Need help with new ski boots - Nordica GTS.

[akjen]

Ok, I finally bought new ski boots this year after skiing for several years in waaayyy too big boots (i.e., never knew what it felt like to have my toes touch the boot). I'm 35 y.o., 5'3", 125 lb, been skiing for about 7 years, about a level 7-8, prefer blacks and blues. So I went to our local boot shop and ended up with the Atomic B80 boots in a size 24. I took them out about 3 times - the first time they were pretty snug, but I could tell the HUGE improvement in control. By the 3rd time, I was doing double black runs for the first time! The only thing is that I started to feel my heel lift significantly more by the end of the day. Well, I brought them back to the store to ask about it, and the guy (same one who fitted me) did a shell fit and said they could switch them out for a different, smaller boot. I was a little hesitant because I really liked the boots, but he said he could easily fit 2 fingers behind the heel. So I ended up with the Nordica Olympia GTS 6 in a size 23 which were VERY snug around my foot. I skiied on them for a couple hours and am having major issues: I feel like I'm being pitched down the mountain, that my knees are bent too far forward, my quads burn, I feel like I can't straighten out my right leg when I try to carve to the left. Plus my feet were numb most of the time, but I couldn't figure out if it was because it was 0 deg or the snugness (probably both). Anyway, is this boot completely wrong for me? The flex index is 50-60; how do I know if that's too soft?

Jen

 

[dburdenbates]

Hey Jen!

Is this guy that fitted you an actual custom boot fitter? I'm no expert, but I do know I have 12 hours of custom work in my boots. I would think that if this guy is good, he could make some alterations to the boots you like to help the heel lift instead of putting you into a completely different boot. Just my .02. If you live in or near Summit County, CO, I know a fantastic boot fitter. Otherwise, maybe one of the other Divas knows a fitter near where you are.

 

[akjen]

Dawn,

Thanks for your reply. Actually I went back today to talk to him, and he ended up doing exactly what you said! I'm back in the Atomics with heel lifts. The Nordicas were too soft, and that's what I was having problems with.

Unfortunately, I'm up in AK, so not so near to your bootfitter...

Jen

 

[SnowGlider]

I think this needs a little more thought

I had a similar experience to yours this season. I was skiing for years in boots that had 2 generous fingers in the shell and it significantly impacted my skiing.

This season I dropped down a full size. I now have slightly more that 1 finger in the shell. I think this is a good compromise between a race boot and a comfort boot.

If the shell size is right, I don't think you will have the cramping you describe. But bear in mind that it really, really is true that the liners will pack out a full size. When I first bought my new boots, I couldn't stand up straight because my toes were jammed against the end. It was pretty uncomfortable. After 4 or 5 days of skiing, my toes now have all the room they need. So I concluded that when you leave the shop you have to be thinking, "Man, these boots are uncomfortably tight. I'm not sure these are going to work" (as opposed to, "Good God, these are absolutely killing me.") But again, I think having 1 finger or slightly more should insure the right shell size.

The shop seems to have made a poor choice for you with the Nordica Olympia GTS 6. Nordica's flex system goes from 50 to 130 (same as Atomica), so they had you at the very bottom end of that scale, which seems inconsistent with the steep terrain you want to do. That makes me wonder about the expertise of this shop.

Finally, it's necessary to distinguish between being able to lift your heel up to, say, 1/2" but no more when you try deliberately (which you can do in most any boot that fits right), and having the heel lift of its own accord while you're skiing and putting forward pressure---that you do not want. You also don't want any side-to-side movement in the heel or forefoot.

The Atomic B80 is described as an intermediate recreational boot, but it has a flex index of 80 (on a scale of 50 to 130). However, stiffness also refers to LATERAL stiffness, so make sure this boot has all the support you need for your double blacks.

The B80 has a pretty wide forefoot (104 mm) and narrow heel. Is that your foot shape?

*** My concern about the Atomic B80 is that if you noticed a significant change in fit in the course of a single day, this boot may pack out considerably more and you may find it too large. You will have, I think, much better luck stretching a slightly too small boot than padding a too large boot. If you're between sizes, you're going to need this fitting.

If you have a wide forefoot and narrow heel, I can strongly recommend the Head S9 (or S11 if you want a more aggressive boot), which has a choice of 2 different lasts (100mm and 103 mm) depending on the width of your forefoot. See my review in the gear review forum and also https://www.head.com/ski/products.php?region=us&tag=freeride&id=677

The Head Dream Thang would also be a good option. The Dream Thang is apparently replacing the S series, so you could get the S9 at a better price right now. I paid $330 but you can find it for less than that. The S9 is the equivalent of the Dream Thang 10. I found that the Head website offered pretty complete information that allowed me to make an educated choice.

A concern I have about women's boots in the recreational category is a liner that is too thick and soft, which I think will pack out more quickly than the thinner liners in the performance category, or compared to men's boots. However, Head is known for its liners that don't pack out as much as other brands.

My advice is that you research this and think it through a little more before skiing with the Atomic B80s again. List the criteria that you are looking for:

--foot shape
--ability level
--preferred skiing style (speed, aggression))
--preferred terrain
--snow type

And then make sure the boots you try meet your most important criteria. Clarify the return policy with the store before you ski with the Atomic B80s again. Don't be distressed if you have to demo several boots before finding the right one. This is not unusual. Find a shop that will work with you through a few trial pairs.

Finally, be aware that a custom footbed is pretty important.

Here's a good website for ski boot reviews: https://www.bootfitters.com/07_reviews.htm

 

[SnowGlider]

Here's a great boot fitting article

https://www.bootfitters.com/custom_boot_fit_tips.htm

 

[akjen]

SnowGlider,

Thanks for the info. We went with the Atomics because I do have a wide forefoot and narrow heel. I can just fit 2 fingers behind the heel. I may have to check out the Heads though - especially the wider last.

 

[SnowGlider]

In my experience, if you are a level 7-8 skier a 2-finger shell fit is way too big. I went through many pairs of boots before realizing that a performance fit is one finger or slightly more.

 

[volklgirl]

In my experience, the Atomic boots tend to run wide all over and are not really a good fit for a narrow heel. Plus, they tend to pack out faster and more than some other boots. However, if the shell is the correct length and you just love the boot, they can experiment with custom insoles, heel lifts maybe, and saddle pads to tame the heel slop. Keep in mind, though, that a padded boot will never feel and perform as well as a boot that was properly fitted and the correct shape for your foot to begin with.

Manufacturers that tend to fit the narrow heel/wide forefoot better are: Nordica, Head (too snug in the toes for me), Salomon (very wide in the forefoot and toe area), and Lange (the best fit for very narrow heels although major toe box work may be required for toe wiggle room).

Oh, and second SnowGlider on the 2 finger fit. Great for the recreational skier, but not a peformance fit and by the time the liner packs out it will be a 3-4 finger fit .

 

[SnowHot]

Manufacturers that tend to fit the narrow heel/wide forefoot better are: Nordica, Head (too snug in the toes for me), Salomon (very wide in the forefoot and toe area), and Lange (the best fit for very narrow heels although major toe box work may be required for toe wiggle room).

I tried some Nordica Beasts and didn't like the fit at all, for a narrow anything. Slop all the way through the foot area. I understand that many boot mfg are getting different lines to fit different feet, like the SpeedMachines are directed at a lower volume foot while the Beasts are directed at the wider foot. I know the Dalbello line has a Low volume target for the Krypton but the remainder of their line is directed at the high volume foot consumer.

As for the 2 finger fit. If the shell is properly fitted with a two finger fit, you will get a lot of use out of that boot before you need to replace them, which is fine because you should replace your boots every couple of years anyway.

 

[akjen]

I think I'm going to have to stay with the Atomics for now, because the shop I'm working with has very limited stock on hand (they close down for the summer). However, the boot fitter will work with me. Being up in Alaska, I don't have alot of options around - there's another place in town (a national chain) but they sold me my original boots 4 years ago and those were so big, my foot actually came out of the boot once while skiing!

I would say I'm an intermediate/advanced skier - becoming more aggressive as I improve. So hopefully the atomics will hold me thru for the next year or two. I'd like to race one day - once my kids (16 months and 3 years) are in school or skiing themselves...