Skiing in fresh powder

[altagirl]

The coaching I've had in recent years (mostly from professional freeskiers, but some from formal ski instructors) is the opposite of the "feet together to create a platform" school. The only time they advise that is if you're trying to stay on top of breakable crust, if you're trying to ski deep powder on skinny skis, or if you're zipperlining bumps.

For powder, crud, or anything else - if you are on fat skis, your feet should be shoulder width apart. It gives you much better balance and stability, especially if you're moving fast. And your legs should be working independently for balance - when you hit uneven patches of crud, one leg might be going up to absorb while the other is going down. If you're in nice smooth powder, obviously that isn't necessary, but the point is that they should be ready to move independently as necessary, not locked together in a platform (which makes you stiff).

Not that you can't ski powder with old school technique (obviously), but getting your feet apart makes you more balanced and you can ski faster and in better control. Every clinic I've been to in the last 5 years has been a chorus of "FEET APART!", especially to the people who learned to ski powder a long time ago.

 

[ski now work later]

Every clinic I've been to in the last 5 years has been a chorus of "FEET APART!", especially to the people who learned to ski powder a long time ago.

Since I only started skiing 5 years ago (whatever bits of skiing I did in the 60s, 70s, and 80s was mostly snowplowing as I never did get the "parallel" thing down on those long, straight boards), and my skis are 73-94 mm wide, I ski with a wider stance than most folks my age, and I find it really comfortable. I am pretty challenged in the bumps however and this is one place where I need my feet closer together and moving together, am working on that.

I sure hope I get some powder days in this year. Between skiing often in New England, and trips to Summit County and SLC, there's no guarantee but good odds I will!

 

[vernabee]

yeah i probably should have clarified that i was on narrower skis when i tried the close together technique...and had been frustrated with powder at that point since i had yet to demo true powder skis (which i did ski about shoulder length apart when i finally did and it was awesome!!)

i guess the issue i was having before was the "wayward" ski thing on the skinnier skis in powder. one would catch and want to go the other way while one would be somewhat stable... which i soon figured out was a problem with my weight distribution on the skis. so throwing the skis closer together with some give seemed to do a good job...

 

[altagirl]

yeah i probably should have clarified that i was on narrower skis when i tried the close together technique...and had been frustrated with powder at that point since i had yet to demo true powder skis (which i did ski about shoulder length apart when i finally did and it was awesome!!)

i guess the issue i was having before was the "wayward" ski thing on the skinnier skis in powder. one would catch and want to go the other way while one would be somewhat stable... which i soon figured out was a problem with my weight distribution on the skis. so throwing the skis closer together with some give seemed to do a good job...

It definitely helps if you're on skinnier skis. But with the rate everyone is moving to fatter skis (especially with the Aura club around here! ) I just wanted to clarify.

 

[pleen]

I agree wholly with AltaGirl, and the main thing being you need a little speed to help you get going BEFORE you start turning. Also with the wide stance, I liken my turning motion to more of a slight hop from foot to foot rather than any other actual turn initiation moves. Keep it subtle.

 

[Tammy]

Newbie to powder

And in DEEP powder, you can't ski the middle part of Ballroom (the open part well before the fenceline) at all - there are days where it is too deep to even straightline it (in the 30" range), even on superfat skis. You just get stuck.

Had an interesting experience today on similar terrain at Lost Trail (small and fun ski area in MT) where they have a green powder/ungroomed run called "Drifter." They had 8" of fresh snow today and figured that would be fun to experiment with.

I was pretty proud of myself for being able to stay upright most of the time in my short, flexible, tiny-waisted skis (146cm 113/70/109-- I'm 5ft even). Heck, I was even able to use the "magic X" with my poles to successfully get up when I fell. Eventually, I was able to get a nice, easy-going rhythm and gently bounce in the direction I wanted to go in. It was so much fun not having to exert much effort to turn and to just float . When I finally came to the groomed part of the run, it was a bit of a disappointment.

Think I became a little over-confident on my 3rd or 4th run on Drifter and then went into some untracked stuff that was flat-- I figured that I was going fast enough so what the heck. On my first attempt at a turn in that part of the run, my tips took a nosedive into some really deep and thick powder (about waist deep on me); I could not get up at all and had to crawl/dig myself out of that mess . It gave me a bit of an appreciation for what it must be like to sink in quicksand.

Despite the digging experience, it was still a pretty good day for me .

With this in mind, I realized that the other times I "floated" I was at least hitting a bottom where I could gently bounce into a turn. The snow there was anywhere from 8-12" deep in that part.

Other than taking a powder lesson (which is now on the "to-do" list), is it just wise to assume that untracked powder on a flatter slope is perhaps left untracked for a darned good reason? Any other tips?

Thanks so much in advance! I learn a lot every time I visit.

-T

 

[dloveski]

Other than taking a powder lesson (which is now on the "to-do" list), is it just wise to assume that untracked powder on a flatter slope is perhaps left untracked for a darned good reason?

Pretty important lesson that you learned here. And one that is learned the hard way, but never to be forgotten.

Any other tips?

Have fun and keep at it.

 

[loafer]

I have to say I agree whole heartedly with altagirl. I remember having trouble with powder in the infrequent maine snow. I also remember helpful (or not so helpful) tips that were yelled to me from the chair lift "Lean back, it'll help!" All leaning back does is wear you out faster.
Getting your "powdalegs" may take some time and practice but once you do you'll feel great.
I like to think about staying centered and two footed in the deeper stuff.

 

[altagirl]

Other than taking a powder lesson (which is now on the "to-do" list), is it just wise to assume that untracked powder on a flatter slope is perhaps left untracked for a darned good reason?

Pretty important lesson that you learned here. And one that is learned the hard way, but never to be forgotten.

Any other tips?

Have fun and keep at it.

Yep - I think everyone who has much powder experience has been right there with you. Soooo tempting, but sooooooooo much work to get yourself out of when you make a bad decision! It just takes some experience and you'll get a feel for it (and learn to check the runout too...)

 

[Skisailor]

Now I'm a bit confused, because I thought the bible of powder skiing was staying centered and being completely two footed. I also find that, without really thinking about it, my stance closes up in powder, so I'm not just two footed, my stance is narrower as well - almost as if my two skis are creating one platform.

But some in this thread have indicated they keep a wider stance and even bounce from foot to foot.

So what gives? Is that what really wide powder skis allow you to do?

Is the two-footed stance an older technique for skinnier skis?

 

[Sheena]

In cruddy snow this weekend, I found myself using my skis sort of like pedals - I also noticed that I started doing this in powder.

Is this similar to the single foot technique? Or perhaps this is the wrong way to do it?

I am excited to get more experience in powder this season - my experience at the Epic ski academy last year really gave me a lot of energy to start working harder on certain techniques, trails, etc.

 

[pinto]

Now I'm a bit confused, because I thought the bible of powder skiing was staying centered and being completely two footed. I also find that, without really thinking about it, my stance closes up in powder, so I'm not just two footed, my stance is narrower as well - almost as if my two skis are creating one platform.

But some in this thread have indicated they keep a wider stance and even bounce from foot to foot.

So what gives? Is that what really wide powder skis allow you to do?

Is the two-footed stance an older technique for skinnier skis?

I'm guessing so, but I don't really know. I know on skinnier skis, I ski with a narrower, more equal stance because it's too easy for one of my skis to go the wrong way while it's in/under the snow. I've not skied anything wider than 94, but I can keep my feet a little wider with them, but I still tend to be fairly narrow. I think with something wide and rockered, since your tips never go under, you can do whatever you want.

All this with caveat, I am no instructor or anything like that. I just know that if my tips are under the snow, I don't want them too far apart.

 

[altagirl]

Now I'm a bit confused, because I thought the bible of powder skiing was staying centered and being completely two footed. I also find that, without really thinking about it, my stance closes up in powder, so I'm not just two footed, my stance is narrower as well - almost as if my two skis are creating one platform.

But some in this thread have indicated they keep a wider stance and even bounce from foot to foot.

So what gives? Is that what really wide powder skis allow you to do?

Yes and no. YES - it's about staying centered, but that doesn't mean gluing your feet together, it means not getting out of balance forward or backwards, etc. YES - keep a wider stance - it gives you WAY better balance, and YES, that's what wider skis allow you to do. But NO - don't bounce foot to foot. You still want your weight fairly evenly distributed between both skis. The "bouncing" people are referring to is slight, and it's a touch of just up and down, not foot to foot.

Is the two-footed stance an older technique for skinnier skis?

No - two footed just means you're distributing your weight more evenly (not just putting all your weight on the downhill ski). Two footed still applies in powder. It's the narrow stance that doesn't apply anymore, unless you're skiing powder on skinny skis.

 

[Skisailor]

Thanks Altagirl!

That really helps alot. I've only ever skied powder up to about 14" and only ever on my Burnin' Luvs. With any luck, I'll get a chance to get into some powder on my Auras this year (can't wait! )and I will definitely stay two footed and centered, but now I won't be afraid to keep a wider stance.

Thanks!

 

[lynseyf]

so another question.....
I have just returned from a weeks off-piste instruction in Tignes in France which was great I felt like I was really getting it skiing shallower ungroomed slopes, about 25 degrees, but when I got on to a steep slope, about 30 degrees, I just lost it and felt like I had no control, was in the back seat etc etc. 30-35 degrees is probably about my steep comfort level on groomed slopes (yes I am a a bit of a wuss). If I was on a steep (to me) groomed slope I would do lots of short turns getting my skis right across the slope and kind of letting them slide a bit but basically just keep turning. However in ungroomed snow I know you have to be a bit more patient and not rush your turns so I don't think this would work .

On shallower ungroomed slopes I pointed my skis down the fall-line, let them build up a bit speed and then started my turns which flowed nicely and had some rhythm to them but if I did this on a steeper slope I think I would build up too much speed. so how do you control your speed on a steeper ungroomed slope, my instructor said to make bigger turns but I found I just got out of control in bigger turns and I was waiting too long to initiate the new one.

I'm 5'9 about 190lbs and was skiing 177cm Volkl Karmas which are 88mm underfoot if this helps

 

[ski diva]

Thought I'd revive this thread with a suggestion based on experience:

If at all possible, take a powder lesson.

We were fortunate enough to have a major dump during TheSkiDiva/NASTC clinic in Tahoe. I mean, in some places, we were skiing in mid-thigh powder (okay, I know I'm short. But it was deep.). Now, I know that powder is skiing Nirvana, but as an east coast skier, it's not something I encounter very often. Our instructor took the opportunity to teach us how to ski the stuff, and for me, it was truly valuable. So if you have the chance, do it. It can turn a day that's frustrating into one that's truly glorious.

 

[drjoyous]

Had another foot+ of powder yesterday in Tahoe... Glorious!!
I was never good at powder--all the reasons you cite above: the "tips" say opposing things ("lean back!" "don't lean back", "ski as you do everything else" and "ski with your feet together" and "ski with your feet apart" and "ski with your feet doing the same thing-like surfing" and "ski with your feet pedaling" until I was READY TO SCREAM!!!

On top of that, we have Tahoe powder, not blower powder--it is usually heavy and wet, although acts like "real"powder (Divas at this year's DivaDays will testify to our powder). But when it gets tracked out, it is either nice and scrunchy, or hard and wet.

I finally decided steeper really was better, speed was DEFINITELY the thing to keep my balance. I got wider boards (99 underfoot, and am looking for 116 4Frnt EHPs--anyone got any?), kept my balance over my feet, bent my legs, kept my feet something between "together" and "apart", moved them together like surfing and...it worked.

Then I had fun bouncing from powder puff to powder puff--I think the thing is to (a) perhaps take a lesson, but (b) do it and do it and do it until you figure out how YOU do it best. Listen to all the advice, try everything out, try try try to stay relaxed (that's key) and figure out what works best for you, your skis, your kinds of powder, and your style.

BTW, first run on the mountain yesterday we took a double-black diamond run, unmarked, through trees top to bottom.
l-o-v-e-d i-t.
keep at it. you will get it. if I could do it, anyone can. just don't give up.