Toe DIN & Heel DIN

[skigrl27]

OK, so I do ALL the accident reports here in Aspen/Snowmass. So far...1711 incidents to date.

Anyway - the patroller's note the DIN settings on many crashes on their reports. Lots of people have different toe/heel settings. Sometimes quite drastic.

Mine are set at 10/10 toe & heel. Soooo....any insight on this? Should one be less than the other? If so...which should be which?

 

[Robyn]

Wow, 10 really? That seems extremely high to me.

 

[skigrl27]

Yeah I know...me & alta_gal had to defend our high DINs in the DIN thread a while back.

In a nutshell: in most terrain I ski & especially on big powder days, I'd rather fall & bust out a knee than fall & lose a ski up the mountain and be stranded. Sounds crazy, I know.

 

[MaineSkiLady]

Weird. I think a numerical disparity might well compromise the binding function.
Well, if 10 is your number---we did get into this once recently with the DIN thread, lots of variations among us.

Sure wish my DIN had been a little lower 2 weeks ago when I got clipped standing still. I heel-released out of the right (and what a knee twist that was without any momentum) but no release on the left. Would have helped me prevent a sprain.

Pre-releasing stinks. Releasing in a crash isn't even great fun. But needing to come out and not coming out hurts. :( (I'm at 5.5)

 

[Robyn]

Well, I'm not going to argue and make you defend, it's completely up to you but I guess my thinking is new skis are cheaper than surgery. I haven't a clue about setting DINs at different levels toe/heel. Sorry.

 

[NannyMin]

Here's an old thread from Epic, that touches on this subject. The discussion about different toe and heal DIN settings is further down in the thread.

 

[num]

I dunno about different settings for toe and heel, I'll be reading that link from epic.

I've always wondered about different din settings for right and left skis if one has a significantly dominant leg. Of course that'd require us differentiating one ski from the other. I imagine there's a reason why it doesn't matter, but would love to hear explanations.

 

[Severine]

Sure wish my DIN had been a little lower 2 weeks ago when I got clipped standing still. I heel-released out of the right (and what a knee twist that was without any momentum) but no release on the left. Would have helped me prevent a sprain.

Pre-releasing stinks. Releasing in a crash isn't even great fun. But needing to come out and not coming out hurts. :( (I'm at 5.5)

Yup, sucks when it doesn't release and it should. That's essentially why my knee is injured, too. It wasn't the fall - it was that my ski got stuck and the binding didn't release when it should have. Felt like my skis were ripped off of me. :( Mine was a 5 but I think I'll be turning it down a bit with these bindings.

I can't imagine skiing with a DIN of 10, but I can understand not wanting to lose a ski in the middle of nowhere.

Didn't know you could use different DIN for toe/heel.

 

[MaineSkiLady]

Yup, sucks when it doesn't release and it should.

Didn't know you could use different DIN for toe/heel.

Yeah, you can pretty much set 'em where you want. Easy enough to do.
I think my DIN is fine - problem was that I was standing still when clipped, fell backward, classic knee wrenching position. One heel did release (ow). Other ski/leg just stretched WAYYYYYYYYY out. (that's where I have the peculiar sprain, not knee, fibular). Amazed that my right knee is in one piece ligament-wise after the torque/twist forces it had to endure. I'm kind of dealing with same pain issues you are. Hurts, doesn't check out as anything serious. Will be insistent next OS visit. Time to address this (part of it is chronic) once and for all and get on the rehab/heal path. Not sure how long I'm out either. Left sprain resolving. Right knee hurts.

 

[altagirl]

Your DIN setting is NOT meant to be low enough to protect your knee ligaments from injury - it would be impossible. The force of a DIN setting of zero is enough to tear an ACL. You can plant a bare foot on the ground and try to recover out of a rear twisting fall and tear your ACL if you happen to hit the forces just right.

DIN settings are meant to protect your bones from breaking, etc.

And as we discussed in the other thread, there is terrain that some people ski where a pre-release in a dangerous area (over cliffs, etc.) could mean death. Breaking a leg or blowing a knee in a fall is better than falling off a cliff onto rocks and landing on your head because your ski came off at an inopportune moment.

FWIW - my DIN's are set at 8, which is right about where they should be on the chart. And I fell exactly twice this year. Once I flopped over in powder at low speed - no need for the skis to come off. The second - I was skiing really fast in chopped up powder - basically straightlining and the next second I was on one ski. The ensuing crash wasn't fun and left me with a mild concussion and neckache. So honestly, if I'm going to ski like that, the DIN's need to go up. And I was just crashing at high speed into powder because my ski released. If I had been above a cliff band or something it could have been a lot worse.

The bottom line is that your recommended DIN works for you and you're not skiing in no-fall terrain or having issues then you should certainly leave it there. But in some situations, the consequences of a pre-release are far worse than breaking a leg because a ski didn't release.

And I have heard of people cranking heels or toes one more than the other depending on what sort of releases they've been having problems with.

 

[Pequenita]

Your DIN setting is NOT meant to be low enough to protect your knee ligaments from injury - it would be impossible. The force of a DIN setting of zero is enough to tear an ACL. You can plant a bare foot on the ground and try to recover out of a rear twisting fall and tear your ACL if you happen to hit the forces just right.

Yup. That's how I tore it playing soccer.

 

[Jilly]

From the shop tech at our store - DIN setting heel and toe should be the same. Maybe a racer or extreme skier might need a difference, but the settings should be the same for anybody else.

 

[volklgirl]

From the shop tech at our store - DIN setting heel and toe should be the same. Maybe a racer or extreme skier might need a difference, but the settings should be the same for anybody else.

Nope. Not necessarily.

Just like any mechanical device, wear and aging can affect the springs in the heel and toe pieces differently. There is a machine that tests the torque value of each piece of the binding. The bindings are then set so that each piece releases at the same torque value....due to possible uneven wear, this torque value may not correspond to "the same" DIN setting on each piece. This testing and adjustment shoudlbe performed by a qualified technician/shop at the beginning of each season and then again any time there seems to be a consistent misfunction of the bindings.

 

[Jilly]

Yes volklgirl, but most of us don't put our gear through that kind of wear and tear. Racers etc - oh yah, get them tested. But the average skier <30 days/year isn't putting that kind of wear on a binding. Also most of us are not a the high settings that some of you are. (5.5 for mine) And to say it again, please get things check by QUALIFIED personnel. Not your boyfriend or neighbour. Techs must take a test every year to be qualified to work on bindings.

 

[volklgirl]

The spring wear has nothing to do with DIN settings. ALL metal and plastic parts fatigue over time. Merely stepping in to and out of your bindings over the course of the season and deterioration of the metal due to oxidation can be enough to change the way the heel and toe pieces behave (and that doesn't even take into account variations in materials from the manufacturing process).

EVERYONE should have their binding release values checked regularly by QUALIFIED technicians (that said, I haven't had it done in a couple of years ).

Also most of us are not a the high settings that some of you are. (5.5 for mine)

I'm an agressive heavyweight with a very short boot sole, but I'm still only at a 7, except my race rides which are set at 8.

 

[Daria]

We have had discussions on this quite a bit -especially now that both my DH and I are over 50 - the shops automatically lower your settings by one whole number (say 7 down to 6). We have both "walked" out of our skis a couple of times and luckily didn't get injured. We talked to one of our good friends who is an very experienced instructor and back country guide. He advised that if you are skiing really steep terrain - say heli skiing in Alaska - you really need to crank up the DINs because if you come out of your ski you are dead in those conditions. Otherwise, go with what you feel comfortable with and tweek it if you pop out unnecessarily.

 

[Gloria]

The spring wear has nothing to do with DIN settings. ALL metal and plastic parts fatigue over time. Merely stepping in to and out of your bindings over the course of the season and deterioration of the metal due to oxidation can be enough to change the way the heel and toe pieces behave (and that doesn't even take into account variations in materials from the manufacturing process).

EVERYONE should have their binding release values checked regularly by QUALIFIED technicians (that said, I haven't had it done in a couple of years ).


I'm an agressive heavyweight with a very short boot sole, but I'm still only at a 7, except my race rides which are set at 8.

I would assume that weather extremes plus bringing skis from warm inddor conditions out into freezing cold temps could affect plastic as well. Especially on less expensive models that may be found on skis of people less than racers etc. I know that I have one pair of bindings that I went a little cheap on and the DIN settings are far from true on these after a season of skiing. The ski shop did make adjustments when they reset them for my new boots and they are different from the chart as such. On the other hand the bindings I did pay a decent price for are right on the chart and both were filled out the same way.

 

[MaineSkiLady]

over 50 - the shops automatically lower your settings by one whole number (say 7 down to 6).

Really? Mine went down only by .5 (apparently has other bases? forgot)
Website from former discussion:
https://www.dinsetting.com/

 

[Daria]

Yep one full setting. And if you plead to have them raise it back up they won't do it but will gladly give you a screw driver. That or you can lie about your age in the paperwork

 

[Daria]

I just looked at the website and couldn't get it to calculate for me - just said "N/A" I must be doing something wrong. Interesting though at the ski shops I go to in California there is no 3+. The top level is a 3. Maybe it is a California thing