ESA Events

[NannyMin]

Okay seriously I am becoming more and more obsessed with skiing! It is becoming a problem...I have to literally restrict my conversation with my non-ski friends to prevent them from throttling me after listening to me talk non-stop about skiing...

Onto the subject that I originally planned on talking about! :D

I'm beginning to plan my ski season for next season and I need some input. I'm planning on going back to Beaver Creek's Technique week for probably 2 of the sessions. I'm also considering ESA's camps. Has anyone here attended before? What was your experience like?

Thanks!

 

[BatGirl]

I can't believe no one's replied to you yet, as I know several of us have been to ESA camps. C'mon, Divas, I know other people can add to this!

I was at the first one this year which was held in Stowe. I had exactly one season consisting maybe 2 - 2.5 weeks of skiing behind me. The organizers sent out a survey beforehand and, based on our responses, did a great job in dividing us up in to groups according to ability level. I was in the beginners' group due to lack of experience and a certain timidity on the slopes. Doug, my instructor, pushed me, but not to the point that I was uncomfortable. The skills he covered definitely helped me improve during this season.

The conditions weren't the greatest, but we made do with what we had. The instructors were all top-notch. It is well worth the money. I'm absolutely doing another one next year. Hope you'll be joining us!

 

[abc]

I'm planning on going back to Beaver Creek's Technique week for probably 2 of the sessions. I'm also considering ESA's camps. Has anyone here attended before? What was your experience like?

I haven't been to any ESA yet. So take what I say with a grain of salt.

If I can find the time, I would go. Period. End of story.

Reasons:

1) I've never been in ANY instruction programs that I don't enjoy and got a lot out of. So, it doesn't matter which one, it'll be worthwhile

2) Having said 1), according to the organizer, ESA students has a 70% return rate. That's probably higher than ANY other ski school programs.

3) I think ESA is a whole lot less expensive than the Beaver Creak Technique week thing.

 

[Ice Queen]

My husband and I went to the first two events in Stowe, which at the time were called ETU (Eastern Tune Up.) They were good, but we didn't go back because the group sizes are a little large (we had 6 or more the second year), the conditions in Stowe that weekend are iffy, and the price went up. We found a great instructor who works at Stowe full time, and we decided that doing semi-privates with him was a better return on our investment. I know someone posted on EpicSki that their group had 8 people in it. That's just too big for me.

The other issue we faced was related to our ability at the time and the conditions. On the second day of our second year attending, we went over to Mansfield and were skiing some of the blues over there, but they had gotten bumped up. We were in our third season of skiing at the time, and skiing blues at Stowe with bumps was definitely out of our league. We were the two least experienced skiers in the group, and the rest of the group didn't have too much trouble with the conditions, so we were holding everyone else up, and we ended up quitting early. Definitely not what you want to do when paying a bunch of money for ski instruction!

The other down side for me is that it's a week or two before Christmas, which is a busy time for me both with work and family stuff.

 

[abc]

The other down side for me is that it's a week or two before Christmas, which is a busy time for me both with work and family stuff.

I actually posted that on the Epic board. For me, I don't even start skiing in December, with family and holiday stuff keeping me busy! And it's the only East Coast ESA. So I don't think I'll ever bother with that one, knowing the condition is likely to be iffy that time of year probably 9 out of 10 years.

However, there's talk about doing one in some of the more "exotic" locals of the Rockies (Taos, Big Sky). If that becomes reality, I would jump on the first chance. Otherwise, Aspen is not a bad location, I would some day get around to it.

I'm in the level where many resorts don't even offer meaningful group lessons on, unless it's a specialty clinic like bumps or off-piste. So, an Epic Academy can be useful for an all around technical reality check for me.

 

[Ice Queen]

I bet the fact that EpicSki is (I'm guessing) 90% male has a lot to do with the fact that no one seems to mind "losing" a weekend right before Xmas to skiing. I wonder who's doing all the work in their households.....it is nice having an all-female forum, imagine the flames I'd get if I posted that on Epic! ha ha

 

[SnowHot]

I can't believe no one's replied to you yet, as I know several of us have been to ESA camps. C'mon, Divas, I know other people can add to this!

I was at the first one this year which was held in Stowe. I had exactly one season consisting maybe 2 - 2.5 weeks of skiing behind me. The organizers sent out a survey beforehand and, based on our responses, did a great job in dividing us up in to groups according to ability level. I was in the beginners' group due to lack of experience and a certain timidity on the slopes. Doug, my instructor, pushed me, but not to the point that I was uncomfortable. The skills he covered definitely helped me improve during this season.

The conditions weren't the greatest, but we made do with what we had. The instructors were all top-notch. It is well worth the money. I'm absolutely doing another one next year. Hope you'll be joining us!

Ro, I'm so surprised I didn't post in this earlier. Thanks for nailing me. Heck. Look at my signature!:o
I'm looking forward to seeing you at ESA this year. I am going to be there for sure and will likely go early to help the admin on some of the details.

My husband and I went to the first two events in Stowe, which at the time were called ETU (Eastern Tune Up.) They were good, but we didn't go back because the group sizes are a little large (we had 6 or more the second year), the conditions in Stowe that weekend are iffy, and the price went up. We found a great instructor who works at Stowe full time, and we decided that doing semi-privates with him was a better return on our investment. I know someone posted on EpicSki that their group had 8 people in it. That's just too big for me.
.

They had more instructors this past year and smaller groups. I would say 5 per on the average.
I was the person who posted that we had 8, but that was because our buddy Comprex and someone else jumped groups due to ability and we were happy to have them join us. Our group was an advanced group so we really didn't feel that we were held back, in fact we developed some great comradre' with all involved.

As for conditions.........that is a risk of that time of year but the costs are actually kept down in comparison to having it during prime ski season. It is still considered ETU in many ways and is still a great bargain for what is offered.
One thing I noticed is that ........even with the marginal conditions, Stowe Mt really kicked butt to give us some awesome skiing. AND the limited terrain made it so we ran into our other ESA groups regularly, which was nice.

Things I gained from the ESA experience are:
Improved skills(learning from the best of the best), a great weekend away at a great resort, Fellowship with some phenomenal people, and meeting some great people who've become great friends.

 

[NannyMin]

Thanks for all of the feedback ladies!

It sounds like overall it is worth it. The one thing that concerns me is the size of the groups.

When do they typically release the dates for events?

 

[Ski Spirit]

Feedback on Women's Ski Clinics

Has anyone tried out a women's ski clinic? I've read the comments about Okemo and it sounds like a great program...but I'm in California, so not totally practical. Anyone know about the "Just for Women" program at Squaw? A woman I know went through Kim Reichelm's clinic and highly recommended it (pretty expensive though). I'm looking for a multi-day clinic of some kind. I've read about ESA (and know there was an event in Tahoe last season) but have some reservations. I'd like to see what a women's clinic would be like. Anyway, would appreciate any feedback.

 

[tcarey]

I think we run a great Women's specific program at Okemo-maybe ESA could expand on this and have a female led group for those who would feel more comfortable skiing with their own gender.Just some food for thought for ESA.

Terry

 

[Lisamarie]

Okay, now I feel guilty for not replying!:o I'm the ski fitness coach for the Western ESA. When I lived in Boston, I attended the Stowe ESA once, but the conditions were so horrific that I'm glad that I now live in Colorado. One of the issues involving the timing of ESA is the fact that as an independent ski camp, we do not have lift line privledges. This can be a serious problem in the East. I recall taking a class at Stowe on Valentine's Day, and even with ski school lift line privledges, the waits were about 20 minutes long.

As far as the Western events, I have been to every one of them, excluding Tahoe. For the most part, they are spectacular. The only one I was not too fond of was the last one that was done at Snowbird. I was recovering from ACL surgery, and I truly hated the Snowbird terrain: Cat track, Steep, Bumps, Cat Track, Steep ,Bumps etc.

That being said, the Aspen venue is terrific, and I am really glad we are returning next season!

Here's a hint about making the most of ESA: When you fill out the survey, DO NOT OVERESTIMATE YOUR ABILITIES!!!! This happened to a few people who were unhappy with the event. However, since I knew their skiing skills, when I saw what group they were in, I had to wonder what they were thinking when they filled out the survey.

If you end up in a group below your level, your instructor will ask if you would like to move up. It gets tricky if you end up in a group higher than your level. Your instructor might say something, but they don't want to hurt your feelings.

 

[Ice Queen]

It sounds like overall it is worth it. The one thing that concerns me is the size of the groups.
QUOTE]

The camradarie is a great part of these events, but as I mentioned above the group size is a deterrent to me. If you do the math, if you're in a 6-hour lesson with a total of 6 people, you get a total of one hour of attention for the day. That's if the instructor spends an equal amount of time on each student -- in my experience, the people in the group who get the most attention are those having the hardest time, while the rest are essentially wasting their time. This isn't a crack on any ESA instructor, just my observations in group lessons. I noticed the same thing when my husband and I were first learning to ski. We did a lot of Sunday afternoon "group" lessons that ended up being just the two of us. He got way more attention than I did, and I wasn't sure if this was sexism or a consequence of the fact that I was picking the stuff up more quickly than he was.

Anyway, long story short, the only reason I'd do an eastern ESA event is to make some new ski buddies. I think my money is better spent on private lessons with a level 3 instructor, again, just doing the math for dollars spent for amount of individual instruction. The events are a lot of fun though!

 

[ski now work later]

I really enjoyed the Women's Alpine Adventure Clinic (WAA) that I took at Okemo in Feb. 2006. My group was a total of 4 women students with one instructor. I think that 4 to 1 is a good ratio. It's actually very useful to watch others learn skills and if I'm out all day for consecutive days, the times when I'm watching are rest periods which are very welcome.

I agree with the comments about not overstating your skills, because in any good clinic, the coach will challenge the group to new skills, so if you are misplaced, it could get scary and/or dangerous. The conditions at Okemo were so-so that weekend, which was in early February. There is no guarantee for good condition, especially in the East, but I try to look at it that part of being an accomplished skiier is being able to ski all conditions.

I haven't yet found any women who attended the women's clinic at Jackson Hole and am wondering how that program is....

 

[abc]

A question to lisamarie: how often do ESA move their events? I havent' been on Epic for too long at all. All I can see is Stowe & Aspen year after year. Tahoe is relatively new and may not even continue due to poor attendence. But you mentioned Snowbird... So they've been to other resorts but stop going there?

To me, skiing is mostly for pleasure so I'm not going to make work out of it. Learning from the best is great but checking out a resort I've never been to is equally appealing for me.

I know they're going to Big Sky for next year. I wonder if that will become a ESA destination for the next few years or it's going to be a one time thing? I heard enough about Big Sky I'd very much like to go. But that unfortunately conflicts with another trip I already say YES to. I'm reluctant to change my mind on that one. But if the ESA is only "stopping" at Big Sky only ONCE, I'd better get over there while it is.

 

[SnowHot]

The plan is to be consistent with the locations, yet there was an outcry to try Tahoe so they did. Tahoe is a great destination but it was not attended as well as hoped.
Prior to the Aspen Snowmass event of 2007 they had ESA in Colorado at Snowbird which was a huge success. I believe the only reason they moved it was to give new resort exposure to ESA attendees. (I could be wrong about that, but I think I'm on target)
I will definitely ask Nolo and post if its any different.

As for ESA making work out of skiing.......you'd be amazed at how much fun this is.
You really get some quality instruction but its coupled with great social activity and profound skiing. You definitely don't miss out on the fun factor!
I like to call it the three "F"'s
Fun
Fitness
Fellowship

 

[abc]

As for ESA making work out of skiing.......you'd be amazed at how much fun this is.

Sorry it wasn't very clear. What I mean making work out of skiing isn't so much about the lessons, but about taking the opportunity to travel to places I've never been to (and actually check out what the resort got to offer). For example, I just had a hard time getting myself motivated to go to Stowe in December!

I like Stowe fine. But not so crazy about it (especially in Decmeber) that I go over and over again. I may do that for one year for the the valueable lessons. But for multiple years in a roll would become, well, WORK! That's why the proposed Big Sky location is just so very exciting!

 

[SnowHot]

I'm sorry I misunderstood.
After talking to nolo a bit I can confidently share this information:
The venue changes according to several factors: Cost, likely snow conditions, terrain variety, crowds, friendliness toward independent programs, and available local talent.

Also, there has been some discussion about group size. The general rule of thumb is 5 per coach. On occasion the numbers may differ, but the goal is 5 per coach or less. The early days of ETU did not have this general rule of thumb, however now ESA Stowe is well attended and the goals are the same as the other ESA's.

As I stated earlier, we happened to have extra in our group but the number didn't change the dynamic in a negative way.

 

[ski now work later]

I highly recommend Big Sky. I've been twice, and both times the mountain has amazed me and kicked my butt. Will be returning in February 2008 this time with the right equipment for the soft snow conditions they get. It's a very natural environment, not built up, lots of animal sightings (elk, fox), great new on mountain restaurant, quick lifts, and runs that go on forever. Sounds like a great place for a clinic.

 

[NannyMin]

SnowHot how far in advance are dates typically announced for the various ESAs?

I too would love to go to Big Sky!

 

[SnowHot]

Last year they were announced in early June.

I think the dates for Big Sky are being discussed and will likely follow the thinking of this thread

I'm not sure exactly what role I will play in it, but I have offered my help to nolo for the ESA Stowe event, and may lend a hand in another one as well.
Last year I assisted Wear the Fox Hat and Epic with ticket distribution and served as kind of an Epic Ambassador.

If you check anything out on Epic, I'm Trekchick over there.