Feel Bad For The Ski Resorts

[tinymoose]

What a craptastic season. According to a local news report our local hill is estimating a 3.5 million dollar loss for the season. I figured they were running at a loss, but I never guessed such a large $ amount. At least they're lucky enough to pull in money from activities other than skiing, but still...

 

[ski diva]

Yeah, pretty bad. You can hardly blame the ones who are putting in off-season activities, like golf and adventure parks. Relying on the whims of Mother Nature to generate an income can't be easy.

 

[deannatoby]

Not a good year in the accounting department. I never know who to believe, but one of the managers at our hill said a huge majority of the operating budget comes from season pass sales, which means for last year they still had their major income source. Then somebody else closely associated with the hill but doesn't work for it said they will still close at about zero, no profit no loss. We had a non-existant Christmas break, a "decent" MA vacation week (that I thought was far less than "decent" but apparently wasn't), and a barren NH vacation week. If that's true, how much money do they make in a good season?! But, I'm not going to complain because it's still the best season pass deal around. I wonder how many passes they'll sell for next winter.

 

[MonsteRawr]

One of our local mountains struggled so much this year that there were rumors flying around that they were closing their doors forever. The owner had to post a statement on Facebook reiterating that they were NOT closing, that one crappy season isn't enough to do them in, and they'll be here next year. I think it doesn't help that their two main runs, neither of which got much consistent cover this year, are easily view-able from the interstate. Big, brown skid marks running down the mountain, seen by every commuter on the highway. Talk about negative advertising!

There's another mountain in the area who only opened for one weekend this year. One weekend! Can you imagine being a season pass holder there? I would be piiiiiiissed! I mean, I get than when you buy a season pass you're taking a gamble on the season; trust me, we would have loved to get more than 23 ski days out of this tragically short season. But to only open the mountain for three days in the entire season? Sounds to me like a really great way to find yourself without any season pass holders next year!

Here's to a better season next year!

 

[tinymoose]

There's another mountain in the area who only opened for one weekend this year. One weekend! Can you imagine being a season pass holder there? I would be piiiiiiissed! I mean, I get than when you buy a season pass you're taking a gamble on the season; trust me, we would have loved to get more than 23 ski days out of this tragically short season. But to only open the mountain for three days in the entire season? Sounds to me like a really great way to find yourself without any season pass holders next year!

Yikes! Surely they'll offer a discount to this year's season pass holders on next year's passes? I would hope a fairly substantial discount at that! Most, if not all, of our local mountains guarantee a certain number of days or you get a discounted pass the next year.

 

[MaineSkiLady]

There were some interesting future developments rumored at Sugarloaf, but I seriously doubt the resort will have the revenue from this season to get them underway. Will find out at the passholder bbq in April. <sigh>

 

[marzNC]

Guess that's one advantage of a tiny mountain that essentially relies completely on snowmaking. Massanutten got just enough cold snaps to keep the primary slopes open just about as many days as usual. The two trails that never saw snow are often not covered in warmer winters and don't make that much difference to most people. So season pass holders didn't get much less opportunity to get on the snow than usual. Only need 7 days if mostly weekends to do better than break even.

 

[Jilly]

Our local bump didn't make through spring break, but I think that they were doing OK otherwise. Yeah to snow making! But snow making does cost money, so maybe passes will be up next year.

As for Tremblant, know more when I get up this weekend. They were planning for April 15th. But.......Easter Monday may be it!

 

[drjoyous]

Gee, when these (mostly) mega corporations were making huge profits last year in the fantastic season that lasted until july in some places.... huh.

 

[wpsally]

In Colorado the big problem with lower skier numbers has been the overall impact on our ski town economies. Here in Grand County a lot of businesses other than the resorts have taken a big hit. With the crappy snow, we've had fewer people here which means fewer people paying for lodging and food. And with food and lodging costs being lower over the last several years anyway (because of the economy), the hit this year has been really hard on small businesses. Outside of the Winter Park ski area, most restaurants are family owned. We've also got a lot of family-owned motels and condo rentals have been down.

Also, while we had some great snow last season that lasted a while, the revenue in April was pretty low. (And staying open an extra week last year because of when Easter fell proved to be not really worth it.) There are definitely days the resorts operate at a loss by the time they pay staff to be there for season pass holders who bring their own lunch. At Winter Park, they need 3000 skiers/day to break even. Mid-week it's not uncommon to have less than that on the mountain even during peak season. By April, most of the Denver daytrippers are enjoying the warm weather down there and not coming up to the mountain.

The upside to the bad snow seasons is that (assuming we don't see crazy April and May snowfall, which is still a possibility), we might be able to open the golf courses and bike trails at a reasonable time. We shall see.

 

[cyn]

In Colorado the big problem with lower skier numbers has been the overall impact on our ski town economies. Here in Grand County a lot of businesses other than the resorts have taken a big hit. With the crappy snow, we've had fewer people here which means fewer people paying for lodging and food. And with food and lodging costs being lower over the last several years anyway (because of the economy), the hit this year has been really hard on small businesses. Outside of the Winter Park ski area, most restaurants are family owned. We've also got a lot of family-owned motels and condo rentals have been down.

Also, while we had some great snow last season that lasted a while, the revenue in April was pretty low. (And staying open an extra week last year because of when Easter fell proved to be not really worth it.) There are definitely days the resorts operate at a loss by the time they pay staff to be there for season pass holders who bring their own lunch. At Winter Park, they need 3000 skiers/day to break even. Mid-week it's not uncommon to have less than that on the mountain even during peak season. By April, most of the Denver daytrippers are enjoying the warm weather down there and not coming up to the mountain.

The upside to the bad snow seasons is that (assuming we don't see crazy April and May snowfall, which is still a possibility), we might be able to open the golf courses and bike trails at a reasonable time. We shall see.

In Colorado the big problem with lower skier numbers has been the overall impact on our ski town economies. Here in Grand County a lot of businesses other than the resorts have taken a big hit. With the crappy snow, we've had fewer people here which means fewer people paying for lodging and food. And with food and lodging costs being lower over the last several years anyway (because of the economy), the hit this year has been really hard on small businesses. Outside of the Winter Park ski area, most restaurants are family owned. We've also got a lot of family-owned motels and condo rentals have been down.

Also, while we had some great snow last season that lasted a while, the revenue in April was pretty low. (And staying open an extra week last year because of when Easter fell proved to be not really worth it.) There are definitely days the resorts operate at a loss by the time they pay staff to be there for season pass holders who bring their own lunch. At Winter Park, they need 3000 skiers/day to break even. Mid-week it's not uncommon to have less than that on the mountain even during peak season. By April, most of the Denver daytrippers are enjoying the warm weather down there and not coming up to the mountain.

The upside to the bad snow seasons is that (assuming we don't see crazy April and May snowfall, which is still a possibility), we might be able to open the golf courses and bike trails at a reasonable time. We shall see.

We were at Mt Snow last weekend and talked to a local who told us that her town was "shriveling up." It sure looked that way to us. So many places for sale this year including stalwarts like TC's! Between the lousy snow years, bad decisions by the new owners of the mountain and the disastrous flooding, these folks have not had a break. Very sad.

 

[whitewater girl]

Gee, when these (mostly) mega corporations were making huge profits last year in the fantastic season that lasted until july in some places.... huh.

the mid-atlantic states didn't necessarily have a "fantastic season" last year (weather patterns brought snow up the coast, largely missing inland mountain resorts)...some places lucked out, while others struggled & closed early...

There's another mountain in the area who only opened for one weekend this year. One weekend! Can you imagine being a season pass holder there? I would be piiiiiiissed! I mean, I get than when you buy a season pass you're taking a gamble on the season; trust me, we would have loved to get more than 23 ski days out of this tragically short season. But to only open the mountain for three days in the entire season? Sounds to me like a really great way to find yourself without any season pass holders next year!

Yikes! Surely they'll offer a discount to this year's season pass holders on next year's passes? I would hope a fairly substantial discount at that! Most, if not all, of our local mountains guarantee a certain number of days or you get a discounted pass the next year.

...several of the resorts @ Saratoga Springs/eastern ADKs area are just starting up again - hate to see them having to deal with this! (I'm guessing they're the one's struggling so much; minimal-to-no snow-making...I doubt they can afford to discount next year's passes, at this point)

 

[sperks]

I feel for you all you are experiencing what we in Australia have to go through every few years

 

[MonsteRawr]

the mid-atlantic states didn't necessarily have a "fantastic season" last year (weather patterns brought snow up the coast, largely missing inland mountain resorts)...some places lucked out, while others struggled & closed early...




...several of the resorts @ Saratoga Springs/eastern ADKs area are just starting up again - hate to see them having to deal with this! (I'm guessing they're the one's struggling so much; minimal-to-no snow-making...I doubt they can afford to discount next year's passes, at this point)

The mountain that was rumored to be closing (and is most definitely not) is West Mountain in Glens Falls. The mountain that only opened up one weekend this year was Hickory Mountain in Warrensburg.

 

[gardenmary]

The Nordic resort in Big Bear didn't open this year at all - a first in 20 years. Even with the 3 feet they got last weekend, it's just too late in the year to think that snow will last. They don't have snowmaking - and with the warm air temps all winter the ground is too warm to hold the snow.

I would think like most businesses, when a ski resort has a good year (or a few of them) that instead of spending that capital, it's got to be socked away for a while. Even though our income property is actually producing a decent income, it just goes in the bank. The units were built in 1960 and maintenance, both small and large scale, is inevitable. That said, running a ski resort is almost as bad as farming when it comes to being co-dependent on the whims of nature.

 

[whitewater girl]

The mountain that was rumored to be closing (and is most definitely not) is West Mountain in Glens Falls. The mountain that only opened up one weekend this year was Hickory Mountain in Warrensburg.

Hickory was closed for several years:

Hickory Ski Area is a classic, surface lift only ski area in Warrensburg, NY that has reopened for the 2009-2010 season! The area has been closed since 2005, but activity is well underway to restore this gem back to operable conditions.

https://www.nelsap.org/ny/hickory1.html

Reopened Lost Areas in NY (Closed at One Time)
* Big Tupper ~ Tupper Lake *Reopened 2009
* Hickory Ski Center ~ Warrensburg *Reopened 2009-2010
* Hoosac School ~ Hoosick
* Oak Mountain ~ Speculator
* Schroon Lake Ski Center

https://www.nelsap.org/ny/ny.html

 

[marzNC]

The tiny little hills in TN and AL (yes, Alabama), Ober and Cloudmont, really never got going. Their seasons are typically pretty short any way. Cloudmont may only have opened for a couple days before realizing it was a lost cause.

 

[Indianaskier]

Somehow the ski areas here managed to survive until early March, but it wasn't ideal by any means. It snowed about an inch the last day they were opened, where I usually go,then it got warm, rain came and that was the end. They did manage to get to have the spring carnival, which usually brings in a ton of people. Being so near Cincinnati, I think helps some, because it is easy for people to run over there after work, since they stay open late. I've seen a couple of seasons similar to this, but never a winter that was as consistantly warm and rainy. The season passes are on sale now for next season, which helps generate funds. The prices are best now, so I will get mine and save some money. It's sad to see the areas that have been hurt badly by this warm winter. Let's hope for better winters ahead.

 

[NewEnglandSkier]

It's pretty depressing to go to the various ski area websites each day and see the trail count shrinking so quickly. Killington is down to 13 trails and others are down pretty far as well. I look every day, though I don't know what I torture myself. This is just so wrong to be happening in March.

 

[drjoyous]

Hey, the year was bad for most of us, pretty much (woohoo for the PNW, though!). Seriously, what business doesn't expect a year or even two when they don't swing their "profits"? Isn't that what business is supposed to be about--they make big profits and sometimes weather big losses?? It's a bad economy--people are losing their jobs everywhere. I guess i'm not as concerned about the resorts losing money as i am the employees they hire at pittance losing their jobs.

Maybe that's "too political" for this site, but so is asking if we're feeling sorry for corporations losing money, IMHO.