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Help Needed: Low volume boots - options

MrsPlow

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
Yet another post about boot fit I'm afraid.

I've had some problems with my current boots - Nordica Striders. Finally got the left boot pretty much where I want (ie not eating my ankle for breakfast) and this year the right boot is playing up. Also finding that I get bounced out of the heel pocket in both boots in bumpy terrain. On groomers or other predictable terrain they're fine, but my right ankle is taking a battering when I'm in the fun, bouncy off-piste stuff and not 100% keeping things smooth.

I thought I'd try again, this time with a dedicated alpine boot - I spend most of my time inbounds so thought it was worth maybe getting away from any compromises inherent in a hybrid boot. So a visit to a different bootfitter and it turns out that while the length of the boot I'm in is fine (24.5), volume is 23.5. Also my right footbed is not giving me enough support, which I'd suspected for a few weeks. I tried on a 23.5 Salomon S Max 110 W and it did fit more snugly around the ankle and heel - I'd tried the same boot in a 24.5 and liked it but was concerned it was a bit too comfy to be ok after the initial wearing-in period. The 23.5 didn't seem like a ridiculously tight fit when I tried it on, so I am considering it.

I would rather stick with the 24.5 if I can largely because I've got a few pairs of skis that'd need to be remounted (previous boots were also 24.5 but were 10mm longer in BSL - ugh), and I'm hoping I can still use the Striders for touring, hopefully using new footbeds which is more likely to work if both boots are 24.5. Can anyone recommend any low volume boots that aren't super narrow that I could see if are available around here? ie something that might give me the ankle and heel fit in a 24.5? I have a feeling that the Salomons in the smaller size are probably my only option though...

Thanks!
 

MrsPlow

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
Depending on your binding, there may be enough "play" in them and not need a total remount.

No, pretty sure they won't. I had a pair of Tecnica boots that were also 24.5 but the BSL was 295; current 24.5 boots are 285 so a couple of pairs had to be remounted when I got my last pair. Those that weren't remounted at that time will need to be remounted now. Yes I have too many pairs of skis...
 

MissySki

Angel Diva
Do you have a very low instep? I do and I size down to a 23.5 for downhill because of it. My instep actually measures even smaller, so this is a bit of a compromise because I don’t think the other proportions of my foot outside of instep height and super skinny heel could handle smaller. I’m a 24.5 length and have that size in my AT hybrid boots for more comfort going uphill. They’re the Atomic Hawx Ultra XTD 95 and actually fit really well from a volume standpoint. Disclaimer is that I haven’t brought them into bumps yet.. I feel like this model series fits well for your description of issues though so I’d recommend trying some on if you can find them locally. I haven’t tried the non hybrid Atomic boots, but perhaps some are built similarly if you don’t want a hybrid boot.
 

MrsPlow

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
Do you have a very low instep? I do and I size down to a 23.5 for downhill because of it. My instep actually measures even smaller, so this is a bit of a compromise because I don’t think the other proportions of my foot outside of instep height and super skinny heel could handle smaller. I’m a 24.5 length and have that size in my AT hybrid boots for more comfort going uphill. They’re the Atomic Hawx Ultra XTD 95 and actually fit really well from a volume standpoint. Disclaimer is that I haven’t brought them into bumps yet.. I feel like this model series fits well for your description of issues though so I’d recommend trying some on if you can find them locally. I haven’t tried the non hybrid Atomic boots, but perhaps some are built similarly if you don’t want a hybrid boot.
I didn't think I did have a low instep but I guess maybe I do? My heel is quite narrow so only certain brands of running shoes work for me - I'd not thought much about what was above the foot. My husband has the drama-feet in the family or so I'd always thought.

I'll see if I can try on the Atomic - thanks for the suggestion.
 

WaterGirl

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
Hi @MrsPlow in my own quest for perfection, and realizing that I may be a bit narrower than I thought, and contemplating options b/c new liners not working, here is a list of LV boots that I was focusing on:
Atomic Hawk Ultra; Dalbello DS Asolo, Fischer RC4; Head Raptor; K2 Anthem Pro; Nordica Pro Machine; Rossigno Pure Elite; Salomon S max; Tecnica Mach 1LV

Oh and Tecnica just reduced its Mach 1 BSL by 5mm which may work for you.
 

Scribble

Angel Diva
I'm on a very similar quest and the Lange rx110 lv is not as narrow fitting in the ankle and heel as the Tecnica mach1 lv are, but are taller in the instep. The Rossi pure elite is sort of in between both in heel and instep volume, but felt much wider in the forefoot than both the lange and tecnica once they were broken in. The mach1 and pure elite are longer and roomier in the toe than the rx110 lv. I've also tried on the Nordica pro machine, which fit similarly to the pure elite, but with a less vague ankle and heel hold. The heel pocket was too wide for me, however, and I couldn't seem to get settled into the sweet spot. I found the Salomon s max to be oddly flat and tight across the forefoot and instep, with a stange rubbery feeling flex. They weren't the ones.

I recently upgraded from the pure elite 90 to the Lange rx110 lv for a more precise heel and forefoot hold. Unfortunately, I am now considering another boot, maybe the mach1's. The rx110s force me too far forward and are killing my quads. I'm ready to go home after 3 runs. The Rossi's allow a more relaxed, upright stance and are roomier in the calf area.
I have a narrow forefoot, slender ankles, bony instep and muscle-y calves, which has made my search a lot harder than I expected. I'm curious about the Dalbello asolo, I haven't tried them yet.
 

lisamamot

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
The Nordica Promachine works for me - I am tall and have a narrow-ish forefoot and heel, thin calves, and a normal instep height.

I also have the Atomic Hawks Ultra XTD for touring. I wear both of them in 25.5; compared to the Nordica Promachine, the Atomic has more forward lean, is shorter in foot length, has a shorter cuff and is wider in the forefoot. They are both the same flex rating, but the Atomic is softer....kind of wishing I had gone up on this one, but perhaps it is me adjusting to the shorter cuff as I am tall.
 

contesstant

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
I recently upgraded from the pure elite 90 to the Lange rx110 lv for a more precise heel and forefoot hold. Unfortunately, I am now considering another boot, maybe the mach1's. The rx110s force me too far forward and are killing my quads. I'm ready to go home after 3 runs. The Rossi's allow a more relaxed, upright stance and are roomier in the calf area.
I have a narrow forefoot, slender ankles, bony instep and muscle-y calves, which has made my search a lot harder than I expected. I'm curious about the Dalbello asolo, I haven't tried them yet.

Explore having "gas pedals" installed to the toes of the boots, especially if you overall like how these fit. Do you have access to a reputable boot fitter/shop that can assess your fore/aft stance and advise as to how much lift in the toes you need? One way to test this is to stand in your boots on a flat surface and put a credit card under the toe to see if that makes things feel more relaxed, then add more layers (business card, for instance) to see how much gas pedal you might need. (Again, a good shop should be able to assist you here.) FWIW, I have a 3mm gas pedal in my Rossi Hero ZJ junior race boots. Part of this is because I'm in a 22.5 boot, which has a steeper ramp angle just because it's such a short BSL. I went from feeling like I was skiing on my toes, with my quads on fire, to feeling incredibly balanced and efficient. There are ways to test this on the snow, but I'm not going to get into them here. Do an internet search and you will find a plethora of information.

Standing the boot up with a gas pedal could also help correct the calf issues you are describing. There are also other ways to address the calf issue, but a bootfitter would be best to address that. The cuff could be manipulated, the boot board could be ground down in the heel to lower the heel, loads of options, especially in a higher-level boot like the RX110.
 

contesstant

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
Yet another post about boot fit I'm afraid.

I've had some problems with my current boots - Nordica Striders. Finally got the left boot pretty much where I want (ie not eating my ankle for breakfast) and this year the right boot is playing up. Also finding that I get bounced out of the heel pocket in both boots in bumpy terrain. On groomers or other predictable terrain they're fine, but my right ankle is taking a battering when I'm in the fun, bouncy off-piste stuff and not 100% keeping things smooth.

I thought I'd try again, this time with a dedicated alpine boot - I spend most of my time inbounds so thought it was worth maybe getting away from any compromises inherent in a hybrid boot. So a visit to a different bootfitter and it turns out that while the length of the boot I'm in is fine (24.5), volume is 23.5. Also my right footbed is not giving me enough support, which I'd suspected for a few weeks. I tried on a 23.5 Salomon S Max 110 W and it did fit more snugly around the ankle and heel - I'd tried the same boot in a 24.5 and liked it but was concerned it was a bit too comfy to be ok after the initial wearing-in period. The 23.5 didn't seem like a ridiculously tight fit when I tried it on, so I am considering it.

I would rather stick with the 24.5 if I can largely because I've got a few pairs of skis that'd need to be remounted (previous boots were also 24.5 but were 10mm longer in BSL - ugh), and I'm hoping I can still use the Striders for touring, hopefully using new footbeds which is more likely to work if both boots are 24.5. Can anyone recommend any low volume boots that aren't super narrow that I could see if are available around here? ie something that might give me the ankle and heel fit in a 24.5? I have a feeling that the Salomons in the smaller size are probably my only option though...

Thanks!
I know you don't want to remount bindings, but compromising with a boot that is essentially the wrong size will leave you chasing fit issues endlessly. What you are describing are boots that are too high volume/too big. When you say that "volume is 23.5" are you referring to your instep measuring to a 23.5? If so, that's the number you need to chase. I measure a 23.5 length, and a short 22.5 instep. I'm in a 22.5 and have been told thanks to my stupidly low-volume feet, I could go into a 21.5 with lots of grinding in the toe box.
 

MissySki

Angel Diva
I didn't think I did have a low instep but I guess maybe I do? My heel is quite narrow so only certain brands of running shoes work for me - I'd not thought much about what was above the foot. My husband has the drama-feet in the family or so I'd always thought.

I'll see if I can try on the Atomic - thanks for the suggestion.

The instep can be a sneaky dimension.
I know you don't want to remount bindings, but compromising with a boot that is essentially the wrong size will leave you chasing fit issues endlessly. What you are describing are boots that are too high volume/too big. When you say that "volume is 23.5" are you referring to your instep measuring to a 23.5? If so, that's the number you need to chase. I measure a 23.5 length, and a short 22.5 instep. I'm in a 22.5 and have been told thanks to my stupidly low-volume feet, I could go into a 21.5 with lots of grinding in the toe box.

Ugh we really do have super similar feet. Stupid low insteps! I really do think that’s the hardest dimension for bootfitting if you fall so far outside of the norm like we do.
 

MrsPlow

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
I found the Salomon s max to be oddly flat and tight across the forefoot and instep, with a stange rubbery feeling flex. They weren't the ones.
Ah that's what the flex felt like - the Strider's quite a definite flex, the Salomon's were a bit spongey. The problem with there only being 1 boot in the shop that'll potentially work is that there's nothing to compare it to. I couldn't tell you if that flex would work for me - I know I like the flex on the Striders on open slopes, but not in tighter terrain. Possibly that's due to them being a bit too big as well as a bit too stiff?

I know you don't want to remount bindings, but compromising with a boot that is essentially the wrong size will leave you chasing fit issues endlessly. What you are describing are boots that are too high volume/too big. When you say that "volume is 23.5" are you referring to your instep measuring to a 23.5? If so, that's the number you need to chase. I measure a 23.5 length, and a short 22.5 instep. I'm in a 22.5 and have been told thanks to my stupidly low-volume feet, I could go into a 21.5 with lots of grinding in the toe box.
It's the instep I think - tape measure from ankle bone to ankle bone. I had the 3D imaging thing done for my current boots, so presumably that captures the instep. I've done a lot of walking this summer so it's possible that my feet and ankles have changed size due to that.

I know you're right, I'm not really that hung up on the remounting as such. It's just a wee bit frustrating having owned the only 24.5 boots that had a longer BSL than all the others and then have to go down a size AGAIN if you see what I mean. Just venting on that really.

I think it's mainly that I don't want to invest time and money in the wrong boots again - more the time tbh, I spent a lot of last season having tweaks done that didn't fix the pain and eventually gave up on some of the customisation so I could just go out and ski even if it wasn't the ideal fit. So kind of resistant to doing that all again, although I know I have to do something. Going to another bootfitter today so fingers crossed something comes from that.
 

WaterGirl

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
Have any of you played around with the Fischer App for foot measuring? would be interesting to see the measurements / w/ Diva's current boot fit.
 

contesstant

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
Ah that's what the flex felt like - the Strider's quite a definite flex, the Salomon's were a bit spongey. The problem with there only being 1 boot in the shop that'll potentially work is that there's nothing to compare it to. I couldn't tell you if that flex would work for me - I know I like the flex on the Striders on open slopes, but not in tighter terrain. Possibly that's due to them being a bit too big as well as a bit too stiff?


It's the instep I think - tape measure from ankle bone to ankle bone. I had the 3D imaging thing done for my current boots, so presumably that captures the instep. I've done a lot of walking this summer so it's possible that my feet and ankles have changed size due to that.

I know you're right, I'm not really that hung up on the remounting as such. It's just a wee bit frustrating having owned the only 24.5 boots that had a longer BSL than all the others and then have to go down a size AGAIN if you see what I mean. Just venting on that really.

I think it's mainly that I don't want to invest time and money in the wrong boots again - more the time tbh, I spent a lot of last season having tweaks done that didn't fix the pain and eventually gave up on some of the customisation so I could just go out and ski even if it wasn't the ideal fit. So kind of resistant to doing that all again, although I know I have to do something. Going to another bootfitter today so fingers crossed something comes from that.
Oh believe me, if there's anyone who can relate to boot fit experiences due to her own experiences, it's me. Throw in the fact that manufacturers BSLs are all over the map, and it's frustrating and confusing for sure!
 

MissySki

Angel Diva
Have any of you played around with the Fischer App for foot measuring? would be interesting to see the measurements / w/ Diva's current boot fit.

I just tried it 3 times and got different measurements each time, so I’m not sure how accurate it is.. though most of the dimensions did stay pretty close. I’ve been told one foot is shorter than the other and one is wider, so was surprised to see so much identical from side to side leading to my further skepticism for some of it. These are millimeters though which is darn tiny..

Is there some resource that tells you which size you should be in at each dimension measurement? I’m currently in a 23.5 and am a size 8-8.5 street shoe.
AC8E44B4-B075-4F93-A622-8BFB207A76A8.png2F89D8E4-5091-4B7B-ACAE-46231A24F355.png16CB5805-B248-481A-A616-739C19F861DA.png
 
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WaterGirl

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
1610736295916.png1610736313983.png
I averaged them.

I know for sure I am a solid 24 on the one foot and at least 23.5 if not more on the other. I think the ball width was the surprise for me b/c I look at my feet and think they are wide, but they are not. Im in a 7.5 running shoe, 7 dress. 22.5 Mach1LV

@MissySki not sure if there are any direct suggestions.

@Scribble thanks for all the fit info on the boots :smile:
 
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MissySki

Angel Diva
View attachment 14580View attachment 14581
I averaged them.

I know for sure I am a solid 24 on the one foot and at least 23.5 if not more on the other. I think the ball width was the surprise for me b/c I look at my feet and think they are wide, but they are not. Im in a 7.5 running shoe, 7 dress. 22.5 Mach1LV

Wow our measurements are really similar outside of the width and one shorter foot.. Your foot in the 240ish range fits into a 22.5 length wise?? Maybe it’s my width that’s more of an issue to go down even further than a 23.5 then?? Though I’m still a few millimeters higher than your average length.

This might be pretty accurate in a general sense though as I believe my instep measures to a 22.5 while length and or width or a combination of both put me in the 24.5 camp and we go to the 23.5 to split the difference.
 

WaterGirl

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
yes the foot fits, the Mach1 seems to be a bit longer of the 22.5 I have the 2016 boot with 270 BSL.
I would have to have work done say on a Atomic Hawk Ultra which DD has in a 22.5 - I can get in but its tight. Also, I have a lot of range of motion in my ankle? helps my heel get back???
 

elemmac

Angel Diva
I just tried it 3 times and got different measurements each time, so I’m not sure how accurate it is.. though most of the dimensions did stay pretty close. I’ve been told one foot is shorter than the other and one is wider, so was surprised to see so much identical from side to side leading to my further skepticism for some of it. These are millimeters though which is darn tiny..

I just tried 3 times as well. Most of the numbers came out within a millimeter or two of each other, with the exception of 4 numbers that seemed much larger/smaller. I took the 3 sets of numbers and averaged them, but removed the outliers before doing so.

Length - 232.7/232.3
Ball Width - 90.7/90.5
Instep Height - 60.3/61.3
Navicular Height - 36.0/35.5
Heel Width - 58.3/57.5

I think this confirms what I already know about my boots. I wear a 23.5 Nordica ProMachine...but know I should be in a 22.5 (7.5 running shoe, and 7 dress shoe). I'm a creature of habit, and I don't like to fix things that aren't broken...I've been in a 23.5 for so long, and they're comfortable (maybe too comfortable).

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I averaged them.

I know for sure I am a solid 24 on the one foot and at least 23.5 if not more on the other. I think the ball width was the surprise for me b/c I look at my feet and think they are wide, but they are not. Im in a 7.5 running shoe, 7 dress. 22.5 Mach1LV

I feel like we almost have the same feet based on Fischer...haha! I'd love to hear how your journey goes with the boots you posted above (I'm very interested in hearing how the Dalbello DC Asolo fits. I love the ProMachines...but have been contemplating going down to 22.5 since I got them.
 

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MissySki

Angel Diva
I just tried 3 times as well. Most of the numbers came out within a millimeter or two of each other, with the exception of 4 numbers that seemed much larger/smaller. I took the 3 sets of numbers and averaged them, but removed the outliers before doing so.

Length - 232.7/232.3
Ball Width - 90.7/90.5
Instep Height - 60.3/61.3
Navicular Height - 36.0/35.5
Heel Width - 58.3/57.5

I think this confirms what I already know about my boots. I wear a 23.5 Nordica ProMachine...but know I should be in a 22.5 (7.5 running shoe, and 7 dress shoe). I'm a creature of habit, and I don't like to fix things that aren't broken...I've been in a 23.5 for so long, and they're comfortable (maybe too comfortable).



I feel like we almost have the same feet based on Fischer...haha! I'd love to hear how your journey goes with the boots you posted above (I'm very interested in hearing how the Dalbello DC Asolo fits. I love the ProMachines...but have been contemplating going down to 22.5 since I got them.


Do you feel like the instep is big for you in that boot size at all? Yours are the same height as mine it appears and that's my most problematic area for having too much space along with the heel. Also, are you very flexible in your ankle area? That could be the other piece that makes my fit in this area so troublesome versus just the measurements in this dimension I guess. My feet and ankles are very loosey goosey, so given any little space it feels like a ton of movement happening even if in reality it's the tiniest bit..
 

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