Seeking advice on obtaining a mountain bike (cross country)

[santacruz skier]

Question about flat pedals..... I have heard that you can easily bang up your shins with the flat pedals. I have pretty thin skin around my shins and bleed very easily if brushing up against almost anything. Think it's an old age thing (the thin skin at the shins)....
I was thinking of getting new flat pedals (and new mtn bike shoes) for my mtn bike.
Any thoughts on that ? Currently very old school with little clip like things (not a cage but a little quarter like gizmo to slip my foot in and out of) and "gasp" bar ends which I'm told to get rid of ASAP.

 

[Little Lightning]

I few cents on flat pedals based on my experience and humble opinions...

Foot size matters, but it's not the defining factor for flat pedals. I think it's probably a larger factor for people with huge feet...larger feet with little pedals don't work well, but small feet with large pedals aren't the end of the world.

Different size spindles are more necessary to change Q angles on clipless pedals because your feet stay in one position. Your foot can be adjusted constantly when on a flat pedal. If you need to push your foot out a bit, you don't need to change the spindle to do so...you just move it a couple millimeters wider. If Q-angles have been an issue in the past, I would consider not going to a really small pedal to accommodate your small feet; and instead use a "normal" or moderately sized pedal to give you maximum adjustment.

Personally, grip has been my defining factor on what flat pedals I've enjoyed. This probably stems from regularly using clipless and enjoying the feeling of being attached to my bike. My favorite flat pedals are my Canfield Crampons, which are very adequately named. My husband has the same Canfields, Crank Brothers Stamp pedal (I think he has a set of 3s and 7s), as well as Spanks (unsure of the model). He also likes his Canfields the best. Personally, I really dislike the CB Stamps despite them being very well reviewed, and very popular. They're durable and well made; I just don't like the feel of them (not enough grip).

The issue I had with Q angle was with my old bike. I now have a Liv Pique so I'm hoping the issue will be solved. My hips are very narrow 33", my Mtn bike saddle is 130 mm. I was concerned that too wide of a pedal might put me farther away from the spindle affecting pedaling control.
I checked the shoe size recommendations for the Spank Spoon 90. Size 6 kids or smaller worried me until I realized I'm a 3.5 in kids shoes. A size 6 kids or men's shoe is the equivalent of a size 7.5-8 in a women's shoe. To me that seems like plenty of room for a size 6 shoe without giving up performance.
Jensen USA had the pedals in stock so I ordered a pair from them.

 

[Little Lightning]

Question about flat pedals..... I have heard that you can easily bang up your shins with the flat pedals. I have pretty thin skin around my shins and bleed very easily if brushing up against almost anything. Think it's an old age thing (the thin skin at the shins)....
I was thinking of getting new flat pedals (and new mtn bike shoes) for my mtn bike.
Any thoughts on that ? Currently very old school with little clip like things (not a cage but a little quarter like gizmo to slip my foot in and out of) and "gasp" bar ends which I'm told to get rid of ASAP.

Yes, Some of the reviews I've been reading about flat pedals do mention getting cut by the pedals. However, they were the more aggressive, burley style of pedals.

I just ordered the Spank Spoon flat pedals in a 90 width. https://www.jensonusa.com/Spank-Spoon-90-Pedals
Although Spank targeted them more for kids some of the shop descriptions I saw described them as perfect for smaller women. These were recommended for a men's or boys size 6 which is equal to a woman's size 7.5-8.

I use Speedplay Frogs which is a clipless pedal. Easy enough to get out of but want to improve my skills to be a stronger cyclist.

 

[santacruz skier]

I always heard clipless pedals were the most efficient. How do flat pedals improve efficiency? Thanks for the link . I’ll check them out!

 

[Little Lightning]

Roxy inspired me to try flat pedals. Especially for hill climbing.

 

[elemmac]

Question about flat pedals..... I have heard that you can easily bang up your shins with the flat pedals. I have pretty thin skin around my shins and bleed very easily if brushing up against almost anything. Think it's an old age thing (the thin skin at the shins)....
I was thinking of getting new flat pedals (and new mtn bike shoes) for my mtn bike.
Any thoughts on that ? Currently very old school with little clip like things (not a cage but a little quarter like gizmo to slip my foot in and out of) and "gasp" bar ends which I'm told to get rid of ASAP.

This is where I find it a bit counter intuitive. People bash up their shins when they slip off of their pedals. In order to not slip off the pedals, you want more grip. To get more grip, you need better traction (i.e. a more aggressive pedal). Many people decide to go less aggressive to scale back the damage the pedal will do. In my eyes they should really be correcting the problem instead of the outcome.

Side note: If you're worried about slipping off...start wearing shin guards until you get comfortable on flats.

 

[geargrrl]

No one is mentioning foot pressure... that's how you stay on flat pedal. The most aggressive pedals in the world won't help if you don't put weight into your feet. Pedal bashes come from an unweighted foot popping off a pedal and then.. you know.
We teach heavy feet, light hands. If you have a good balanced body position, pedals level, out of the saddle, practice light hands.... on a safe bit of trail hold your bars with one finger and feel the weight in your pedals. Also, heels down will help lock your foot into place.

 

[geargrrl]

Those bar ends.... with a new bike that wider bars, yes. Ditch them. You shouldn't need bar ends to climb with the new geometry. With the old geometry, you almost had to use them to get over the bike front enough to climb up a hill.

 

[geargrrl]

Re "Clipless being more efficient"... that's been disproven with science but the hardcore clipless riders still like to say it. They say it is the pulling up on the back of the pedal stroke that makes it more efficient. Here are three studies that you can look up if you want that disprove it.

In addition, clipless allows you to cheat on certain technique. An example is instead of loading the bike properly for rear wheel lifts or jumping, you can just pull up on your feet.

I rode clipped for 15 years, switched to flats about 10 years ago at the advice of one of my coaches, never looked back.

J.R. Van Sickle Jr, M.L Hull/ Journal of Biomechanics 2007 – This study showed no difference in power or economy between pushing through the ball of the foot and the mid-foot pedal position. They thought that there would be a decrease in those factors since you couldn’t use the ankles for leverage and push with them. However, this wasn’t the case and they found that pushing through the ball of the foot wasn’t “better” or the optimal way to apply power into the pedals. In fact, they also found that the mid-foot position took stress off of the calf and Achilles tendon, placing it on the hips.

ELMER, S. J., P. R. BARRATT, T. KORFF, and J. C. MARTIN. Medicine & Science in Sports & Exercise 2011 – This study found that the hips (glutes and hamstrings acting to extend the hip joint) were the major drivers of the pedal stroke at all intensity levels. This means that the quads are never the major driver of the pedal stroke.

Korff (et al. Med Sci Sports Exerc 2007; 39:991-995) and Mornieux (et al. Int J Sports Med 2008; 29:817-822) Cycling Efficiency Studies – These two studies showed that pulling up on the backstroke produces less power and burns more energy than simply driving hard on the downstroke and letting the trail leg come up just hard enough to get ready for the next hard downstroke push. Everything that I have seen, including EMG readings and anecdotal evidence, show that there is little to no power created on the backstroke and when you try to increase power by pulling up you decrease the power and efficiency of the whole pedal stroke.

Collectively, these studies have shown that:

1 – The mid-foot position also allows for better recruitment of the hips.

2 – The hips are the major muscles used in the pedal stroke.

3 – There is no need to pull up on the backstroke.

 

[santacruz skier]

Those bar ends.... with a new bike that wider bars, yes. Ditch them. You shouldn't need bar ends to climb with the new geometry. With the old geometry, you almost had to use them to get over the bike front enough to climb up a hill.

Did I mention I have a Voodoo circa late 90’s? So do I still ditch the bar ends? My road bike is nice Specialized Ruby carbon!

 

[geargrrl]

I would say yes. Unless you are going to keep narrow bars.
I highly recommend clinics for folks to learn to ride the modern geomertry.

 

[SallyCat]

You'll develop an awareness without really trying that will take care of pedal-shin scrapes pretty quickly in my experience. Try to get off the bike toward the rear rather than with your legs over the downtube, and pay attention to where your pedals are when you have either foot on the ground (you can really nail your calves with the pedal spikes if you're lazy about that; ask me how I know). Practicing track stands is great for developing pedal and brake awareness.

G-form makes a nice pair of shin guards, but you can also just wear cheap soccer shin guards for a while until you don't need them, which will likely happen pretty quickly.

In the past six years I don't think I've ever scraped my shins despite riding aggressively and without great competence. On challenging technical trails I do a lot of what I call "half-bails" where I don't clean a rocky feature and end up leaning against a tree or doing an impromptu track-stand-into-dab. My signature maneuver is a big strong pedal stroke into a feature that I then fail to clear and slam to a stop on. You get used to getting your feet down quickly and without the pedals touching your legs.

I'm psyched to see so many Divas getting into mountain biking!

 

[santacruz skier]

We have great mountain biking in my area. Used to ride every weekend for about 20 years. Now not so much but interested again especially after reading posts.
Below is about three miles up the coast from me and really great riding, not to mention views.

Wilder Ranch on Trailforks

The park has 34 miles of hiking, biking and equestrian trails winding through coastal terraces and valleys. Several restored buildings once belonging to the Wilder family are...

www.trailforks.com

 

[geargrrl]

Roxy inspired me to try flat pedals. Especially for hill climbing.

Coach Roxy is amazing. She is a fantastic teacher.

 

[SarahXC]

While I haven’t done in my shins on flat pedals I did gouge a hole in my crank arm on another bike loaded on the same bike rack on the car. The pedal got jammed rubbing on the other bike during a long days drive. I’m now very careful to secure the flats where they can’t rotate into another bike and do damage. Sharing hoping no else learns this one the hard way!

 

[geargrrl]

nnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn

 

[NYSnowflake]

My daughter just gave up my old 853 steel 26” mtb she had been using as a commuter upon finding a road bike better suited to the task. I’m looking forward to building it up and riding it again!

That sounds fun! If you have some xc trails nearby I am sure you will have a blast! My husband rides a 26” Titanium Lightspeed softail and gets tons of positive attention for that too. Sometimes it’s fun to just run what you brung (or what you found in the basement!).

 

[SarahXC]

If you have some xc trails nearby I am sure you will have a blast!

I live right by Pisgah National Forest so some amazing mountain biking!

 

[NYSnowflake]

I live right by Pisgah National Forest so some amazing mountain biking!

Wow! I rode there once when I first started MTB. What an incredible place!! Enjoy!!

 

[contesstant]

I wish I could remember the brand--it was a popular one--but not all pins on flats are created equal. I had (I think they were Crank Bros) and the pins wore down within a couple of months. I replaced them with a pair of Race Face Aeffect in a small and the pins are still crazy sharp after three seasons.

Another kind of odd consideration is that an aluminum pedal will make a lot louder noise on pedal strikes vs. a composite one. I prefer composite for that, however, my current pedals are aluminum and I've gotten used to it. (Sort of. I still find my body contorting and myself wincing in anticipation of or during a pedal strike.)

As for tearing up shins or calves, you will learn to avoid this happening. It still happens to me once in a blue moon, more so early in biking season, but you really do learn to give the pedals a wide berth during a sudden dismount. I can't get on board with wearing shin guards. I hate anything that hampers my knee, including while skiing. Also, hot. That being said, I do almost exclusively cross country riding and while I do ride some fairly technical terrain, I am fairly conservative as I hate crashing in general.