papers that a fair number of people end up getting flown to Seattle for some stuff. Also, for two dogs I've had to go to Spokane (cataract operation) and Pullman, WA (congenital heart disease) for veterinary specialists. I think that INJURY-related stuff there are TONS of people here, probably due to the active lifestyle. But what about if I get something horrid like Parkinsons? That sort of thing could be an issue down the line.

Aside from that, the size of the town has its positives/negatives, namely everyone knows everyone. Coming from New Jersey where there is just an ocean of people and comments made to someone about another person are unlikely to ever get back, here it is way different. But, it's nice to walk downtown and run into person after person you know. And, it's not like you have to dress because of that. I've run into someone in Safeway wearing a coat and bedroom slippers.....(not me, them). Where I live, you can have a chat with the UPS guy who stops to talk while you're walking the dog and end up "blocking traffic" (only there isn't any the last half mile) while you get caught up. Everyone USED to wave at each other as I drove up and down the hill, but that is rare now as the road gets more newcomers. We personally are surrounded by Stoltze lumber and School Trust land, a little 80 acre island of seven homeowners on a dirt road, so it's nice and quiet. And "downtown Whitefish" is about 12-15 minutes, the ski area is 16 minutes. As long as Stoltze doesn't sell, it's perfect. Things could go downhill in the next 10 years though, so thank goodness for a real estate slump!

 

[geargrrl]

not sure about Sandpoint only because I've heard sad things about arayan nation activity up there. But that could just be a rumor.

I can answer this one. It's really old news.
First thing to remember is that there are white supremacist wackos everywhere, you just hear about them more in some places that others. You catch the news the other day about the guys who were going to decapitate people of color in I think it was Tennessee?

That being said, yes the Aryan Nations used to have HQ near Coeur d'Alene but that was close to 15 years ago. One of Butler's thugs went after a Native American mother and son, and the subsequent lawsuit bankrupted the Aryan Nation to the tune of 6 million dollars. The compound was sold and now is the the HQ for Kootenai County Human Rights Organization. There has been an incredible community response to the negative publicity created by the whole Aryan Nations things - it was huge black brush, and made people forget that they are everywhere, not just where the news media is telling you. What is left of the Aryan Nation moved to Pennslyvania after they were bankrupted and the leader Butler died.

Here's an example of community response: Many years ago, the AN pushed it's constitutional right to free speech by wanting to have a parade in CDA. Legally they had to let them have it. Last time it was held ( maybe 15+ years ago) there was a region wide Lemons to Lemonade drive: led by a local human right organization, there was a pledge drive to raise money. For every minute the Nazis paraded, it raised money for human rights. So the longer they paraded, the more the community raised. Something like $35,000 was raised that day.

I guess the short answer is, it's an old story. Come on up to the Pacific Northwest.

gg

 

[ikkin]

great info GG, thanks!

 

[pinto]

any other places? we're also thinking of silevrton, CO. although silverton is a long way from ANYTHING....

Yes, my brother and his family live in Silverton. They drive a lot. Except when they are there, then they don't drive at all. :D

It's very small, about 400 year-round residents, but it has a very active community. It's a neat little place, but it is somewhat isolated (if you don't drive a lot). They have music festivals and parades and lots of other activities that the whole town turns out for. It's pretty idyllic that way.

The mountains couldn't be prettier. I don't think you can find better alpine scenery anywhere in the lower 48. TONS of backcountry access is nearby in the San Juans, plus of course Silverton Mtn is right there, Purgatory is an hour away, and there is also a small municipal hill in town (Kendall Mtn, which recently replaced the rope tow with a double chair). 950 vertical feet, baby!

They do most of their shopping in Montrose (there are groceries in Silverton, but they are very expensive). Box stores are available in Montrose, too. I think it's a little more than an hour to Montrose, except during weather: you have to go over Red Mtn Pass that way, and it does close often, because it's hairy; if it's not closed, you still want to go nice and sloooooow.

You did say Warren VT was too small, and Silverton is quite a bit smaller than Warren. Actually, my cousin and his family live in Warren, if you need any more info ... ha: what's with my family and "authentic" ski towns ... the weirdest thing is that my mother has a cousin (a first cousin, but not one she'd seen in a while) who already lived in Silverton when my brother moved there. He is an artist rather than a miner or mountaineer. (Those are the three groups, roughly speaking.)

This is the view from my brother's house on Christmas morning (also the town sled hill), a view of town from Kendall, and a photo in fall:

 

[Christy]

WOW that is pretty!

 

[tradygirl]

Might be a little too small, but what about Ouray, CO? It's close to Telluride and Silverton, about 2 hours away from Grand Junction (and an airport, Costco). Ouray's small enough that it's probably still affordable. The backcountry is plentiful, and the ice climbing is SWEEEEET if you're into it (which you should be if you live there!). About 3 hours from Moab and 2 hours from Fruita if you're a mountain biker. 1.5 hours from Durango.

In terms of charm, the place is insanely quaint and inviting. The people are really nice and it's absolutely beautiful. The biggest drawback would be the size. Very small.

Other than that, Jackson has my vote.

 

[pinto]

Might be a little too small, but what about Ouray, CO? It's close to Telluride and Silverton, about 2 hours away from Grand Junction (and an airport, Costco). Ouray's small enough that it's probably still affordable. The backcountry is plentiful, and the ice climbing is SWEEEEET if you're into it (which you should be if you live there!). About 3 hours from Moab and 2 hours from Fruita if you're a mountain biker. 1.5 hours from Durango.

In terms of charm, the place is insanely quaint and inviting. The people are really nice and it's absolutely beautiful. The biggest drawback would be the size. Very small.

Other than that, Jackson has my vote.

Yeah, I think if I were to move down there, Ouray would probably be the place. It's just more accessible than Silverton (it's on the other side of Red Mountain Pass, so you can get to civilization more easily). And it's twice as big!

 

[slipnslide]

My daughter seriously considered Bozeman for college two years ago. She actually spent part of a summer working at a ranch nearby. The problem was the cost of air travel and the lack of nonstops to anywhere near where we lived on the east coast at the time. She had to make 2 connections to get to Charlotte. If you need to fly often, take a look at what's available out of the nearest airport on a travel site like Kayak.com.

Steamboat Springs would be my first choice but we have experienced delays every time we travelled there in the winter. Of course, we welcomed the bad weather after we arrived, so I guess it’s a double edged sword.

 

[Kano]

Is the Boise area too big? Skiing is close, so is the airport (I'm about ten minutes from the airport and can see the nearest ski area from my house) Season pass is a BARGAIN that seems to not be beaten anywhere, snow is good, and even on busy weekend afternoons, the lift lines move fast!

Probably lots of work for DH to pursue too, maybe even including timber!

Karen in Boise

 

[geargrrl]

From the sound of what she's looking for, I bet Boise is too big but McCall isn't. I was going to suggest Spokane for it's great proximity to skiing and other outdoors sports but I get the sense that a tiny ski town (10K or so) is what she's looking for, not a small great city. Boise and Spokane are very similar in population, climate and general feel, more or less.


What the heck, Spokane Washington. (county population, 450K, city proper 200K) 5 ski areas within 70 miles ranging from 25 miles to 70. Two are destination, three are more local/family type areas. The Powder Triangle of British Columbia is 2.5 hours away. Skiing is more affordable here than lots of places: you can still get a weekday pass for $30 at quite a few places. In the off season, hiking, whitewater and mountain biking opportunities abound. Of course, there is an airport. Housing is still affordable as we didn't have a bubble like many areas. Anyway, just a thought.

gg