Hockey players?!

[FindingWest]

Hey Divas! So I’m a hockey player at heart, but before you boo me I have fallen in love with skiing too! We moved to a little Canadian mountain town and live right at the base of the hill now.

I’ve been skiing the past 20 years with my husband and now the kids are all on the ski team and I am keeping up, but I will definitely be our limiting factor in skiing runs as a family haha. I have been skating since before I was 1, played collegiate hockey and still play. Rip groomers, love speed, I am a strong skier overall. However, my biggest problem is that when in bumps, moguls, trees and I get off kilter I resort to muscle memory before I even realize it.

The issue? Skating edges and skiing edges are the exact opposite. Tight turns are inside leg and edge for skating, skiing well…you know where this is going. My husband and kids are freaking Billy goats and just eat up this kind of terrain. I will continue to push myself, take lessons and practice proper weight distribution and edges, but I’m wondering if I can help myself out a bit more.

I current have Santa Ana 88’s for the majority of my skiing and Icelandic Maiden 101’s for powder and backcountry. However, once the tracks get laid down and we play in the trees I find myself uncomfortable, nervous and just on the struggle bus to enjoy those stashes. Regardless of suggestions I will be trying to demo but I’d like to have a game plan for demoing.

I am very interested in reverse camber skis and if anyone can give me a review on how they’re different than regular camber and rockered skis. It was mentioned that fully rockered/reverse cambered skis might be a better fit for resort powder days as a hockey player.

My only knowledge of skis that fit this category is the Icelandic Nia Pro’s, but I’m sure there must be other options. Any help would be greatly appreciated!!

I’m 5’2”, 118lbs if that helps provide context.

 

[K.LoSki]

Hey Divas! So I’m a hockey player at heart, but before you boo me I have fallen in love with skiing too! We moved to a little Canadian mountain town and live right at the base of the hill now.

I’ve been skiing the past 20 years with my husband and now the kids are all on the ski team and I am keeping up, but I will definitely be our limiting factor in skiing runs as a family haha. I have been skating since before I was 1, played collegiate hockey and still play. Rip groomers, love speed, I am a strong skier overall. However, my biggest problem is that when in bumps, moguls, trees and I get off kilter I resort to muscle memory before I even realize it.

The issue? Skating edges and skiing edges are the exact opposite. Tight turns are inside leg and edge for skating, skiing well…you know where this is going. My husband and kids are freaking Billy goats and just eat up this kind of terrain. I will continue to push myself, take lessons and practice proper weight distribution and edges, but I’m wondering if I can help myself out a bit more.

I current have Santa Ana 88’s for the majority of my skiing and Icelandic Maiden 101’s for powder and backcountry. However, once the tracks get laid down and we play in the trees I find myself uncomfortable, nervous and just on the struggle bus to enjoy those stashes. Regardless of suggestions I will be trying to demo but I’d like to have a game plan for demoing.

I am very interested in reverse camber skis and if anyone can give me a review on how they’re different than regular camber and rockered skis. It was mentioned that fully rockered/reverse cambered skis might be a better fit for resort powder days as a hockey player.

My only knowledge of skis that fit this category is the Icelandic Nia Pro’s, but I’m sure there must be other options. Any help would be greatly appreciated!!

I’m 5’2”, 118lbs if that helps provide context.

Hey there, i also am a hockey player and a skier. I did a write up review on my experience with the nia pro on here last year. Pretty easy to ski in powder. There are some other similar skis, moment meridian but they only come in ridiculously long lengths, i believe 4frnt makes a reverse camber/fully rockered ski.

My .2cents is, like hockey, your equipment isnt going to make or break you. A good skater can wear 25 year old gear and use a wooden stick and still be good. There are exceptions ofc. Do you have proper fitting boots? Ive found that if my boots don't fit, or too soft flex, i cant get the energy transfer i want and dont feel in control and therefore nervous. Boots trump skis in importance of gear in skiing.

Ultimately, it sounds like a lot of mental blocking you're experiencing (which can be helped by gear youre comfortable with) but you know what you need to do, lessons, 1:1 time getting comfortable skiing in that terrain, and demo. Perhaps you need something a little more forgiving than a santa ana in the bumps. Maybe try a blizzard black pearl, fischer ranger, head kore or the solomon qst/lumen which is actually one of my favorite skis in light slow/trees and bumps but not on groomers but i am quite a bit heavier than you. I have santa ana 93s, lumen 99s, and a moment bella 108 in my quiver. Best of luck!

 

[FindingWest]

Hey there, i also am a hockey player and a skier. I did a write up review on my experience with the nia pro on here last year. Pretty easy to ski in powder. There are some other similar skis, moment meridian but they only come in ridiculously long lengths, i believe 4frnt makes a reverse camber/fully rockered ski.

My .2cents is, like hockey, your equipment isnt going to make or break you. A good skater can wear 25 year old gear and use a wooden stick and still be good. There are exceptions ofc. Do you have proper fitting boots? Ive found that if my boots don't fit, or too soft flex, i cant get the energy transfer i want and dont feel in control and therefore nervous. Boots trump skis in importance of gear in skiing.

Ultimately, it sounds like a lot of mental blocking you're experiencing (which can be helped by gear youre comfortable with) but you know what you need to do, lessons, 1:1 time getting comfortable skiing in that terrain, and demo. Perhaps you need something a little more forgiving than a santa ana in the bumps. Maybe try a blizzard black pearl, fischer ranger, head kore or the solomon qst/lumen which is actually one of my favorite skis in light slow/trees and bumps but not on groomers but i am quite a bit heavier than you. I have santa ana 93s, lumen 99s, and a moment bella 108 in my quiver. Best of luck!

Thank you!

Yes I upgraded my boots last year as I was in boots that were a bit too big. I paint my skates on, so I got rid of that boot slop and it did improve my connection to the hill.

I 1000% agree that skill can offset gear so I’m not hoping for a miracle in a ski swap, but definitely looking for a little help so I’m not fighting my skis all the time. Like that player who moves from not knowing what their skate radius is and has been skating on a wrong one forever, or wood stick to composite, if you will.

The full rocker intrigues me, but I’m not dead set on anything at the moment. I’ve also been researching more freeride skis that may fit my ski style better. I definitely feel like I need something that is looser in the tails, has some forgiveness when I try to ride the wrong edge bc of muscle memory, and has a tighter turn radius when the trees get tight.

I’ll be doing a deep dive on here also to see what real world reviews are for any mentioned skis.

Some others that I’m looking at Faction dancer and prodigy, blizzard sheeva and bp, black crow birdies, atomic freeride, rossignol rallybird…

 

[elemmac]

The issue? Skating edges and skiing edges are the exact opposite. Tight turns are inside leg and edge for skating, skiing well…you know where this is going. My husband and kids are freaking Billy goats and just eat up this kind of terrain. I will continue to push myself, take lessons and practice proper weight distribution and edges, but I’m wondering if I can help myself out a bit more.

A nuance I see switching from skates to skis is not so much the semantics of which edge to use; but more the feeling of getting completely off the edges and running a flat base. When playing hockey, you're on your edges nearly ALL the time. Most turns are clean carves...which is why the transition to carving groomers is probably completely intuitive for you. Mastering pivoting, and sliding your turns is a bit foreign to ice skating. Learning to get off of your edges is something that will help in bumps and trees...and I'd have to agree that some extra rocker (or fully reverse camber) could make those types of turns a bit easier.

I think you're on the right path for demoing...but I'd also suggest taking suggestions from the shop you're demoing from (or the rep at the tent, if it's a full demo day). Let them know exactly what you're looking for; sometimes the best skis are ones that aren't on your radar.

 

[FindingWest]

A nuance I see switching from skates to skis is not so much the semantics of which edge to use; but more the feeling of getting completely off the edges and running a flat base. When playing hockey, you're on your edges nearly ALL the time. Most turns are clean carves...which is why the transition to carving groomers is probably completely intuitive for you. Mastering pivoting, and sliding your turns is a bit foreign to ice skating. Learning to get off of your edges is something that will help in bumps and trees...and I'd have to agree that some extra rocker (or fully reverse camber) could make those types of turns a bit easier.

I think you're on the right path for demoing...but I'd also suggest taking suggestions from the shop you're demoing from (or the rep at the tent, if it's a full demo day). Let them know exactly what you're looking for; sometimes the best skis are ones that aren't on your radar.

Yes! I think you absolutely nailed it. It’s the pivoting, slashing, smearing, sliding whatever it’s called that’s foreign to me. I will tuck that away and think of moguls as more of a transition and disengaging edges. On groomers I can intuitively feel which leg and edge to pressure and utilize and really lean into it and carve, but that all goes out the window in steep moguls and trees and then it becomes a battle.

I can’t tell you how many times I jokingly say I’d like to carry my skates to the glades or pack snow blades haha. My husband grew up ski racing and can barely skate so his ‘just do it like this in moguls and glades’ is of absolutely no use. Ladies bumps and trees lessons last season were led by a dude who spent a lot of time teaching us on groomers and not the actual terrain, while also not accounting for female centre of gravity and top heaviness. All of the ladies are very good skiers and not one came away from it feeling like a better bumps skier unfortunately. He taught on 67 wide skis and chastised everyone about the 88-120 skis even on a 30cm day.

This little nugget of information is very handy! Thank you.

 

[brooksnow]

Yes! I think you absolutely nailed it. It’s the pivoting, slashing, smearing, sliding whatever it’s called that’s foreign to me.

Thanks, @elemmac for putting that together so succinctly for FindingWest. I will remember this as I teach hockey players!

 

[elemmac]

Ladies bumps and trees lessons last season were led by a dude who spent a lot of time teaching us on groomers and not the actual terrain, while also not accounting for female centre of gravity and top heaviness. All of the ladies are very good skiers and not one came away from it feeling like a better bumps skier unfortunately. He taught on 67 wide skis and chastised everyone about the 88-120 skis even on a 30cm day.

Thats unfortunate that you got an instructor that nobody jibed with. I’ve been in that boat (and honestly turned me off of lessons for some time, it felt like I was just wasting money).

But lots of ladies on this site regularly take lessons, with great feedback…it might be worth starting a thread to find a recommended instructor. Or maybe even taking a private lesson so you can be pretty direct on what you want to work on.

 

[Jilly]

Many years ago I did the Women's weekend at Whistler. Because we spent most of the time in the bumps and trees, you either got it didn't have a good time.

Going into the trees with a guide/instructor will help build that confidence you need. There may be a similar program where you're located now. Check out the snow school.

 

[Pequenita]

On groomers I can intuitively feel which leg and edge to pressure and utilize and really lean into it and carve, but that all goes out the window in steep moguls and trees and then it becomes a battle.

I think the crux is in bold above. I'm coming at this from the opposite direction - pretty decent skier who picked up ice and figure skating 18 months ago. My skating edges are inconsistent, especially backwards, and I think a big part of it (hopefully I am not completely off base) is because I am trying to angulate the way one does in skiing, and in skating it is more of a lean (and somehow magically the blade edge keeps you upright - actually, I think it's because a blade has a hollow while a ski does not). How a skate is sharpened is different than how a ski is sharpened, and I think this affects the appropriate body positioning above the ankles.

The skater's intuition is to lean into a turn and have the upper body position in that same relationship with the feet. In skiing, the upper body is angled downhill, opposite the tip in the feet during a turn.

Anyway, give this some thought. I do think that generally a reverse cambered or rockered ski is a great tool in powder, but I suspect what will help you more is getting the upper body reaching downhill and separating what the upper body is doing vs. the feet.

 

[FindingWest]

I think the crux is in bold above. I'm coming at this from the opposite direction - pretty decent skier who picked up ice and figure skating 18 months ago. My skating edges are inconsistent, especially backwards, and I think a big part of it (hopefully I am not completely off base) is because I am trying to angulate the way one does in skiing, and in skating it is more of a lean (and somehow magically the blade edge keeps you upright - actually, I think it's because a blade has a hollow while a ski does not). How a skate is sharpened is different than how a ski is sharpened, and I think this affects the appropriate body positioning above the ankles.

The skater's intuition is to lean into a turn and have the upper body position in that same relationship with the feet. In skiing, the upper body is angled downhill, opposite the tip in the feet during a turn.

Anyway, give this some thought. I do think that generally a reverse cambered or rockered ski is a great tool in powder, but I suspect what will help you more is getting the upper body reaching downhill and separating what the upper body is doing vs. the feet.

Oh that is 100% what happens. On a groomer I can ‘lean into it’ like I’m Ted Liggity (reverse lean) and really cook with smooth double railroad tracks. In moguls, bumps and trees I revert to trying to tackle them like I’m skating on red bull crashed ice course and then join upper and lower body for improper lean. The muscle memory is hard to fight. I’ve been working on that forever, but really trying to dial in. The tip of being flat through those so as to turn better was gold and I can’t wait to try it.

 

[FindingWest]

Many years ago I did the Women's weekend at Whistler. Because we spent most of the time in the bumps and trees, you either got it didn't have a good time.

Going into the trees with a guide/instructor will help build that confidence you need. There may be a similar program where you're located now. Check out the snow school.

I’ve done ladies group instructions the past few years. I got a lot out of it the first year, focusing on cleaning up the basics and intermediate/advanced carving. Last season a friend and I moved up into bumps and trees and just didn’t have that same progression or instruction. So this winter it will be very mindful work myself to improve in this area.

 

[marzNC]

I’ve done ladies group instructions the past few years. I got a lot out of it the first year, focusing on cleaning up the basics and intermediate/advanced carving. Last season a friend and I moved up into bumps and trees and just didn’t have that same progression or instruction. So this winter it will be very mindful work myself to improve in this area.

Welcome! Are you in eastern or western Canada?

It's fair to say that for someone with an ice hockey background, becoming an adventurous intermediate skier carving on groomers is relatively easy. Learning how to "flow like water" (quote from my instructor in northern VA) in bumps and/or trees takes much longer, even with help from instructors. I've heard that in general instructors are happy to work with people with ice hockey backgrounds, no matter what age.

 

[FindingWest]

Welcome! Are you in eastern or western Canada?

It's fair to say that for someone with an ice hockey background, becoming an adventurous intermediate skier carving on groomers is relatively easy. Learning how to "flow like water" (quote from my instructor in northern VA) in bumps and/or trees takes much longer, even with help from instructors. I've heard that in general instructors are happy to work with people with ice hockey backgrounds, no matter what age.

Western Canada. In general skating has helped with the learning curve for sure, and I’m by no means expecting some miracle ski to turn me into a magician of the trees! However I would like to stop singing ‘dumb ways to die’ following my 8 yr old as she dances through the trees and moguls like she’s made of the wind… meanwhile I feel like newborn Bambi on a frozen pond!

I don’t golf with only my driver, so I’m looking to compliment my quiver and Reverse Rocker has piqued my interest. Finding much for reviews and other’s experience with them, or even finding any brand other than Icy’s seems to be a needle in the haystack. We have some epic glades here and I love the idea of them, but not exactly spending the whole day in them with my current setup.

 

[marzNC]

I current have Santa Ana 88’s for the majority of my skiing and Icelandic Maiden 101’s for powder and backcountry.

Are the SAs and Icelandics the same length?

Typically wider skis for powder are longer than all-mountain skis. I opted to get powder skis that are the same length as my all-mountain skis. The difference is width underfoot is between 85 and 106. As an advanced skier, my current all-mountain skis are about 10cm longer and 10mm wider than the first pair of all-mountain skis I bought for skiing in the Rockies. I was an adventurous intermediate (over 50) back then. Lessons and skiing over 20 days a season at big mountains paid off eventually.

I found ways to demo skis even as an intermediate. Learned quickly what I didn't like, which helped narrow down which brands worked better for me. Didn't necessarily know why, but I knew which skis were easier to turn.

 

[Fern Lake Flavor]

Yes! I think you absolutely nailed it. It’s the pivoting, slashing, smearing, sliding whatever it’s called that’s foreign to me. I will tuck that away and think of moguls as more of a transition and disengaging edges. On groomers I can intuitively feel which leg and edge to pressure and utilize and really lean into it and carve, but that all goes out the window in steep moguls and trees and then it becomes a

As another former hockey player, I feel this hard! Getting into downhill skiing as a 30-something felt easy as I intuitively engaged my old hockey skills (as opposed to the “pizza-ing” that never quite clicked with me as a youth), but the playful areas of bumps and trees totally takes away the focus on the “trust in your edges”.

Love all this food for thought, as I have never thought of these challenge areas in this way-and trees and bumps have been my big goal for last year, continuing into this year!

 

[marzNC]

Love all this food for thought, as I have never thought of these challenge areas in this way-and trees and bumps have been my big goal for last year, continuing into this year!

Welcome!

How much have you learned about side slipping and falling leaf? Both require controlling flat skis.

Note that I'm not an instructor. I've invested in lessons with PSIA Level 3 instructors at my home hill and at destination resorts in the last decade (after age 55). While I learned how to side slip during the two years I skied as a teen, I didn't know how important flat skis were for skiing bumps until I started doing Taos Ski Weeks in 2018.

 

[Fern Lake Flavor]

How much have you learned about side slipping and falling leaf? Both require controlling flat skis.

Side slipping, yes- but falling leaf is a new one to me and looks quite fun! Thanks for the tip