Question: Replace my boots or get new liners?

[scnelson]

I did a search and came across similar topics but they were from people with either really old boots, or boots that were a little too big where they were hoping new liners would take up space. In my case, my boots are in great shape but the liners have packed out. However, these were my first pair of boots so I don't know if they are too "beginner" and I'd be better served buying a more intermediate/advanced boot? I'm not a hard charger so I never felt like my boots were too soft but I don't know if 80 flex is appropriate for my size/ability or if I should move up to something stiffer.

2018 was my first year skiing and I bought Head Vector 80 ski boots in a 23.5 (I'm 5'2", 125 lbs). I believe they were the right size as they were tight but comfortable when I first put them on and the first few days of skiing, I had to unclip them between runs and take them off after a couple hours. Once they were broken in, they were very comfortable and I could ski pretty much all day without adjustments. After 40+ days skiing these boots, I noticed this past season that I had to really crank my buckles down to try to snug up the boots so I think my liners are shot.

1. Are these a decent enough boot that they are worth keeping if they are in excellent shape and fit my feet well?
2. If so, would getting an Intuition liner like maybe one of the Wrap styles work well in this boot? I want something that will last longer than the flimsy stock liners.
3. Any recommendations for a liner model that would work well with these Head boots? We do not live near any boot fitters so I can't try on any liners to see how they compare.

Thanks!

 

[ski diva]

I can't speak to the stiffness of the boot, because it isn't equivalent from one company to another. In other words, an 80 stiffness in a Head boot can be different from an 80 stiffness in an Atomic. There's no industry standard. However, 80 is on the low end, so it's possible you may need something stiffer. I don't think your boots are shot, though; 40 days isn't really that long. I usually go with about 150 days, so for me, that's two seasons. But if you're cranking them down too much, you may want to see a boot fitter. Maybe there's something they can do. Replacing the liners could certainly help. I have and LOVE the Intuition wrap liners, for a few reasons: 1) They get molded to your feet; 2) They make it easier to get the boots on and off, and 3) They're warmer than (many) standard boot liners.

Let us know what happens.

 

[lisaski]

I did a search and came across similar topics but they were from people with either really old boots, or boots that were a little too big where they were hoping new liners would take up space. In my case, my boots are in great shape but the liners have packed out. However, these were my first pair of boots so I don't know if they are too "beginner" and I'd be better served buying a more intermediate/advanced boot? I'm not a hard charger so I never felt like my boots were too soft but I don't know if 80 flex is appropriate for my size/ability or if I should move up to something stiffer.

2018 was my first year skiing and I bought Head Vector 80 ski boots in a 23.5 (I'm 5'2", 125 lbs). I believe they were the right size as they were tight but comfortable when I first put them on and the first few days of skiing, I had to unclip them between runs and take them off after a couple hours. Once they were broken in, they were very comfortable and I could ski pretty much all day without adjustments. After 40+ days skiing these boots, I noticed this past season that I had to really crank my buckles down to try to snug up the boots so I think my liners are shot.

1. Are these a decent enough boot that they are worth keeping if they are in excellent shape and fit my feet well?
2. If so, would getting an Intuition liner like maybe one of the Wrap styles work well in this boot? I want something that will last longer than the flimsy stock liners.
3. Any recommendations for a liner model that would work well with these Head boots? We do not live near any boot fitters so I can't try on any liners to see how they compare.

Thanks!

This is a great topic! In my experience, trying to find a new liner that fits well is a crap shoot. One thing that worked for me with an old pair of boots that still had a shell that was in perfect condition is to put an additional flat foot bed inside the liner below the current foot bed. Addition of a flat foot bed took up some of the volume so I no longer had to crank the buckles down. An alternative is to purchase something like a Sole heat moldable foot bed that is a bit thicker than your current footbed to replace the current one. That will give your boots more life. Additionally, I would consider purchasing a new boot as well with a stiffer cuff that you can migrate to or have as another boot option. Of course, to have a second boot that you can use concurrently with your older boot, the new boot's sole length would have to match that of your old boot so that both fit your skis.

 

[Jilly]

I just did that this spring. My Atomic's came with a "filler insole". Put that under my custom footbed and I got the rest of the season out of them.

I'm due for new boots, but stock was too limited in April. So waiting till fall. My boots are 6 years old, maybe 240 days, so they don't owe me anything.

 

[scnelson]

This is a great topic! In my experience, trying to find a new liner that fits well is a crap shoot.

That is one thing I'm concerned about. Are there some liners that only work well in a few boots or do most of them work out pretty well in most boots? My feet are fairly normal (not too skinny, not too wide, no real hotspots or anything that needed adjusting after the initial break in period). Being heat moldable, trying on various liners in a ski shop (which isn't an option for me anyway) wouldn't be an accurate representation of how they'd feel after molded. The reason I feel it's the liners that are shot is because up until this last season, I felt no need to synch down the buckles. It was really just the last 5 or so days where I started questioning if my liners were packed out.

So that's the dilemna because the shells are in great shape but I'd hate to spend a third or half of a new pair of boots, only to find out the liners don't work well in my Head boots. The liners aren't so bad that I couldn't get another season out of them and I'm not swimming in them but I do know stock liners, especially in less than expert boots, tend to break down quickly.

 

[badger]

Before deciding new liners are really necessary try moving the buckles over to the most lateral position. This will create s tighter fit. It's at least an option to try. I am sure you've already microadjusted the buckles, but that will also help a bit after you move the position of the buckle on your boots.
New liners can be tricky, but if that's what you need , they can be returned if they do not fit into your boots properly. Adding a very slim shim under the footbed can also help by raising your foot just enough that the boot feels tighter overall. You did not say where you feel the packing out has occurred. what part of the boot feels loose?

 

[AJM]

I'm in a similar situation .... new boots or new liners. I had a similar situation as you in the last days of last season ie the liners felt like they had packed out. It couldve been because it was Spring and the temps were warmer therefore everything seems to loosen up a bit ? I'm going to give it a day or so when our season starts (not long now !!!) then if mine still feel a little sloppy I'm going to get Intuition liners as my boots are still in great shape and I've spent a fortune on modifications on them what with Canting Plates etc etc. Good luck with your decision x

 

[marzNC]

That is one thing I'm concerned about. Are there some liners that only work well in a few boots or do most of them work out pretty well in most boots? My feet are fairly normal (not too skinny, not too wide, no real hotspots or anything that needed adjusting after the initial break in period). Being heat moldable, trying on various liners in a ski shop (which isn't an option for me anyway) wouldn't be an accurate representation of how they'd feel after molded. The reason I feel it's the liners that are shot is because up until this last season, I felt no need to synch down the buckles. It was really just the last 5 or so days where I started questioning if my liners were packed out.

So that's the dilemna because the shells are in great shape but I'd hate to spend a third or half of a new pair of boots, only to find out the liners don't work well in my Head boots. The liners aren't so bad that I couldn't get another season out of them and I'm not swimming in them but I do know stock liners, especially in less than expert boots, tend to break down quickly.

You need to have a discussion with a boot fitter that sells and molds liners such as Intuitions to know which version should work well with your particular pair of boots.

When the liners of the first pair of recreational 4-buckle boots packed out a dozen years ago, it was possible to get a replacement stock liner for under $50. The boots only cost about $300 and were pretty much designed for beginners. I wasn't skiing that many days per season back then and most days were short while skiing with kids who were advanced beginners. I live in North Carolina, which has a few good boot fitters but none who carry Intuition.

For the next pair of boots, I got Intuition liners as a replacement liners when the stock liners packed out. I did that at a ski shop at Alta. By then I'd learned that Intuition liners can be re-molded for new boots later on. Changing to Intuition liners made the boots somewhat stiffer, which was useful since I'd improved since buying them.

When I moved up to my current boots after becoming an advanced skier, they had pretty good heat-moldable liners. When the liners were starting to pack out (after 2 seasons with 50+ days each) I had an opportunity to talk with an experienced boot fitter in Mammoth who sold both Intution and Zipfit replacement liners. He confirmed that for my situation, re-molding the Intuition liners was a good idea. In fact, he did that for himself every season. Note that my current boots are 3-buckle, but work just as well with the PowerWrap as my 4-buckle boots did. I had them re-molded at a ski shop at a destination resort.

While it's possible to DIY molding Intuition liners, wasn't something I wanted to deal with. The liners can be re-molded but not indefinitely.

The other replacement I did for my current boots were the toe and heel pieces on the soles. I didn't used to be that good about using Cat Tracks at resorts where walking on hard surfaces like concrete is necessary.

 

[mustski]

You shared your height and weight but that is not enough of the story when it comes to boots. What is your current ski level and goals?
What is your shoe size and what are your foot and instep measurements. It is entirely possible that your boot is too big and once the liners packed out, that showed. However, it is also possible that new liners could buy you a couple of years. The next question is which liners? Zip Fit, Intuition, or Boot Doc? The answer really depends on your measurements.
Sit Down. Place your feet on a piece of paper and have a friend trace your feet. Now, measure the diagram in cm for length because boot sizing us in cm. And mm for width (last) The boot you are in is 23.5 cm length and approximately 96 mm width.
Length: longest toe to heel (cm)
Width: widest part of your foot. (mm)

now to measure instep … take a tape measure and run it around the front of your ankle to meet at the base of your heel. This measurement (in cm) should be the same as the length of your foot. If it is smaller, you need to go down a size and if it is larger, you need to go up a size. I

if any of your measurements are out of the ordinary - ie: length greater or less than 23 cm or width greater or less than 96 mm or instep greater or less than 23 cm… you need a professional bootfitter.

Sorry, if this is confusing. Boot fit us critical to enjoying the sport.

 

[scnelson]

You shared your height and weight but that is not enough of the story when it comes to boots. What is your current ski level and goals?
What is your shoe size and what are your foot and instep measurements. It is entirely possible that your boot is too big and once the liners packed out, that showed. However, it is also possible that new liners could buy you a couple of years. The next question is which liners? Zip Fit, Intuition, or Boot Doc? The answer really depends on your measurements.
Sit Down. Place your feet on a piece of paper and have a friend trace your feet. Now, measure the diagram in cm for length because boot sizing us in cm. And mm for width (last) The boot you are in is 23.5 cm length and approximately 96 mm width.
Length: longest toe to heel (cm)
Width: widest part of your foot. (mm)

now to measure instep … take a tape measure and run it around the front of your ankle to meet at the base of your heel. This measurement (in cm) should be the same as the length of your foot. If it is smaller, you need to go down a size and if it is larger, you need to go up a size. I

if any of your measurements are out of the ordinary - ie: length greater or less than 23 cm or width greater or less than 96 mm or instep greater or less than 23 cm… you need a professional bootfitter.

Sorry, if this is confusing. Boot fit us critical to enjoying the sport.

Thanks!

-Size 6.5 to 7 shoes
-Feet are 22.7cm long
-Width is about 85mm
-Instep is hard to measure because I don't know how far back around the heal to go but it's about 24cm (maybe less if I don't go as far back on the heal).
-And shell fitting, I have about 18-20mm in the back of the boot with my toes just touching the front. According to the Intuition website, that puts me on the tighter end of the spectrum so the length appears to be correct.

Researching the various Intuition options, one of the wrap models (power or pro) seems like it could be a good fit as they add some stiffness. My husband loves his Zipfits but they tend to not be as warm as other liners and I tend to get cold hands and feet so I think I'd prefer Intuitions for the warmth factor. Do any of you know how the Intuitions fit in Head boots?

Or, like others suggested, I could try shims under the footbed to take up some room. My husband put those in the kids boots when they were in between sizes so I think we have some of those around hear.

 

[scnelson]

I watched a video online on measuring instep and got 22.5-23 on the 2nd measurement along with 24 on the 1st so it's somewhere right around 23 give or take a little depending upon where exactly on the heal one measures from.

 

[mustski]

It sounds like length and instep match up well which is good news but your feet are very narrow. What is likely to happen is that intuition liners won’t help -for long -In your situation. A zip fit or a boot doc will take up a bit of space and hold your foot better.The zip fits will also add stiffness. Zip fits or intuitions will transfer to future shells of the same size but boot docs won’t. It’s a tricky decision really. The boots you are in may be too soft and the zip fit liners are expensive. It’s probably best to consider new boots but you need to see a proper professional fitter. There are definite differences between boots. I need a shaped boot with good heel hold because I have skinny heels. I don’t have enough knowledge about the shape of different brands to choose my own boot. If you need to extend for another season, either zip fits or intuitions are a decent choice. Both require a fitter to mold them to your feet although intuitions can be done at home with a sock full of rice. Where do you ski? There may be fitters near there that someone can recommend. It’s always risky to do it ourselves.

If you must buy online, go to their website and follow their fitting instructions.

https://intuitionliners.com/fitting-information-form/