Do women discount their skiing abilities?

[ski diva]

And do men overstate theirs?

Yesterday I was reminded of a ski trip where I overheard a group of men bragging to one another about how great they each skied. Later I saw them on the slopes, and -- let me put it this way -- I was not impressed.

I know I try not to talk about how good or bad I ski. (Hey, it's better than some, not as good as others). But I'm pretty sure I've never heard women participate in the sort of one upmanship that often occurs in groups of men.

Am I wrong about this? What do you think?

 

[SnowHot]

I think we do!

I know that I skied for a long time before I even attempted to ski with my husband and his friends. I assumed, by their talk, that I would never keep up. When I showed up with him, I got "the look" from the guys, as if they were thinking, "good lord, we're gonna have to ski with her. This day's gonna suck"
By the end of the day they were getting my cell phone number and hooking up with "us" through me!

 

[Marigee]

I don't talk too much about my ability (or lack therof: ) Mostly I think I am too modest. Most of the women I have skied with aren't competitive types. It's almost like we are being too polite and don't want to appear like we are bragging. However, I have a couple friends who are VERY good. I know just where I stand in ability compared to them ( not as good.) They don't brag to me and I don't act modest - it is what it is.

I have skied with my sons' Boy Scout troop on several trips and the men (I am one of the few women) often talk about what they can do etc. I can keep up with all of them and am actually better than all but one (he and I ski pretty much the same terrain.) I think I take on more bravado when I ski with them and might put in a little bit of bragging.

So I guess I agree with Ski Diva - at least when it comes to me - and the people I know.

 

[teachski]

I think men over rate their ability, because of that it seems like women discount theirs. I consider myself an upper level intermediate...because I don't do bumps(yet). I skied with a group of men a couple seasons ago and most claimed to be experts. I kept up with them and outskied most of them. We did not do bumps because it was early season and there wasn't any bump terrain open.

I have had a "fear" of bumps since I took a terrible spill in them while in college and am reluctant to even try them again. I see bumps on a trail and I get anxious. I am working on that though and I may be ready to give them a whirl this year.

 

[ISki]

I've noticed this too. Men and women must have different definitions of "great".

 

[Lisamarie]

Two of my male instructors from Epic, Weems and Mike_M, really believe this. It's rather hunorous to watch what they do if a guy comes into class and starts bragging about himself. They will surely learn a lesson in humility!:p

 

[SnowHot]

Two of my male instructors from Epic, Weems and Mike_M, really believe this. It's rather hunorous to watch what they do if a guy comes into class and starts bragging about himself. They will surely learn a lesson in humility!:p

I am very eager to meet Weems! He seems to be a profound individual!

 

[Jilly]

Oh do I agree about this one. I remember years ago listening to a gentlemen expounding about where he had skied and the new skis he had just brought back from Europe. The next day, my friend Lynda and I were skiing the trees at Sutton and the guys were just over on the run. We came out of the trees did a few picture prefect turns and stopped. His mouth dropped to his knees and he went to the bar after that. Hubby was with him and said that the guy couldn't ski worth a #$%@ and that was one of the best moves Lynda and I have done. They had had enough of him.
As a rule I sit back and listen to everyone talk. When we ski in a group I usually take up the rear as I've been hit too often and I think its a mommy thing to make sure everyone is still with the group. So I get to watch and analazye. It drives a few friends crazy, but I just let them go. I'm never far behind. My ski run motto is "I'll ski it once. It might not be pretty and I might not do it again! But I'll do it once!"

 

[ski diva]

Oh do I agree about this one. I remember years ago listening to a gentlemen expounding about where he had skied and the new skis he had just brought back from Europe. The next day, my friend Lynda and I were skiing the trees at Sutton and the guys were just over on the run. We came out of the trees did a few picture prefect turns and stopped. His mouth dropped to his knees and he went to the bar after that. Hubby was with him and said that the guy couldn't ski worth a #$%@ and that was one of the best moves Lynda and I have done. They had had enough of him.

That's a great story, Jilly! Serves him right.

 

[smpayne]

I read it someplace, don't remember where, that women tend to downplay their ability when buying gear and end up with lower level equipment, while the men gravitate toward higher end stuff.

Shortly after that, I was having a discussion with my brother (he is a very good skiier and very athletic, powder, bumbs, steeps, etc.) and mentioned that I was an intermediate skiier and he proceeded to laugh at me. He then informed me that I wasn't by any means an "intermediate" skiier anymore. All I could say was "Really?"

Needless to say, when I stoped thinking of myself as an "intermediate" skiier, I found myself skiing faster, in more control and with less fear. I am more willing to try the powder, bumps and steeps (kinda hard with very little snow). The thing is I never thought I was really skiing "that" fast, but I've begun to time out the electronic gates at some of the lifts and have had to get special permission to jump the ropes, it was a very powerful feeling.

When I'm at the ski shop, I've started to pay attention to what the guys say and what the girls say. The guys will talk about what they "want" to do (as if they are doing it), while the girls will talk about what they "usually" do or what they are most "comfortable" with. Some of the sales people pick up on this and probe further about where they would like to go vs where they are right now, but most don't. Therefore, the girls end up with equipment that limits their progression and keeps them in their current comfort zone, while the guys get better equipment that helps them progress.

Then there is that factor, where guys just have that "need" to prove they are fearless, where the girls have more common sense. My dad still love to tell the tales of how he could keep up (on skis) with my 15 yr old brother ripping on a snowboard.

 

[volklgirl]

Just my humble opinion;

Do guys overestimate their ability? Typically, yes. In their case, regularly bravado, guts, and stupidity triumph over technique.

Do women underestimate their ability? Ummmm...depends.
I find the best women skiers are usually very honest and accurate in their own evaluation of their ability. Usually, they just let their skiing do the talking. Are they just as prone to underestimation by men and ski shop workers? Absolutely.
Beginner to lower advanced women are more likely (in my experience) to underestimate their own ability. They tend to compare themselves to the men they ski with and mistake "using their head" and "being sensible" for a lack of skills. Choosing to ski slowly does not make one an unskilled skier! However, the men they ski with will usually see this lack of speed as a weakness in technique and reinforce the feelings of inadequacy. Put those same women with a bunch of other women and you'll usually see those feelings disappear.

 

[Pequenita]

This thread makes me smile. When I understate, it's because the skiers I'm with aren't making any verbal statement about their skiing abilities and wind up being junior Alberto Tombas. Do men tend to overstate? Well, I'd say they're the ones who are usually trying to impress someone else, whether it's the other guys or a gal.

I'm a pretty competitive person, but I like to think I've got a good handle on my skiing ability. I'm good at steeps. Baby bumps are okay. Sometimes it's pretty, sometimes it's not. And when I'm out there, I thank the powers that be for letting me have this run.

 

[BatGirl]

I ended up in a discussion about this with Doug S. during ESA. We were heading over to Mt. Mansfield from Spruce Mtn and the other student (also named Doug) was nervous about being able to handle Lord, the first blue run we were doing that weekend. I turned to him and said, "If I can do it, you can. You're just as good if not better." Doug S. started to laugh and said he'd noticed that women have a tendency to do that. We rate others in comparison to ourselves and tend to downplay our abilities.

I think some of this comes from us being our own worst critics, and we don't have the need to flex like some guys do.

 

[eng_ch]

The level of male boasting is probably in inverse proportion to their willy size :D :D :D :D

 

[volklgirl]

:D :D :D

Pepsi! Again!! (I'm gonna need a new keyboard soon).

 

[Quiver Queen]

I absolutely think we girls tend to downplay our skills--I'm a perfect example. Since I got into skiing ten years ago I've focused more on what I'm NOT doing right than what I AM doing right, so I'd been more negative and frustrated than I should've been. Just the other day I was skiing with a former member of the U.S. Ski Team and World Extreme Ski Champion, and the positive things he said to me, how he ranked my abilities, and how he compared me to other skiers on the mountain absolutely blew me away! It truly was an "ah-ha" moment--hopefully the new image of myself I have will stick and I can use it as a platform upon which to further refine my skiing.:D

 

[num]

I definitely think men are more likely to play up their ability, and beyond that, it seems as though they'll play up the ability of others that they're associated with ("You should ski with us sometime..but we ski hard!/but we ski some pretty sick stuff!"). I think that in addition to competing with their own friends, they get get competitive about their group of friends' ability level versus other groups, in skiing and other sports/activities.

A (male) friend of mine (ex skier) likes to go on about how he's amazed at how quickly I picked up skiing and what a great skier I am, while I still consider myself a serious noob. So either he's overstating, I'm downplaying, neither or both. How helpful is that conclusion? ;)

 

[treebunny]

fun thread! definitely women low ball themselves and are low balled by others. thats why it can be so hard to find good equipment. i get a secret, perverse kick out of riding up the lift with someone on new boards and talking big about this and that ya-da ya-da ya-da...watching them take a few terrible turns and then blowing their doors off!!hee hee!

 

[Thatsagirl]

Well, I have found that people who are highly skilled do not even say what kind of skiers they are. Doesn't matter whether they are men or women. The only time they will "put a label" on themselves is when they are forced to do it. So whenever I hear someone bragging about the kind of terrain they ski/ride, I don't believe them until I see it. It's one thing to state it matter of factly, it's another to push it as a way to impress people.

That said, it's true that you tend to hear more men than women brag about their skiing/riding and inflate their ability level. Just because someone can get down a double-diamond does not make them an expert.

An interesting and true story: When we were at Crested Butte last season, we were given a guide to take us around the mountain (because we were there as journalists, they wanted to make sure we got a tour and had someone on hand to answer every question). CB has a great opportunity for people new to the mountain to take a guided tour of the Extreme Limits, for $35. When the group meets, the guide takes them to a short, single-diamond slope just off one of the chairlifts. Participants are tested on that slope and if they do OK, they can go on the tour. If they don't do OK, they are refunded their money and told that they cannot take the tour. So, you can see this "ski off" from the lift and our guide pointed the tour group out to us. I think there were 7 or 8 guys in the ski off. The first guy could not link more than two turns. The second guy could not even do one turn before falling. This went on until the group was whittled down to 3. Honestly, watching these guys ski, I couldn't figure out how most of them thought they were "experts." And the thing about a lot of the expert terrain at CB is you can DIE if you fall. Not the place to prove your manhood. :o

Thatsagirl

 

[ski diva]

It's amazing how oblivious some people can be (read that as men).

I have a friend who skied like TWICE and was convinced he was an expert. He was totally insulted when he went to take a lesson and they put him in a lower group. What's more, according to him, skiing is no fun at all unless you're skiing the blacks. I mopped the floor with him on the blues at Okemo, so you can imagine how much fun he was having that day! :p