My turn for Critique My Skiing

[Bluestsky]

A variation of this, the cause might be the same though, is skiing - like most of the time - on the outside ski. The inside ski is there 'just for the ride'. Learned this a long time ago from Lito-Flores. Shloppy drill, I think, is great to correct this.
And so we've hijacked @volklgirl thread completely.

 

[Skisailor]

I want to make sure I understand this. So, it is actually during the second half of the previous turn, my left turn, that I freak out and hunker down on the outside/right/downhill ski, which then makes it difficult to unedge it before the right turn?

[BTW, turns out I'm coming down with a migraine. That would definitely make me more prone to being scared.]

It's not necessarily bad to edge the downhill/outside ski toward the end of a turn (depends what turn radius/turn type you are shooting for). What I am talking about is the point when you want to start the new turn. At that moment - yes - you must release/flatten that downhill ski. Failure to do so creates the need to lift the inside ski. And a common thing that defeats our ability to flatten that ski is twisting or looking or tilting into the new turn. What I've learned is that we need to first look downhill and only that far. THEN finish the turn.

 

[bounceswoosh]

When my uphill / new inside hand is too far back - then I end up unable to flatten correctly and have to lift my inside leg. I'm sure that's because of what @Skisailor is describing - I have to use a twist to get going. This is an issue for me in bumps more than anywhere.

When you see someone who can initiate a turn on a dime from a complete stop on the top of a bump - that's someone who is releasing properly. Me, I try that and my edge catches, and there I am lifting my leg to avoid crossing my tips.

 

[bounceswoosh]

Also, I definitely defer to the instructors here on whether the Schlopy drill is useful for this issue. I feel like it does help me with tracking, but I may be dealing with a different set of proximal causes.

 

[Fluffy Kitty]

Me, I try that and my edge catches, and there I am lifting my leg to avoid crossing my tips.

That's probably the best description for what happens to me, and what @volklgirl is doing on the bumps, too. It might be that I'm releasing the edge fine, but swinging the ski around is proving difficult in cruddy heavy powder, which I think @volklgirl is also dealing with; the edge catches on the tips, rather than under the foot, I think.

I'll have plenty of wet powder to contend with tomorrow (poor me!) so I'll give all the hypotheses a try. Thank you, everyone, and sorry, @volklgirl, for hijacking! Back to you...

 

[vanhoskier]

When my uphill / new inside hand is too far back - then I end up unable to flatten correctly and have to lift my inside leg. ....This is an issue for me in bumps more than anywhere.

This happens to me in more intimidating bump runs....my uphill hand (on the left side only, which is weird) gets too far back and then everything falls apart. Focusing on pole plants does help, but it's interesting when fear or apprehension or whatever it is takes over and back that left hand goes!

 

[Fluffy Kitty]

OK. Not hijacking... actually responding to OP, if you can put up with my self-report for a sec.

OK. So, what I am doing is "pre-absorbing", after the downhill-pointing part of the turn is over, I'm lifting the new uphill leg so it goes over a soft bump that's coming; if I don't, the tip will dig in and I end up in a very awkward position. Sometimes I lift after I sense that the tip is already digging in. I do the same thing going the other way, but it's just not obvious because my right leg is stronger and doesn't lose the edge from having to be the only ski on the ground.

I actually have a scientific test, because the front side snow was wet and the back side snow was dry (Miracle! OMG! Awesomeness!); I did it a lot when the snow was wet, and I didn't do it at all when the snow was dry, since I could just cut through the soft bump. There were a few turns where I unedged fine, made the turn fine, but then a bump comes along, and up goes the uphill ski. If I'm closer to the fall line, the two skis are more likely to be even, so this occurred a lot less frequently; it's a symptom of sharp turns that make me more perpendicular to the fall line, in other words, which explains why I rarely do it on blue runs.

In the bump video, the first person lifts the old outside ski before initiating the turn. Not good. By contrast, @volklgirl lifts her new inside ski right after the middle of the turn as she approaches a bump; I think she's pre-absorbing.

So, if this is still something that needs to be fixed, I'm sure we'd both like to know what the solution would be. Thanks!

 

[bounceswoosh]

If you're skiing absolutely correctly, you're not lifting one leg at any point in the turn. I'm sorry =/ That is NOT to say that you can't ski all sorts of stuff and have fun and still lift your leg. If I had to track both feet perfectly to ski challenging terrain or have a good time, I would have packed up my bags a long time ago. But if you're asking if it's good technique - it's not. It's something to work on. It's not a disaster, but it's inefficient.

And I absolutely do think that lifting the leg has everything to do with not releasing. Because your ski isn't released, it doesn't have freedom to move, and you have to do something drastic to force it to go where you want it to go. That's what @Skisailor was saying, as I recall.

The reason you are lifting your leg when the snow is wet, and not when it's dry, is because either the dry snow allows you to get away with slightly less crisp technique, or because the wet snow intimidates you, so your technique degrades.

Release is a slippery term that I still haven't fully gotten my head around. But a lot of us have this habit of forcing rather than allowing. I think the release comes as part of allowing. But like I said, I don't fully own this skill yet and definitely can't describe it. But I see a lot of really good skiers who do not lift their legs in any part of the turn, even on gnarly terrain. My husband just got some kudos from our instructor Matt because he skied down the nose between two chutes without lifting his feet. It's not easy to get rid of the leg lift, but I know that when I really own that piece, I will be a much more effective and efficient skier.

 

[santacruz skier]

@bounceswoosh - I also see plenty of good skiers who do not lift their leg in variable conditions so know that it's not efficient and doesn't even look good. I mean who wants to ski like that? I tend to do all kinds of weird things (poor technique such as lifting leg, sitting back, not looking downhill, need I go on) when in challenging conditions such as sierra cement, heavy slush, chunky monkey, uneven bumps ...
I need to go back and read what @SkiBam , @KatyPerrey , @Skisailor , @Ursula and all those instructors I would love to get a lesson from...
Also got a lot of information from your posts from your lesson club that I actually used while skiing last week.

 

[bounceswoosh]

Also got a lot of information from your posts from your lesson club that I actually used while skiing last week.

Nice! I'd love to know which ones.

 

[santacruz skier]

Nice! I'd love to know which ones.

Oh where to begin?
*Try skiing w/ boots unbuckled - I find myself doing that and not on purpose... I usually unbuckle a few before getting on a lift - especially if I've been pushing heavy snow around - then ski and forget to buckle...
*Allow ski to go flat before tipping onto next turn.
*Tipping skis to initiate turns - not twisting hips
*Ski with strong core.
*Look where you're going, not down at your feet
*Don't ride downhill ski (railroad across slope is never good for turning)
*Race car noises....

To name a few. I think I need to go through the posts and make a list...

 

[santacruz skier]

Also all the ways to NOT lift your ski when turning.

 

[Fluffy Kitty]

If you're skiing absolutely correctly, you're not lifting one leg at any point in the turn.

I agree with you, but I think we are talking about two different scenarios. I'll ask a local instructor to take a look.

 

[heather matthews]

This thread really has got me thinking about my technique and how inconsistent it is.I've just come home from several weeks in Europe,skiing mostly off piste in some pretty challenging terrain and sometimes educational snow.As soon as I'm out of my comfort zone(or if I'm tired or lazy) then out comes the A frame and my downhill arm tends to drag a little(but only on a left turn).I don't tend to end up in the backseat much but I think that it was drilled into my head that central weight or even weight forward were what would make my skis work so I'm really conscious of it.Plus it feels horrible when it happens!So this year I'm going to sign up to do my Level 1 and maybe try Level 2 instructors courses back here at home in NZ.I really want to understand and improve upon my skiing.You guys really are quite inspirational.

 

[nopoleskier]

No you should not be lifting your foot unless avoiding a rock.. .. Yes you should have your feet closer together (athletic stance) yes you should keep your shoulders down the hill, Yes your INSIDE Ski does MATTER... It sets you up for the next turn (it's it!) Just did some good drills on hooking that inside ski (level 2)

 

[maggie198]

Yes your INSIDE Ski does MATTER... It sets you up for the next turn (it's it!) Just did some good drills on hooking that inside ski (level 2)

I just worked on some drills for hooking up the inside ski last week, in an intermediate clinic I took with my boyfriend (he was getting ready to bail at the start, so I joined his group!). Though I thought I was beyond needing work on this skill, having done the same drill in years past, it made me realize how much more I need to drive that uphill ski. In particular, with my left leg. This ankle doesn't flex as well as my right and it affects how easily I can initiate my right turns. Which haven't been as strong as my left turns. I realized why when I felt that my left ankle isn't flexing enough into the turn.

 

[nopoleskier]

I just worked on some drills for hooking up the inside ski last week, in an intermediate clinic I took with my boyfriend (he was getting ready to bail at the start, so I joined his group!). Though I thought I was beyond needing work on this skill, having done the same drill in years past, it made me realize how much more I need to drive that uphill ski. In particular, with my left leg. This ankle doesn't flex as well as my right and it affects how easily I can initiate my right turns. Which haven't been as strong as my left turns. I realized why when I felt that my left ankle isn't flexing enough into the turn.

I agree. my left leg is also the weaker and I think we ladies tend to "cave' the inside knee instead of "opening it up" For those trying this drill think about lifting your arch (do NOT lift your foot) make that inside knee stay open not caved in. You'll be pleased with the carve you'll get works great on Ice!! Also initiating the turn at the very top (early) think about 'flashing' the bottom of your skis to get them on edge... Finally Do Finish your turn.. often we get antsy and just 'huck' the turn and forget to let the skis ride the whole turn. Use a gentle pitch slope to try this :-)

 

[bounceswoosh]

Use a gentle pitch slope to try this :-)

This is critical. Allowing the skis to come around can be really scary.

 

[nopoleskier]

This is critical. Allowing the skis to come around can be really scary.

?? Scary to turn???? guess I just LOVE the feeling of being "hooked up" I love feeling the skis bend... It's easier to initiate a turn on a gentle slope to get the hang of it but once you do it it's super on steeps too..

 

[bounceswoosh]

?? Scary to turn???? guess I just LOVE the feeling of being "hooked up" I love feeling the skis bend... It's easier to initiate a turn on a gentle slope to get the hang of it but once you do it it's super on steeps too..

IF you are a person who has a habit of forcing the turn, it can be ... disconcerting, at least, to allow the turn to develop. It's pretty obvious that forcing the turn is not your issue, right? But pretend it's some other bad habit you have. If you're used to doing something that's a bad habit, and then you try to change that habit - yes, it is scary, because you have to force yourself NOT to do something that you've relied on. You know the parameters, and you know how it behaves. Doing it correctly may be better in the long run, but in the immediate term it's unfamiliar and weird, and yes, sometimes scary.

I can think of tons of examples where doing something different (but better) is scary. It's scary to get out of the back seat. It's scary not to drag your pole behind you like a feeler. It's scary to ski down the fall line. It's scary to extend your body forward to match the slope angle. It's scary to look far ahead instead of at the snow right in front of you. And yes, for those of us who force the turn, it is scary to let the turn develop.