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Bunny slope conquered- What next?

Kimmyt

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
My almost 4-yo has started to ski on his own. Fun! (Also terrifying! But mostly fun!). He does linked turns on bunny slopes but we haven't taken him to an actual green slope. He can turn to stop sort of like a slow motion hockey stop, fall over to stop or wedge if he needs to slow down/stop. Any tips on a progression here? I have no idea where to go next, other than keep taking him on the mountain and eventually when he wants to go on the big lift try a green run (as of now he is a bit hesitant to go on anything other than the bunny slope so I'm not sure if I should force the issue or just let him decide when he is ready). Is that the right approach or is there something I should be working on with him before I take him on the green runs?

I plan on putting him in a season kids program next year when he's old enough but right now we're just basically focusing on him learning to enjoy skiing and learning basic safety stuff.
 

newboots

Angel Diva
Disclaimer: I'll weigh in since I know absolutely nothing about teaching kids to ski. But I used to teach kindergarten . . .

There's a thread here about skiing games to play with kids. I'd be tempted to play games on the bunny hill until he expresses some interest in getting on the lift. The lift and those big, long hills (however green) are a big leap up from bunny hills, and if he's intimidated the fun factor will diminish fast. How much better to have more solid skills before attempting anything that long/steep/fast. (Long/steep/fast is how green trails looked to me last year!)
 

marzNC

Angel Diva
@Kimmyt : such a fun time! Can he get up by himself when he falls, or does a fall-to-stop? If you help him up, does he try to lean back when you are supporting him?

I watched an instructor with two little girls last weekend (at Massanutten). The girls were perhaps 4, definitely no more than 5. It was their first run on the easy green (long and quite flat) after learning to turn and stop in the teaching area (magic carpet). One was doing fine, mostly pizza but she could easily match her skis to start sliding down the hill when it was time to go again. The other was too scared and kept leaning sideways to sit down. She would not get up herself, although I know that's taught to never-ever kids early on. She would lean back even when the instructor was holding her hand while skiing backwards in front of her. They weren't making much downhill progress. From what I could gather, the scared girl had been doing fine in the teaching area.

My daughter started ski school at Massanutten at age 4 (she's in high school now). There were four girls in her never-ever group (empty slopes, week before Christmas). Three went up the chairlift with the instructor after lunch. The one who wasn't ready was a 7yo who had parents who were skiing the blues and blacks. (I saw them together after the instructor took the others on the lift. Father wasn't too happy.) The other two girls with my daughter were 5. My daughter needed an edgie-wedgie for a day after that first ski school experience. We did one run riding the lift before calling it a day. Once she had a little more practice with wedge turns and stops the next day, she was set. No edgie-wedgie required her third day, which was another full day of ski school.

The ski school groups with little ones under age 6 that are on the green slope use Red/Yellow/Green light all the time to keep the group together. Meaning if a kid at the back has fallen, the others need to be good enough to stop on Red and wait. Or the instructor will use Yellow to try to keep a kid from skiing into another kid just in front of them.

I was only an intermediate back then so skiing backwards in front of her was not an option. She did better following me than leading. Could make turns fine, but when leading she was having too much fun sliding with no turns to want to make a turn until something or someone got in her way. I used Red/Yellow/Green Light too.
 

Gloria

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
I think you are doing great. At 4 you can only teach a child so much due to motor skills and the size/mass of their heads in relation to the rest of the body. You could do bus drivers to promote getting the hands out. Bouncy turns or little hops on the bunny hill are fun too. I think it’s perfect that you are letting him take charge in where he wants to ski too.
 

Sheena

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
I just took my kids up the lift higher up the mountain a few weeks ago. (They turned 5 in November).

How is his/her stamina for skiing? I think I am way more cautious, but i waited until my kids could stop without falling down, and showed decent speed control. (Which can be hard for little legs sometimes). I also went on a warm sunny day when it wasn’t very crowded.

Another thing that can come into play is how your kid handles new things.

I am in the camp of holding off if my kids are hesitant in most cases. I say go with your gut.

Another thing that could come into play here is how long it’s been since he started skiing on his own?
 

MsWax

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
I had my 3-year-old skiing blues by the end of last year. We started on the bunny slope and stayed there until he could
(1) Follow my directions of turn/slow down/stop
(2) Demonstrated good control
(3) Demonstrated good choices

I asked instructors we rode up on lifts with what the best "next trail" was and we tried it. The first run was an EPIC fail where he freaked out and I had to carry him down the mountain...I thought my arms were going to fall off! But we got to the bottom and he was so proud he'd gone to the top. The next weekend we tried again, and it was slow and took us a while to get down, but he made it. Things only improved from there.
 

Kimmyt

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
Thanks for the input guys!

There's a thread here about skiing games to play with kids. I'd be tempted to play games on the bunny hill until he expresses some interest in getting on the lift.

He actually isn't afraid of lifts at all! There is a lift on the bunny slopes (I guess technically its called a green run but really its just a longer version of the bunny slope). He was riding it with my husband the other day and he even got off on his own before my husband could help him off. He's also pretty headstrong and resistant to games, but I will read up on that thread again to get some ideas. His favorite game is being 'line leader' because he doesn't like when I'm in front of him, he likes to be in charge of where he's going.

Can he get up by himself when he falls, or does a fall-to-stop? If you help him up, does he try to lean back when you are supporting him?

He gets up by himself maybe 50% of the time. Usually I help him because I don't want him to get cross and tired from doing it. One of his favorite 'games' is falling on purpose, its like his favorite thing and I'm really trying to encourage him to stay up on his skis instead of falling down every time he's tired or just wants to fall. Mostly when I help him up I am in front of him so I grab his hands and he reaches forward. When he helps himself up, he is pretty good about it and leans forward with his weight and pushes himself up.

How is his/her stamina for skiing? I think I am way more cautious, but i waited until my kids could stop without falling down, and showed decent speed control. (Which can be hard for little legs sometimes). I also went on a warm sunny day when it wasn’t very crowded.

Another thing that could come into play here is how long it’s been since he started skiing on his own?

When he's got plenty of snacks in him and he is well rested, he can go a long time. He is a big snacker, so we bring lots with us but he has had a few 6 hour ski days recently, taking breaks only to ride the lift/carpet or to have a snack/water. But, when he gets tired like most little ones he does get very intractible and stubborn and prone to tantrums about nothing which is part of the reason I'm hesitant to push him to try the harder greens. He only started making turns on his own a few weeks ago, about 3-4 sessions on snow since then.

Here is video of him actually making turns (as opposed to just straightlining down the hill).
He likes to jump while skiing and stays really centered doing so, and even tried to ski backwards the other day! (have a video of it but haven't uploaded it yet).
 

marzNC

Angel Diva
I had my 3-year-old skiing blues by the end of last year. We started on the bunny slope and stayed there until he could
(1) Follow my directions of turn/slow down/stop
(2) Demonstrated good control
(3) Demonstrated good choices
That list reminded me of the checklist used by the Massanutten ski school back in 2004-05. Here are the items for Red, Orange, and Yellow. Red is for the first-ever day at ski school for ages 4+. Orange is the next step that younger kids usually need before they are ready for Yellow. A tween who learned quickly might go from Red to Green. The groups were divided by age and ability. Then came Green, Blue, Black that matched up with trail ratings (MidA blacks more like blues in ski country). My daughter did Red on Day 1 at age 4, skied with me on Day 2, then Orange on Day 3. We did one more ski weekend that season when she did Orange again. As I remember she was still in Orange for her first day skiing the following season at age 5, then moved to Yellow for one day before going into Green.

From the video, he certainly looks great for his age! Looking at the items for Orange and Yellow, feels like working on the wedge stop, and turns with a stop, could be useful before moving to a more challenging trail. At the rate kids change at age 4, he could well surprise you in just a few weeks. I volunteered in my daughter's preschool classroom (ages 3-6, Montessori). It was fascinating the differences month to month.

Red
* snow play
* walks in boots
* knows ski parts
* stance/balance
* gets up with help
* scoots on skis
* shuffles on skis
* makes a wedge with help - needed edgie-wedgie for first 2 days at age 4
* gets around on flats
* follows directions

Orange
* puts on/takes off skis alone
* snow play
* stance/balance
* duck walks or side steps
* straight run
* makes a wedge without help
* wedge stop
* gets up with help
* gliding wedge
* listens to instructor

Yellow
* changes speed with wedge
* gets up without help
* rides chairlift safely
* stance/balance
* snow play
* right turn and stop
* left turn and stop
* makes connecting wedge turns
* follows the leader thru turns
* controls speed by turning
* always waits for instructor
 
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newboots

Angel Diva
Video: Soooo Cute!

I am so ready for this granddaughter (not due till May, probably not skiing until next season). <wink> Little Frances (Frankie) Caroline!
 

Sheena

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
Aw, he is doing awesome! I agree it is so so fun skiing with the little ones. My husband has been sick and has not gotten out much, so I have been taking the kids up on the weekends. While my little two are in there lessons, I have been skiing with my oldest, and on Sundays, I get to ski with my little two while she is in lessons. My younger dd likes to sing while she is skiing - it makes my heart happy.

You know, I don't think there is any big harm in trying going further up the mountain, if he seems like he would do OK. For me (and cause I am being extra cautius), I went on a warm afternoon after lunch, low crowds, nice soft snow, etc. If he doesn't like it, you can always try again later.
 

Kimmyt

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
We watched some youtube videos of kids skiing and he was like 'i want to do that, i want to go there!' and so i explained that we could try a bigger run but we would have to go up the bigger lift, etc. He seemed open to it (but I know that could change if the wind blows the wrong way!). We are headed to Steamboat this weekend so we will take a look at the maps and depending on crowds and weather may take him farther up the mountain, we'll probably at least do the bottom half of the mountain green runs if he's into it.

Bonus footage of him trying to be a freestyler.
 

AltaEgo

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
Time to teach him to get up by himself. (I would teach this indoors on old carpet first with just boots on then with skis on.). Have him lay on stomach looking "uphill". Have him move his legs and skis so that his heels are together. Then have him push himself up by walking his hands back and pushing himself up. He may still need help, but you definitely want to teach him this before going to other terrain.

He's awesome! Another Mountain Rat in the making!
 

newboots

Angel Diva
Way ahead of the pack! I see he already has an avy kit on his back.

:rotf:
 

Tvan

Angel Diva
He is mighty!!
 

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