• Women skiers, this is the place for you -- an online community without the male-orientation you'll find in conventional ski magazines and internet ski forums. At TheSkiDiva.com, you can connect with other women to talk about skiing in a way that you can relate to, about things that you find of interest. Be sure to join our community to participate (women only, please!). Registration is fast and simple. Just be sure to add [email protected] to your address book so your registration activation emails won't be routed as spam. And please give careful consideration to your user name -- it will not be changed once your registration is confirmed.

Help Needed: New Zealand - please help me to choose first skis

florentinella

Certified Ski Diva
Hi all, I have been reading various sites and posts on this forum but I'm still none the wiser... Please help me choose first skis - but specifically for New Zealand South Island conditions.

I skied Cardrona last year (Amazing!), this year we are going to Mt Hutt, Coronet and the Remarkables - will get maybe 12-15 days of skiing.
About me - I only learned to ski in my mid 40s that is 5 years ago in Europe. A year later I ended up with a knee injury - ACL - long story and I'm blaming the rental gear ...:injured:I had a break for 2 years, but with physio and exercise I managed to ski again and have no problems or pain but I'm careful. I take my time and I just enjoy the ride rather than try to get to the bottom as fast as possible. I had a few lessons, and want to improve my technique, my turns, etc but I won't be doing any crazy fast skiing off piste...

Last year I demoed black crows vertis birdie and omg they were SOO much nicer than the rentals, so I decided to invest in my own gear even though I don't ski that much. Or maybe because I don't ski that much I actually want to fully enjoy the few days I get on the snow!

What I'm confused the most is the description the manufacturers give to the skis and whether they are truly applicable to NZ conditions. Groomed/piste vs powder/off-piste. I stick to the trails but I didn't find them (trails in Cardrona and def not Mr Ruapehu) particularly well groomed (vs what you get in Europe and I guess in North America). Do I need more of All Mountain skis rather than specifically for "groomed trails"?? And so - would they need to be wider than 88??

In a shop where I bought my boots (Salomon S Pro 90) I was recommended Belle 78 as super amazing and so easy to turn. I was also told about Black Pearls 88, and my friend swears by her Santa Ana 88. I realise these two are the most popular skis - and I'm fine with it.

I read that : "Santa Ana 88 is the Black Pearl 88's sister: Built in the same factory, by the same people as the super popular Black Pearl 88, the Santa Ana 88 is an easier to ski version -- basically. The Santa Ana 88 is going to feel more nimble than the Black Pearl 88, which comes into play if you're skiing off trail or at lower speeds. The Santa Ana 88 can still hold its own on hardpack but the speed limit isn't quite as high. If you want a forgiving ski that can hold on hard pack this is everything you'll need."
I want something easy to ski at a lower speed haha

I'm not going to have a chance to demo these skis, so just need to choose. Anything is going to ski better than rentals anyway ;) but still would like to make the right decision as this will be my only pair.

What would you recommend:
Belle 78
Black Pearl 88
Santa Ana 88
or maybe something completely different???

I'm 165cm = 5'5, and 69kg = 152lb (I was hoping to be less but it's not happening ;)
Thank you so much for any advice and recommendations!
 

Soujan

Angel Diva
Is there something about the Vertis that you didn't like that it is not on your list? I have the Black Crows Orb which I love.
 

florentinella

Certified Ski Diva
Is there something about the Vertis that you didn't like that it is not on your list? I have the Black Crows Orb which I love.
I only tried them as they were there, and wanted to see how proper skis can feel. From reading - I get a feel they are more advanced for my needs? Besides, I tried length 159 whereas I perhaps should go with something closer to 150 ...
 

Jilly

Moderator
Staff member
I have the Santa Anna's. These skis, ski short. So you'll need at least the same length as mine. 165 cm.
 

Soujan

Angel Diva
I only tried them as they were there, and wanted to see how proper skis can feel. From reading - I get a feel they are more advanced for my needs? Besides, I tried length 159 whereas I perhaps should go with something closer to 150 ...
Why do you feel like you should go for the shorter length? I am 3 inches shorter than you and 10 lbs less and I'm on a 159 Orb. 159 would probably be a good length for you. Did the Vertis feel too difficult to control and maneuver? The Vertis is an intermediate ski with no metal. The Santa Ana has metal and would be more fatiguing for you.
 

Jilly

Moderator
Staff member
Was there any of the rentals you skied that you remember and liked?

I too think the SA 88's might be too much ski....The BP's though...But again 150 will be too short.
 

Knitjenious

Angel Diva
I only tried them as they were there, and wanted to see how proper skis can feel. From reading - I get a feel they are more advanced for my needs? Besides, I tried length 159 whereas I perhaps should go with something closer to 150 ...
If you tried them and liked them, that is a strong endorsement. Don't worry too much about the "level." And 159 for your height with an all mountain rocker doesn't sound too long-- especially if you enjoyed demoing them! The 85 mm width of the Vertis Birdie seems like it will probably be able to handle a variety of groomed-ish conditions without being overly hard on knees.

Tl;Dr enjoying a ski you tried is a good enough reason to buy that one! :smile:
 

florentinella

Certified Ski Diva
Why do you feel like you should go for the shorter length? I am 3 inches shorter than you and 10 lbs less and I'm on a 159 Orb. 159 would probably be a good length for you. Did the Vertis feel too difficult to control and maneuver? The Vertis is an intermediate ski with no metal. The Santa Ana has metal and would be more fatiguing for you.
No, they felt lovely! But I thought ANYTHING will feel better than rentals... please excuse my ignorance - What does the metal do?
 

florentinella

Certified Ski Diva
Was there any of the rentals you skied that you remember and liked?

I too think the SA 88's might be too much ski....The BP's though...But again 150 will be too short.
rentals were usually Head and Atomic. Nothing special.
150ish - 152 - that's what I was recommended in the shop ...
I'm 165 - so it's 15cm shorter than me - which rings a bell for a correct length??
But maybe it doesnt take into consideration how "long or short" they ski??
 

florentinella

Certified Ski Diva
If you tried them and liked them, that is a strong endorsement. Don't worry too much about the "level." And 159 for your height with an all mountain rocker doesn't sound too long-- especially if you enjoyed demoing them! The 85 mm width of the Vertis Birdie seems like it will probably be able to handle a variety of groomed-ish conditions without being overly hard on knees.

Tl;Dr enjoying a ski you tried is a good enough reason to buy that one! :smile:
Oh yes, I should have said that's probably the most important thing - to be easy on my knees!

As Birdie were the only skis I actually tried, I just wanted to find out if there is something better / easier for me? I'm just not sure if they are right as I have not tried anything else...
 

AJM

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
Hello, fellow Nzer here, I'm in the camp that says if you enjoyed a ski then that is reason enough to buy !!!
I'm also the same height as you and around 55-57Kg depending on what I've been snacking on and I currently ski the Blizzard Sheeva 9's 164cm as they ski short due to rocker, my previous ski's were Black Pearls 88's at 159cm as they dont have as much rocker so you definately want something in that size range.

I'm coming back from injury this coming season so will potentially be looking for a narrower ski if my Sheevas prove to be too much for my knees, I'm looking at the Fischer RC1's which I think are about 78 underfoot to ease back into the game but only because I have a friend who's selling hers so I have them on standby.

Where are you planning on buying them from? I only ask as Gnomes ski shop in Darfield are super helpful and if you got in touch with them I'm sure they could get you on the right ski .... ask for Leith or Ally.
 

florentinella

Certified Ski Diva
Hello, fellow Nzer here, I'm in the camp that says if you enjoyed a ski then that is reason enough to buy !!!
I'm also the same height as you and around 55-57Kg depending on what I've been snacking on and I currently ski the Blizzard Sheeva 9's 164cm as they ski short due to rocker, my previous ski's were Black Pearls 88's at 159cm as they dont have as much rocker so you definately want something in that size range.

I'm coming back from injury this coming season so will potentially be looking for a narrower ski if my Sheevas prove to be too much for my knees,
are narrower skis easier on the knees? What about Belle 78?
Where are you planning on buying them from? I only ask as Gnomes ski shop in Darfield are super helpful and if you got in touch with them I'm sure they could get you on the right ski .... ask for Leith or Ally
thanks for that recommendation. I don't mind where I buy them - most likely online as I'm in the capital ;) unless it's something the one and only local store stocks or can order in...
I wanted to decide on the skis first - hope that makes sense ;)
 

scandium

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
I would strongly suggest you try and get "demo rentals" to get an idea of what you like rather than purchasing an unknown ski online! Or just buy the skis you already liked. It's better than getting stuck with something you hate, unless you get such a good deal online (>50% off) that you can resell easily for the same price. All of the ski fields you have named can offer this, or you can ask at ski stores for their demo fleet.

Overall, wider is harder on knees but the sidecut, skiier style etc also play a role in this. I would definitely not suggest a 150cm ski for you as it is likely to be unstable and too short, even if you want to go slower it will likely be a hinderance to your confidence. Around high 150s to low 160s is probably better. I ski in the mid-150s for nearly everything, on the same fields you mentioned, and I'm about 55kg at the moment.
 

Soujan

Angel Diva
What does the metal do?
Ski are made of all sorts of different materials now besides just wood. Metal makes a ski heavier and stiffer and requires more power to be applied to the ski for them flex and make contact with the snow.

are narrower skis easier on the knees? What about Belle 78?
I have a bad left knee. A wider ski requires you to angle yourself more to get the ski up on edge when carving, which puts more strain on your knees. I can use a ski up to 90mm waist width without any issues. Anything above that, I instantly felt pain in my knee when I make right turns.

150ish - 152 - that's what I was recommended in the shop ...
I'm 165 - so it's 15cm shorter than me - which rings a bell for a correct length??
But maybe it doesnt take into consideration how "long or short" they ski??
Ski length is more than just height and weight. It's skier ability, personal preference, and ski shape. When we say the ski feels "short" it really has to do with the amount of effective edge the ski has. Effective edge is how much of the ski has contact with the snow which will vary from ski to ski depending on how much rocker or camber a ski has. The more tip or tail rocker, the shorter the ski will feel due to less snow contact. If the 159 Vertis felt good, then you should probably stay with that length.
 

Jilly

Moderator
Staff member
are narrower skis easier on the knees? What about Belle 78?
Yes. And there is getting to be more research on it. But it also depends on what you're skiing on. Harder snow and wide skis can be an issue for some. (ME!!) Depends on how bad the knees feel. I have osteo-arthritis and my knees can hurt on a good day.

As a first ski the Belle wouldn't be a bad idea.
 

marzNC

Angel Diva
About me - I only learned to ski in my mid 40s that is 5 years ago in Europe. A year later I ended up with a knee injury - ACL - long story and I'm blaming the rental gear ...:injured:I had a break for 2 years, but with physio and exercise I managed to ski again and have no problems or pain but I'm careful. I take my time and I just enjoy the ride rather than try to get to the bottom as fast as possible. I had a few lessons, and want to improve my technique, my turns, etc but I won't be doing any crazy fast skiing off piste...

Last year I demoed black crows vertis birdie and omg they were SOO much nicer than the rentals, so I decided to invest in my own gear even though I don't ski that much. Or maybe because I don't ski that much I actually want to fully enjoy the few days I get on the snow!

What I'm confused the most is the description the manufacturers give to the skis and whether they are truly applicable to NZ conditions. Groomed/piste vs powder/off-piste. I stick to the trails but I didn't find them (trails in Cardrona and def not Mr Ruapehu) particularly well groomed (vs what you get in Europe and I guess in North America). Do I need more of All Mountain skis rather than specifically for "groomed trails"?? And so - would they need to be wider than 88??

In a shop where I bought my boots (Salomon S Pro 90) I was recommended Belle 78 as super amazing and so easy to turn. I was also told about Black Pearls 88, and my friend swears by her Santa Ana 88. I realise these two are the most popular skis - and I'm fine with it.
Welcome! Looks like the NZ season will start off sooner rather than later in 2023. Glad you were able to fully recover after the ACL injury.

I'm an older skier who didn't start regular lessons until after age 50 after successful knee rehab. My first good skis were 75 underfoot. I was an adventurous intermediate skiing under 20 days a season, mostly on groomed trails at a small hill as my daughter learned to ski (starting age 4) plus a 1-week spring break trip with my daughter at a destination resort (starting age 7). It wasn't until a decade later that I decided that for me "all-mountain" meant mid-80s underfoot. I'm petite and skiing 50+ days a season these days.

The season right after I finished knee rehab (about 6 months), I used a pair of skis that were 72 underfoot and 5cm shorter than my own skis at my home hill. Had them around after getting a great deal as my daughter's next pair of skis. By the time we did our spring break trip, I was comfortable on my 75mm skis.

Narrower skis in the mid-70s are much easier to turn on groomed trails than wide skis in >90mm underfoot. Skis that are on the short side may feel easier to turn on the easiest trails but unstable at faster speeds on intermediate trails. Typically women renting skis are given skis at a beginner length, even when the form is filled out as Advanced.

From what you've said so far, going with the Belle 78 from the ski shop who helped you with boots or getting the Black Crow Vertis Birdie makes good sense. Black Crow skis became popular with Divas fairly quickly for a reason. I've demo'd other Black Crow models and have been impressed.
 

AJM

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
thanks for that recommendation. I don't mind where I buy them - most likely online as I'm in the capital ;) unless it's something the one and only local store stocks or can order in...
I wanted to decide on the skis first - hope that makes sense ;)
Gnomes have a feature on their website that helps you choose a ski, its on their home page right at the bottom called "Ski Finder Form", you basically answer some questions about ability, where you ski etc etc and they get back to you with suggestions x
 

AJM

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
I have a bad left knee. A wider ski requires you to angle yourself more to get the ski up on edge when carving, which puts more strain on your knees. I can use a ski up to 90mm waist width without any issues. Anything above that, I instantly felt pain in my knee when I make right turns. I'm the opposite to you ..... I'm going to have issues turning left
I'm the opposite to you ..... I'm going to have issues turning left if my experiments in the living room are anything to go by :laughter:
 

florentinella

Certified Ski Diva
Welcome! Looks like the NZ season will start off sooner rather than later in 2023. Glad you were able to fully recover after the ACL injury.

I'm an older skier who didn't start regular lessons until after age 50 after successful knee rehab. My first good skis were 75 underfoot. I was an adventurous intermediate skiing under 20 days a season, mostly on groomed trails at a small hill as my daughter learned to ski (starting age 4) plus a 1-week spring break trip with my daughter at a destination resort (starting age 7). It wasn't until a decade later that I decided that for me "all-mountain" meant mid-80s underfoot. I'm petite and skiing 50+ days a season these days.

The season right after I finished knee rehab (about 6 months), I used a pair of skis that were 72 underfoot and 5cm shorter than my own skis at my home hill. Had them around after getting a great deal as my daughter's next pair of skis. By the time we did our spring break trip, I was comfortable on my 75mm skis.

Narrower skis in the mid-70s are much easier to turn on groomed trails than wide skis in >90mm underfoot. Skis that are on the short side may feel easier to turn on the easiest trails but unstable at faster speeds on intermediate trails. Typically women renting skis are given skis at a beginner length, even when the form is filled out as Advanced.

From what you've said so far, going with the Belle 78 from the ski shop who helped you with boots or getting the Black Crow Vertis Birdie makes good sense. Black Crow skis became popular with Divas fairly quickly for a reason. I've demo'd other Black Crow models and have been impressed.
Thank you, this is very insightful! I have learned so much already from everyone's replies, I'm so grateful!
 

florentinella

Certified Ski Diva
Ski are made of all sorts of different materials now besides just wood. Metal makes a ski heavier and stiffer and requires more power to be applied to the ski for them flex and make contact with the snow.


I have a bad left knee. A wider ski requires you to angle yourself more to get the ski up on edge when carving, which puts more strain on your knees. I can use a ski up to 90mm waist width without any issues. Anything above that, I instantly felt pain in my knee when I make right turns.


Ski length is more than just height and weight. It's skier ability, personal preference, and ski shape. When we say the ski feels "short" it really has to do with the amount of effective edge the ski has. Effective edge is how much of the ski has contact with the snow which will vary from ski to ski depending on how much rocker or camber a ski has. The more tip or tail rocker, the shorter the ski will feel due to less snow contact. If the 159 Vertis felt good, then you should probably stay with that length.
Thank you, this is so helpful!
 

Forum statistics

Threads
26,235
Messages
497,576
Members
8,503
Latest member
MermaidKelly
Top