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Opinions wanted - new ski choices
- Thread starter Gilly
- Start date
SarahXC
Ski Diva Extraordinaire
I had the Nordica Sentra 6 and sold them to @Mistletoes. They were nice when the snow was firm but I ski “spring conditions” all year here in NC and they were too narrow for the pushed piles and not damp enough for my taste in those conditions. I replaced them with a 84 underfoot ski (Kastle mx 84 limited so still very frontside oriented) I think she has enjoyed them from one of her initial posts but I’m not sure how much skiing she has done since.
Iwannaski
Angel Diva
Oooooh, @Gilly .... your post got me thinking and I have a question for (mostly) the instructors, but really any ski geeks (aka, everyone here?)
Facts - I think.
1) we know narrower skis are harder to float on softer surfaces - based on what I have read this has to do with the amount of effort required to keep the tips up?
2) wider skis are easier to float, but harder to get on edge because of the leverage required
Do instructors prefer that we get narrower skis when learning specific skills/techniques because it forces us to focus more on the managing the ski rather than just letting it hang out on the surface? OR is it because if you’re having a hard time getting to an edge that having that shorter distance to the fulcrum is more likely to reinforce the feeling/right behavior?
Facts - I think.
1) we know narrower skis are harder to float on softer surfaces - based on what I have read this has to do with the amount of effort required to keep the tips up?
2) wider skis are easier to float, but harder to get on edge because of the leverage required
Do instructors prefer that we get narrower skis when learning specific skills/techniques because it forces us to focus more on the managing the ski rather than just letting it hang out on the surface? OR is it because if you’re having a hard time getting to an edge that having that shorter distance to the fulcrum is more likely to reinforce the feeling/right behavior?
So I grew up with the straight skis, even got my instructors L2 on them. And we skied powder on them. But...
As to narrower skis to learn on yes!! For some reason the shops/magazines/even the manufacturers are pushing 90+ skis on everyone. The best learning tool is going to be 80/84 and lower. That width will give a beginner a solid base to work with.
But if the goal is to learn how to carve, then sub 80 is even better. Much easier to get the skis on edge. And probably not as soft.
As for float, Saturday I was skiing with an instructor friend at Tremblant. She is on the Head i-speed. So not a wide ski. I'm on old Hero ST Ca's as those have "rock ski" status. Don't really care about the bases on these. I'm trying to "surf" the slush. She is carving through it. Followed her and things went smoother. Less ski in the slush, less surface for it to grab, better speed through the slush. Physics!! So do you need a wider ski?
As to narrower skis to learn on yes!! For some reason the shops/magazines/even the manufacturers are pushing 90+ skis on everyone. The best learning tool is going to be 80/84 and lower. That width will give a beginner a solid base to work with.
But if the goal is to learn how to carve, then sub 80 is even better. Much easier to get the skis on edge. And probably not as soft.
As for float, Saturday I was skiing with an instructor friend at Tremblant. She is on the Head i-speed. So not a wide ski. I'm on old Hero ST Ca's as those have "rock ski" status. Don't really care about the bases on these. I'm trying to "surf" the slush. She is carving through it. Followed her and things went smoother. Less ski in the slush, less surface for it to grab, better speed through the slush. Physics!! So do you need a wider ski?
Maybe, but a good cheater slalom ski will do too. Why I ski the Hero ST Ti. It's not a "race ski", but it is a throughbred.
@echo_NY I'm pretty sure his were 2017 or 2018 Dobermann Slalom Pros or something close to that. No idea how much change has happened with newer models. The 165s felt a smidge long. They were super easy and snappy edge to edge. I found them damp but never had them anywhere near up to speed. They are stiff skis for sure but I didn't find them offensively so for what we did compared to the Kenjas. We were on groomers that were in great shape that just had a few inches groomed in and some previously groomed (like a day or two prior) with a few inches of snow on top. these had some icy spots lurking. I'll admit I got all "in my head" over the latter and it took me a full run to trust the skis and stop skiing that like there was a snake lurking to attack. I'm not sure that they would qualify as playful but they might have felt more so if they didn't feel long.
@Iwannaski @Jilly pretty much nailed my understanding. Easier edge to edge like you mentioned and also this instructor would prefer I don't have a big rocker on either end. I got the impression he believes forgiving skis with big rocker profiles are going to hide flaws in technique while a full camber narrow ski develop the foot work patterns that will translate into any ski going forward.
@Jilly skiing powder in the narrower ski was a conversation we had two, much like your example of carving the slush, he prefers his slalom skis up until like 6-8 plus. I'm going to butcher the explanation either way but he explained for the most part you aren't really "floating" on that you are still skiing the bottom. I thought that was interesting and made some sense.
He is a truly beautiful skier to watch who loves to turn and carve - like watching an ice skater. So all of this conversation makes sense to me for that style of skiing.
@scandium Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but much like the Heros that @Jilly just mentioned I think the three I'm considering derive from race heritage. For sure the skis I borrowed do (and I may try and find a shorter pair of those). I feel like I just understanding the tip of the iceberg on all of this.
@Jilly skiing powder in the narrower ski was a conversation we had two, much like your example of carving the slush, he prefers his slalom skis up until like 6-8 plus. I'm going to butcher the explanation either way but he explained for the most part you aren't really "floating" on that you are still skiing the bottom. I thought that was interesting and made some sense.
He is a truly beautiful skier to watch who loves to turn and carve - like watching an ice skater. So all of this conversation makes sense to me for that style of skiing.
@scandium Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but much like the Heros that @Jilly just mentioned I think the three I'm considering derive from race heritage. For sure the skis I borrowed do (and I may try and find a shorter pair of those). I feel like I just understanding the tip of the iceberg on all of this.
If you liked the Dobermann, I think the SL will be too soft. But I haven't been on them. We didn't have any demo's this year. And the rep recommended for me the SLC's over the women's skis when I was looking. I probably should have been looking at the SL7 as I found the SLC too stiff.
I have friends that ski big mountains out west. None of them are on skis over 86mm. But they all come from a race program background and eastern skiing.
I have friends that ski big mountains out west. None of them are on skis over 86mm. But they all come from a race program background and eastern skiing.
elemmac
Angel Diva
Seems to me you answered the question before you asked it. To "surf" the slush; a wider ski will work better. To carve "through" the slush; your narrow skis are perfect. Personally...I like to surf it. I think it's more fun with less work. Other people enjoy carving through it more.
Mistletoes
Ski Diva Extraordinaire
I like them very much! I put somewhere between 20 to 30 days on them this season and they definitely helped me improve my technique. I have a lot of fun on them on firm days. Like you said, pushed piles and spring skiing is not their specialty. I see all the race kids and coaches skiing beautifully in these conditions on race skis but I do not have the skills. I'm keeping them for firm days but also just purchased 2021 BP 88s for variable conditions.
