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Unsolicited Feedback from Man on Chairlift. Grrr....

SallyCat

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
A few years ago I pulled into a state park campground after dark a Friday night and a very nice college-age fellow came over and said of he and his group of friends: "We're all guys, so if you need any help setting up your tent, just let us know." I was headed off on an ultralight solo backpacking trip the next morning and definitely didn't need help with my tent, but he meant well and was very sweet. I thanked him for what were clearly good intentions and wished them all a good night. When I woke up in the morning, I looked in the direction of their campsite and saw this: :rotf::rotf:

Guy Tent Screenshot.png
 
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Skier31

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
Glad you had fun on those bumps! If I lived in the northeast, I'd be more inclined to work towards having fun on frozen bumps. But I'm a bit too spoiled given that most of my skiing off-piste is out west. :smile:
A few years ago I pulled into a state park campground after dark a Friday night and a very nice college-age fellow came over and said of he and his group of friends: "We're all guys, so if you need any help setting up your tent, just let us know." I was headed off on an ultralight solo backpacking trip the next morning and definitely didn't need help with my tent, but he meant well and was very sweet. I thanked him for what were clearly good intentions and wished them all a good night. When I woke up in the morning, I looked in the direction of their campsite and saw this:

View attachment 10669

Yes, some people are clueless. It was nice of them to offer to help, even though you could have probably helped them more.
 

SqueakySnow

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
Here's a great way for a sales person to start small talk with a potential customer, no matter what product they are standing in front of:

"Hey, is there anything I can help you with today?"

Just a thought...
 

riversnow

Diva in Training
But you are making an assumption about his intentions out of thin air. Did he say, "You don't want those, they are race skis"? Maybe he's just explaining the store layout to her.

I worked for a while in retail. It's amazing what customers take exception to. I had a lady ask me, "Is this the store with the best shower curtains?" Being it was a very small part of our stock (we had maybe six) and there was another store with an emphasis on bath products, I said I didn't know. I thought it was an odd question, frankly. Then she starts railing at me for being stupid and demands to see the owner. This guy could have just been making innocent small talk. I wasn't there. For all we know he tells guys the same thing.

And it's not that I don't have issues when I walk in ski shops. I have arguments about how to tune skis and which skis I should be looking at as well. But I have more concrete grounds than someone telling me the kind of skis I'm standing in front of. She didn't tell us he suggested she look at something else. Maybe he did. She didn't say that.


SallyCat is correct. Without going into extensive detail, I can say that based on the situation and the way I was being addressed, I feel I was treated this way because I am female. I doubt it was his “intent,” but he did it none the less. The clerks do not address the male members of my family the way they address me. The initial comment I posted about has been said to me on more than one occasion, by more than one clerk, and not only makes me uncomfortable, but makes the people who are with me uncomfortable. This leads me to believe the clerks’ comments are inappropriate.

It seems quite a stretch to think that all those clerks were simply explaining the store layout to me, but to answer your question - yes, I have had to hear that comment as well. Although it was on a separate occasion, it was almost word for word what you wrote. After I purchased race skis at a ski swap, a man who was working at the swap came up to me and said, “you don’t want those, they are race skis, you won’t be able to ski on them.” He said this even though he knew nothing about me, except what I looked like (a middle-aged woman) and I had not approached him or asked for his help. I told him I had already bought the skis and he walked away.

These incidents reiterate what SallyCat posted, about it being an "insidious little injury; it's not the one incident, it's the cumulation of these interactions over a lifetime that takes a toll." Having this occur repeatedly becomes wearing. It makes what should be an enjoyable experience, become one that is unpleasant.

Thank you SallyCat for your eloquent response to Sibhusky’s post. I found it enlightening. We are all entitled to our opinions, and I am not trying to change anyone else’s, only relate my own experience.
 
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Skier31

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
After many years of not saying anything in response to comments like that, I have found that it is helpful for my mental health, to respond. Whether it is a simple statement such as yes, I know those are race skis and I am looking for race skis to a question such as “are you aware that I race” or “do you know anything about how I ski?”

My husband is an emiritus examiner in Rocky Mountain. He is a great skier and instructor. However, you would not realize that by looking at him due to his body type. On numerous occasions, he has been steered to intermediate boots and skis in various ski shops.

I am not doubting that this happens to more women but it is the arrogance of some of the shop employees that they can judge skiing ability by looking at someone.
 

Littlesonique

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
I’m totally immune to this. If a guy needs to say something, I generally ignore them and keep going. I only had 1 incident where people on the lift were talking to me, but I couldn’t get my ski back on and 4 chairs going by were giving me advice, so it was appreciated.

I did get golf claps this last trip when my instructor was having us entertain the people on the lift with having us ski on one ski.

The worst I had was when I was wearing my unicorn tail (I’m a bit extravagant at times) and was having issues getting my ski on (again) and he came up and grabbed my tail and got my boot in the binding without asking. :eek: He was older and drunk and I just shock my head, said thanks for help and skied away before he could say anything else to me.
 

contesstant

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
I have not been "mansplained" to very often, if at all. I don't know if it's some strange RBF that I put out, or some confidence I exude? (Seriously, I don't know why!)

I DID have a guy when I was working at the mountain ask me often, "when are you going to learn how to cahve?" (Carve, he's from the Boston area originally.) In the meantime, he rips down the hill doing anything but cahve! So, fast forward to my meeting my main squeeze, and as soon as this guy knew I was dating someone, he quit talking to me! Now, mind you, he's married and in his late 60s. What a weirdo! To this day, two years later, he STILL ignores me. He used to talk to me incessantly.

So, maybe I'm just oblivious to men's intentions, I don't know.

Truth be told, I believe that there is less inherent sexism in the west than I'd encountered when living in Virginia or Ohio. Maybe it's not a coincidence that the guy I mention above is from the east coast?
 

mountainwest

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
I started racing night league two years ago, and whenever I walk into a ski shop and look at the race skis, a salesMAN immediately walks over to me and says, "those are race skis." (yes, I know they are race skis, that's why I'm looking at them - uggg). It happens every time. Has anyone else had this kind of thing happen when shopping for equipment? How do you handle it? Any snappy come backs?
“Thank you, Sherlock.”
I also think that “Yes, I know they are race skis, that's why I'm looking at them” works very well too.
 

WaterGirl

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
So I thought about this thread yesterday..... took a group lesson intended for those over 50 at local bump. Everyone in group great except one male. I'll call him JOHN. His job was to explain to every female in the group (and a few comments to the males) exactly what the instructor said or to add on his own comments /critique of their skiing. This included another woman who was an credentialed instructor in Tahoe.

It started with the instructor making ONE comment to me after our first run -- which was simple - just to widen my stance a bit. John skied up to me and said "so, what he said was to widen your stance, you need to make a bit more space between your skis"..... the mansplaining light bulb immediately went on in my head. I ignored most of it, except for when I could 'one up him' in a nice way. This became much more of a game for me - trust me.

As I was a new person to what was an established group I understand he had prior history and maybe as the better skier of the group (in some situations) he was thinking of himself as the 'assistant' or demonstrator. Oddly in the "group picture" taken yesterday, all students are on the left of the instructor, except he placed himself to the right. So he is not assoicatiling himself with the "students" but rather on the "instructor" side. When he was mansplaining me on a lift I asked him what his teaching credentials were - none, he had, you know, tought back in the day at some resort, was the first pick of the instructor tryouts, but that he didn't have any certs b/c that took money and time.

I realized that in someways a mansplaining male may have some mental health issues. Really John was a Big fish in a small pond, who thought he was a good skier. Small town mentality, maybe this was where he shinned. But his clothes were dated, skis were ok, and ego clearly super inflated. John told me "You know you can learn a lot from watching other skiers... (like him)." He did make a comment about another male - but it was like oh ED skis so much better on his new skis then he did before...... On a chair lift up with myself and another female, he made comments and critiques of her last run, and really it wasn't bad advice, but thats what the instructor is for. His M.O. was to say something nice, then to tell you your 'fault.' I did see him lurking around after the lesson and he actually jumped on the lift with me but I shut down any idea that I wanted to free ski with him. (I don't think he followed me down the ungroomed black). I did see him lurking around later when I was talking to the mountain host at the entrance to the hill. Somewhat creepy.

And aside from John, I really did enjoy my mixed group - the other men were exceptional.
So based upon the limited circumstances of yesterdays group, and being the interloper, I let it slide --- especially as I will most likely not return unless I get another Wednesday off and the snow is spectacular. If I did, however, I would ask to be in another group. However, I'll say egotistically on my part, I was in the top group and well, I know I am a better skier than John.
 
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newboots

Angel Diva
Ahh, @WaterGirl , I could feel my blood pressure rising as I read along. What a painful ugly drag it is. Honestly, explaining what the instructor meant by "widen your stance?" And not even enough shame to stop when it's clear that you are a better skier (which should have been clear after he saw you
 

WaterGirl

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
Ahh, @WaterGirl , I could feel my blood pressure rising as I read along. What a painful ugly drag it is. Honestly, explaining what the instructor meant by "widen your stance?" And not even enough shame to stop when it's clear that you are a better skier (which should have been clear after he saw you

Thats why after the first comment I thought "for real"? really?
wtf --- did this person just ski up to me and regurgitate what the instructor said?
There has to be something wrong with him.

And so I partly blame the allowance of his behavior to continue on during the lesson on the instructor.
And this would be my criticism for the organizer. Maybe in the past this person has assisted and MAYBE he thinks he is an instructor. Like I said, I let it go b/c I think there was a slight screw loose to say the least. And this person was on the younger end of the spectrum so perhaps thinks his place to be the helper. I would have liked to ask the other women what they thought as well.....

And again, if I was continuing with the lesson series I would be saying much much more. But since this is a place I haven't visited for 9 years, and only went b/c of local cheap skiing and good snow to entertain myself between my home mountain visits I won't likely return.
 

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