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DPS Phantom base treatment, how to avoid waxing recreational skis - Notes 2020

marzNC

Angel Diva
The guys at DPS are recommending I try using a rotobrush to get my chalky residue off. Can anyone recommend a rotobrush? I have no idea what I'm looking at. I would definitely take the trip to Kingston if I had all this to do over again!
I think I might just do some more hand brushing over a few days first. Probably focus on a small section of one ski first. Do you have good brush made for ski bases?

The link below includes a video that shows how to use a root brush. I never wanted to go that far in terms of buying ski tuning tools.

https://www.artechski.com/swix-blue-nylon-roto-brush-standard-100-mm/
 

Ski Sine Fine

Angel Diva
The guys at DPS are recommending I try using a rotobrush to get my chalky residue off. Can anyone recommend a rotobrush? I have no idea what I'm looking at. I would definitely take the trip to Kingston if I had all this to do over again!
If you have a relationship with your friendly neighborhood ski shop, they might do it for free.
 

marzNC

Angel Diva
For those who are unfamiliar with Phantom as a replacement for all-weather waxing, here's a video done in Nov 2019 by one of the Canadian shops that was an early adopter. It's a conversation with Thomas Laakso, DPS VP of Product. Laasko used to work for Black Diamond where he invented a hybrid ski boot for touring.

 

SallyCat

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
The guys at DPS are recommending I try using a rotobrush to get my chalky residue off. Can anyone recommend a rotobrush? I have no idea what I'm looking at. I would definitely take the trip to Kingston if I had all this to do over again!

I hope you've arrived at a resolution with DPS. I wouldn't buy a roto brush just to do a one-time residue removal. If you don't have hand brushes, a Scotch-Brite pad will probably work just fine.
 

marzNC

Angel Diva
Any thoughts on how to get the 3.0? I’m not seeing it on the website...
I have an impression that once DPS ran out of the 2-part 2.0, they didn't make any more. So I think they have been shipping the Version 2.0 with 1-part application for a while.

The ski shops were using the 1-part application starting some time during the 2019-20 season.
 

diymom

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
There are some sites that still have the 2.0 in stock for discounted prices. So for anyone who is willing to put in the extra effort required and save around $30, shop around. For anyone wanting the easier 1 part method, I would suggest ordering directly from DPS or make sure the photo shows either the "1 part" on the box, or the applications packaged in 2 black pouches. The 1.0 and 2.0 came in red and white pouches labeled A and B.
 

Lmk92

Angel Diva
I hope you've arrived at a resolution with DPS. I wouldn't buy a roto brush just to do a one-time residue removal. If you don't have hand brushes, a Scotch-Brite pad will probably work just fine.

They did return my email, but they only told me to use a rotobrush and then polish with water. Needless to say, my skis are still waiting for me because I'm still afraid I'm going to damage them. To be honest, Google's customer service was much more impressive.
 

marzNC

Angel Diva

lakeviewpowder

Certified Ski Diva
I am interested in switching my gear over to Phantom, but wondering about P-Tex repairs? Does P-tex affect Phantom performance? Do you treat the area after a repair?

This is from the DPS site, but looking for first hand experience: "In a real-world application, the amount of surface area relative to the rest of the base in most repairs is relatively small, and you shouldn't experience a reduction in overall glide performance, but that will be subjective and relative with many possible variables: size, location, surface area of ski/snowboard in question, prior base quality. etc."
 

marzNC

Angel Diva
I am interested in switching my gear over to Phantom, but wondering about P-Tex repairs? Does P-tex affect Phantom performance? Do you treat the area after a repair?

This is from the DPS site, but looking for first hand experience: "In a real-world application, the amount of surface area relative to the rest of the base in most repairs is relatively small, and you shouldn't experience a reduction in overall glide performance, but that will be subjective and relative with many possible variables: size, location, surface area of ski/snowboard in question, prior base quality. etc."
From everything I've read, a P-tex repair doesn't make enough difference to matter. Unless of course there are so many gouges that a large section of the base ends up P-tex.

The scratches I've put on my bases that were treated with Phantom were the type that go away with a base grind. I don't do that every season either. But have done it to one pair of skis, which are old Black Pearls that are my rock skis at this point. The Phantom glide is just as good as before, as expected.

What region do you usually ski in?
 

SallyCat

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
I am interested in switching my gear over to Phantom, but wondering about P-Tex repairs? Does P-tex affect Phantom performance? Do you treat the area after a repair?

This is from the DPS site, but looking for first hand experience: "In a real-world application, the amount of surface area relative to the rest of the base in most repairs is relatively small, and you shouldn't experience a reduction in overall glide performance, but that will be subjective and relative with many possible variables: size, location, surface area of ski/snowboard in question, prior base quality. etc."

I just took a big chunk out of my base hitting a rock last week and am about to repair it. The spot is right under my foot, and I, too, am concerned that the untreated P-tex will have a different glide consistency from the rest of the base. On the other hand, I'm probably not a discerning enough skier to notice. It has to be repaired either way, so I'll apply the P-tex and report back if anything feels off.
 

diymom

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
Now that Phantom is a one part process and places with cure stations get it in large squirt bottles, you might be able to take them in to a place with a cure station together with a six pack (one place in NH once told me that bringing in an interesting IPA will generally bump your skis to the front of the line for tuning or mounting) for a spot treatment. I'm guessing a few targeted drops of Phantom and a quick cure while discussing the merits of whatever brew you happen to have with you might help if you do notice a difference with the p-tex.
 

Lmk92

Angel Diva
I'm pretty much sold on Phantom and will be treating any future skis. The difference is especially evident on long cat tracks where everyone around me seems to be struggling to keep moving and I'm just gliding along.

I agree! I was so scared over the summer that I had done something wrong and wasted a lot of money, but I am really pleased with the results. I was thinking about new skis, but because I just applied the Phantom, I'm putting off that decision. :smile:
 

marzNC

Angel Diva
Here are reminders about DPS Phantom since it was discussed recently now that spring skiing has started in some regions.

1) Can always add wax to bases that have been treated with Phantom. Apparently for racing that provides the best performance since the glide is better after the wax is more or less gone (where permitted). Also can be useful when temps are frigid (single digits F or below).

2) Bases treated with Phantom are slightly harder as a result of the chemical bonding that takes place all the way thru the base material. Meaning skis that become rock skis may well last a bit longer since they won't scratch quite so easily.

3) On cold snow, Phantom glide is like universal wax. In temps over 40, Phantom is better than warm weather waxing because it's permanent. Even more clear when temps are over 50.

4) No need to wax when using skins if skis have Phantom.

I've treated all the skis that live in my house (AJ, old BP, Floskis, Stormrider 85; daughter's tele BP) using kits at home. Had a very good time skiing last week when it was 65 at lunch time in northern Virginia. I did two head-to-head comparisons out west of Phantom vs wax in warm temps over 45 (AJ treated vs BP, BP treated vs Stormrider 85) before I committed to Phantom for all my skis. Only skis that had a stone grind before Phantom were the Stormriders.
 

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