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The benefits of a shorter ski

santacruz skier

Angel Diva
I have heard, but really can't confirm, that narrower skis are easier on the knees. My narrowest skis are 96 mm so really I'm no help..
Paging @nopoleskier she would know!
 

2ski2moro

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
I agree with marzNC, especially about strengthening your muscles.

I am no expert, but wouldn't a shorter ski be easier to inadvertently twist relative to the rest of your body, putting torsion on your knee joint?

Could I ask, if you don't mind sharing, what is the nature of your "bad knee?" That might give us a better idea of what you want to accomplish.
 

nopoleskier

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
I have heard, but really can't confirm, that narrower skis are easier on the knees. My narrowest skis are 96 mm so really I'm no help..
Paging @nopoleskier she would know!

yes for me, narrow is easier on the knees especially in the East having to lay fatties over on eastern hard pack carving for me is tougher on my used up knees.

In the West different story, even when packed it's softer and is sooo nice, I had no problems on 98 under foot while carving out west, and you know my z-90's work well too.
 

alison wong

Angel Diva
what is the nature of your "bad knee?"
I have Osteopenia - i.e. early stage of OA.

Also I attributed to years (15+ years) of hi-impact step aerobics, wearing bad shoes esp in early years. This all adds up.

I think skiing definitely adds the "insult" to it. When I first started skiing, after 3 days, I could barely walk upstairs. Now I think I have improved my stance somewhat, still experience pain after 3 or 4 days, but the pain was tolerable. Plus I wear knee braces on both legs. Not sure how much they help, but mentally I rely on them, can't go skiing without them anymore.

With all that said, I am not giving up on either, step aerobic is my 1st love, and skiing is 2nd.

So I am doing everything I can to delay the deterioration of my knees. :frown:
 

MilkyWookiee

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
My mother, 5' 2" and weight I am not at liberty to disclose, had been skiing Rossi saphirs (early 2000s) at 160. She transitioned to my 2006 K2 trueluvs in the mid 140s this season, with some encouragement from her bootfitter. She is skiing blue/green groomers for the fun of being with her family. Not aggressive, not fast. She was told a longer ski will offer stability at speed and a shorter ski will offer maneuverability. That said, "short" and "long" have a lot to do with how much ski really engages the snow. Rocker/camber, stiffness, and snow conditions all affect this, so demoing in conditions you most frequently ski is valuable. But, as a rule of thumb, short=maneuveable and long=stable at speed, is a good guideline.
 

marzNC

Angel Diva
yes for me, narrow is easier on the knees especially in the East having to lay fatties over on eastern hard pack carving for me is tougher on my used up knees.

In the West different story, even when packed it's softer and is sooo nice, I had no problems on 98 under foot while carving out west, and you know my z-90's work well too.
Agree that for more or less mid-season conditions, narrower is easier. But I found that in soft snow due to high temps in the 40s or 50s (over even 60s), wider skis with more tip rocker is better. The direct comparison I did recently--Bachelor, Mammoth in May--was between my Head Absolut Joys, 78mm @148cm, and my old Black Pearls (2012), 88mm @159cm. The BPs were more fun and easier to ski in general after 10:30 or 11:00 when even the groomers at higher elevation were quite soft.
 

liquidfeet

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
....
I am no expert, but wouldn't a shorter ski be easier to inadvertently twist relative to the rest of your body, putting torsion on your knee joint?....

If the skier is inadvertently twisting the skis, then that's easier with a short ski. But most accidents happen because the snow unexpectedly twists the skis, right? That's why accidents are unexpected.

So I think the opposite is the case. A long ski is more likely to get jerked around by the snow than a short ski. There's more ski there to allow "catching an edge." When a ski catches and jerks and the body is not expecting that jerk, that's when the knee gets twisted.

Short skis have less edge for the snow to grab or push around. Thus the advice that short skis are more "maneuverable." The skier can more easily keep the skis in control when they are short (as long as the boots are snug).

That said, momentum and surface area are both your friends when you are going fast. Momentum stabilizes things at speed (remember learning to balance on a bicycle the first time and it required some speed???), and longer skis spread out the permutations of the snow's reaction to the skis, which in turns offers a smoother ride. That's why long skis are better for speed (this only works of course if the boots are snug).

Much of the herky-jerky stuff with skis originates inside the boot when the foot moves loosely around in there. It's the "loose steering wheel" effect. Lack of ski control may not be the ski length, it may just be the boots.
 

SallyCat

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
I have Osteopenia - i.e. early stage of OA.

Also I attributed to years (15+ years) of hi-impact step aerobics, wearing bad shoes esp in early years. This all adds up.

Weight-bearing exercise is probably not the cause of OA, at least according to some small-sample-size studies. I always have this study (below) in my back pocket for when people yell at me for running, because it's "bad for your knees."

Study is Here.
 

alison wong

Angel Diva
I always have this study (below) in my back pocket for when people yell at me for running, because it's "bad for your knees."
Thanks for sharing the article and demystifying the myth. Running is the very exercise I try to avoid because I always think it'd hard on my knees. I swim instead......
 

marzNC

Angel Diva
This just popped up today in my 'Bumps for Boomers' email. It's a link to part one of four on ski length: https://www.bumpsforboomers.com/2016/02/choosing-ski-length-mogul-skiing-part-1-of-4/
Note that Bumps for Boomers advocates learning on very short skis initially during their multi-day bump clinics. I think the first length is around 95cm for a few hours. Note that they are not teaching beginners. Rather intermediates or advanced skiers over 50 who are uncomfortable on bumps for one reason or another.

My Taos instructor was much happier when I had BP88s @145, rather than K2 Alluvit 88 @159 that I demo'd at first. So fair to say that for improving fundamentals with the ultimate goal of serious bump skiing, the preference at Taos is for shorter skis even for advanced skiers.
 

Abbi

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
Note that Bumps for Boomers advocates learning on very short skis initially during their multi-day bump clinics. I think the first length is around 95cm for a few hours. Note that they are not teaching beginners. Rather intermediates or advanced skiers over 50 who are uncomfortable on bumps for one reason or another.

My Taos instructor was much happier when I had BP88s @145, rather than K2 Alluvit 88 @159 that I demo'd at first. So fair to say that for improving fundamentals with the ultimate goal of serious bump skiing, the preference at Taos is for shorter skis even for advanced skiers.

However the article wasn't about bump skiing, but skiing in general.
 

marzNC

Angel Diva
However the article wasn't about bump skiing, but skiing in general.
Yes, but it's the first of a series of articles and has the title "Choosing Ski Length - Mogul Skiing." For readers with questions similar to Post #1 by the OP or Alison in Post #10, I think keeping in mind the audience for the article is worthwhile.

As someone who learned on long straight skis over my head and who was an adult intermediate for a few decades before having the time and interest to move past the intermediate plateau, I've enjoyed skis of many lengths from 136cm to 180cm. Ski length is one of many factors to consider in terms of why making turns is relatively easy or takes a lot of effort. One reason it's so hard to make a buying decision with out demo'ing.
 

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