Question: BOA boots: anyone with personal experience?

[contesstant]

Update! I was able to try on the Hawx Ultra 115 BOA and they are about the same volume-wise as the K2 except the heel seems narrower. The flex feels more workable to me and it is scads easier to get on even with the ZipFit. I ended up exchanging the K2 for the Atomic. Things I like: adjustable forward lean--default is 15 degrees. I will start there and may try the 12 for kicks (read: I'll try the 12 degrees. My husband calls me Tinker Bell because I like to tinker with boots, bikes, etc. I tell him I'm gathering data.) The cuff has clearance above the foot part of the boot, meaning the lower cuff is not sitting right on top of the boot, which is an issue in smaller boots and can "block" the full flex of the boot. This might be why it feels more "pliable" to flex. The liner has a removable tongue. I have a feeling I will end up using the ZipFits, though, because they feel like a dream in this boot. Downside: The power strap is attached with rivets that have to be punched out vs. just using a hex, and the stock power strap does not have any elastic. I have Atomic dual elastic straps that I would like to use, so I will have to get some bolts and pop the rivets and hope that nothing gets damaged. The ZipFit tongue also feels very snug in this boot, which is not how it is in literally every other boot I've used them in. I have been a hater of ZipFit tongues because they leave a gap in front of my shin. They are snug in this boot. For those who have never skied in a ZipFit, the heel hold and precision/control is unlike anything else. I think this is where the "they stiffen the boot" comes from. They don't change forward flex, but they do enhance the lateral control which with narrow feet I think is a huge bonus.

Instep seems similar to the K2 but I have less pressure there than in the K2s so that tells me it might be a tad higher? I am so used to crushing my instep to hold my foot, I'm not sure how I'll survive not torturing my feet several days per week.

Interestingly, my feet have "grown"! I had a feeling because my athletic shoes all seem a little shorter, especially on my left foot. Sure enough, I am measuring a 24.5 on the left and still a 23.5 on the right. The fitter asked if I was sure I didn't want to try a 23.5. LOL no, thank you! My left toes are at the end of the boot, but it's still nothing like they were in the 21.5.

Bonus: Black boots match everything.

 

[SnowHot]

@contesstant how do these Atomics compare to the boots you had just before your Langes?

 

[SnowHot]

Thanx again @SnowHot . I enjoyed your video interview w/the K2 guy. I now have a much better understanding of how the BOA systems work.

I really appreciate the added input from Tom (K2) and Matt Manser/Onenerdykid(Atomic) on SkiTalk.
These guys are global boot designers for their companies and offer a wealth of information.

 

[contesstant]

@contesstant how do these Atomics compare to the boots you had just before your Langes?

The Redster STI are lower volume all around. I had a horrible time in them in powder and crud, especially if it was really cold. I'm still debating if the Ultra 115 is too stiff. I did throw the custom Sidas foamed liners I have in them and they fit perfectly. Brent made the tongues in them, especially towards the top, super thick so they engage the flex really early which I really really like.

 

[SnowHot]

Can't wait to see how well they work on snow.

*I'm surprised that the redsters didn't wow you on snow. Maybe you're skiing differently and could work that now?*

 

[contesstant]

Can't wait to see how well they work on snow.

*I'm surprised that the redsters didn't wow you on snow. Maybe you're skiing differently and could work that now?*

They were great on groomers and in not-butt-a**-cold temps. A bit on the stiff side, and so narrow in the toe box, I developed a tailor's bunion that is quite troublesome. I'd have to have that area modified to use them again. I can flex a 110 boot really well on groomers, when I can stay balanced, but when I get into crud or powder or anything steep and am constantly working to maintain balance, I start fighting the boot. (Caveat: the Lange is a 110 but I think it skis more like a 95 or 100 flex.) I'm going to try on the Hawx Ultra 105 to see how it feels compared to the 115. I'm impressed with the heel lock in the stock liner in the Hawx line.

When I had the CT scans that found the FMD in my arteries, they also discovered I have this https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/hea...eases/superior-canal-dehiscence-syndrome-scds. It's a thinning of the bone in the inner ear that I was born with. It causes balance issues, and I think that this is why I get frankly overwhelmed as soon as I start to get tossed around, whether on a horse, skis, or a bike. Throw in speed and I literally start to panic. Then throw in the fact that if I crash and fall hard, or get schwacked by someone, I am at risk of a carotid arterial dissection, and I sometimes wonder if I'm crazy to keep doing all this stuff I'm not a quitter but am learning to accept that I have some limitations and likely will not meet some of the goals I had set for myself in terms of skiing when I first moved to Utah.

Comparing the Lange RS to the Hawx Ultra--I was adding new padding to the liner in the Lange's all last season around the cuff and the forefoot just to keep things snug. And it was a custom foamed liner. Throw the same liner in the Hawx and it's so much more snug. I've tried them on at varying times of the day to see how they feel with my morning feet vs. my evening feet and they are snug no matter what. I think that's a good sign.

 

[SnowHot]

They were great on groomers and in not-butt-a**-cold temps. A bit on the stiff side, and so narrow in the toe box, I developed a tailor's bunion that is quite troublesome. I'd have to have that area modified to use them again. I can flex a 110 boot really well on groomers, when I can stay balanced, but when I get into crud or powder or anything steep and am constantly working to maintain balance, I start fighting the boot. (Caveat: the Lange is a 110 but I think it skis more like a 95 or 100 flex.) I'm going to try on the Hawx Ultra 105 to see how it feels compared to the 115. I'm impressed with the heel lock in the stock liner in the Hawx line.

That is really good feedback and definitely something to feed the bootfitting nerd in me. Thanks

When I had the CT scans that found the FMD in my arteries, they also discovered I have this https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/hea...eases/superior-canal-dehiscence-syndrome-scds. It's a thinning of the bone in the inner ear that I was born with. It causes balance issues, and I think that this is why I get frankly overwhelmed as soon as I start to get tossed around, whether on a horse, skis, or a bike. Throw in speed and I literally start to panic. Then throw in the fact that if I crash and fall hard, or get schwacked by someone, I am at risk of a carotid arterial dissection, and I sometimes wonder if I'm crazy to keep doing all this stuff I'm not a quitter but am learning to accept that I have some limitations and likely will not meet some of the goals I had set for myself in terms of skiing when I first moved to Utah.

That is kind of fascinating to me. My older sister was diagnosed with meniere's disese several years ago. As soon as she was diagnosed she realized why skiing and biking were difficult for her, mostly due to vertigo affect and spacial awareness. All of a sudden she felt validated for her anxiety when skiing. She has found coping mechanisms that help her during flare ups, but has opted to not pursue skiing. To be fair, she only tried skiing a few times because she wanted to participate with the rest of us, and was uncomfortable so skiing was never her lifestyle.

You, however, have a skiing and MTB lifestyle. Hopefully being aware of the SCD will also give you the ability to find coping mechanisms to continue in your lifestyle.

I was talking to @chasinghorizons who happens to be an audiologist about meniere's disease and since she was here visiting when I read this thread, I asked her about SCD. She is a wealth of information.

Comparing the Lange RS to the Hawx Ultra--I was adding new padding to the liner in the Lange's all last season around the cuff and the forefoot just to keep things snug. And it was a custom foamed liner. Throw the same liner in the Hawx and it's so much more snug. I've tried them on at varying times of the day to see how they feel with my morning feet vs. my evening feet and they are snug no matter what. I think that's a good sign.

The new fitting results seem quite positive. I hope this is your season!

 

[contesstant]

That is really good feedback and definitely something to feed the bootfitting nerd in me. Thanks


That is kind of fascinating to me. My older sister was diagnosed with meniere's disese several years ago. As soon as she was diagnosed she realized why skiing and biking were difficult for her, mostly due to vertigo affect and spacial awareness. All of a sudden she felt validated for her anxiety when skiing. She has found coping mechanisms that help her during flare ups, but has opted to not pursue skiing. To be fair, she only tried skiing a few times because she wanted to participate with the rest of us, and was uncomfortable so skiing was never her lifestyle.

You, however, have a skiing and MTB lifestyle. Hopefully being aware of the SCD will also give you the ability to find coping mechanisms to continue in your lifestyle.

I was talking to @chasinghorizons who happens to be an audiologist about meniere's disease and since she was here visiting when I read this thread, I asked her about SCD. She is a wealth of information.



The new fitting results seem quite positive. I hope this is your season!

I swear, my overcautious nature was an instinctive mechanism. I've always hated rollercoasters and having my neck adjusted by a chiropractor. Turns out, both are strongly discouraged if you have FMD, especially in the vertebral arteries (which I do.) Skiing is also discouraged and it weighs on me. I still have a lot more fear of getting hit than crashing on my own. I did ski off piste a lot more the past two seasons thanks to the Langes, and it was nice to get away from the insanity on the groomers as much as I could. I am working on regaining my fitness (heavy lifting that involves vasalva is also expressly a no-no) which has declined since this diagnosis because my HR/BP is also supposed to remain below a threshold. Lame. But if it's not one thing, it's another as we age!

Back to BOA boots--we'll see how the flex feels in the 105 vs. the 115. Once I make that decision, I'll get the liners molded which will give me 3 liner options to play with. I'd use the ZipFits if I could figure out a way to make the tongues more rigid. I've been excited about BOA boots since they first came out and knew I'd want to try them if and when they were offered in LV. I'm excited to get them on snow!

 

[contesstant]

OK, I currently have 3 pair of Hawx Ultra BOA in my possession. The 115s are too stiff. I'm sure they'd be fine in normal temps and easy conditions, but I have learned that a stiff boot tends to be too much in serious chop and powder. So, I have a 105 women's with BOA on the foot, and a 100 men's with double BOA. The fit is identical. The cuff height is identical. The only difference besides the double BOA is the women's has the adjustable forward lean, but the men's doesn't. Conundrum. The double BOA just has this incredibly even-feeling squeeze and if they both had adjustable forward lean, there would be no question whatsoever. But I'm funny about forward lean. But I also always end up maxing out the cuff buckles even with the catches moved all the way over, then I end up padding around my calf. I don't see that being an issue with the BOA cuff. I'm inclined to go with the double BOA, but will sleep on it. (The other "bonus"of double BOA is it's $140 cheaper.)

 

[HuntersEmma57]

Update! I was able to try on the Hawx Ultra 115 BOA and they are about the same volume-wise as the K2 except the heel seems narrower. The flex feels more workable to me and it is scads easier to get on even with the ZipFit. I ended up exchanging the K2 for the Atomic. Things I like: adjustable forward lean--default is 15 degrees. I will start there and may try the 12 for kicks (read: I'll try the 12 degrees. My husband calls me Tinker Bell because I like to tinker with boots, bikes, etc. I tell him I'm gathering data.) The cuff has clearance above the foot part of the boot, meaning the lower cuff is not sitting right on top of the boot, which is an issue in smaller boots and can "block" the full flex of the boot. This might be why it feels more "pliable" to flex. The liner has a removable tongue. I have a feeling I will end up using the ZipFits, though, because they feel like a dream in this boot. Downside: The power strap is attached with rivets that have to be punched out vs. just using a hex, and the stock power strap does not have any elastic. I have Atomic dual elastic straps that I would like to use, so I will have to get some bolts and pop the rivets and hope that nothing gets damaged. The ZipFit tongue also feels very snug in this boot, which is not how it is in literally every other boot I've used them in. I have been a hater of ZipFit tongues because they leave a gap in front of my shin. They are snug in this boot. For those who have never skied in a ZipFit, the heel hold and precision/control is unlike anything else. I think this is where the "they stiffen the boot" comes from. They don't change forward flex, but they do enhance the lateral control which with narrow feet I think is a huge bonus.

Instep seems similar to the K2 but I have less pressure there than in the K2s so that tells me it might be a tad higher? I am so used to crushing my instep to hold my foot, I'm not sure how I'll survive not torturing my feet several days per week.

Interestingly, my feet have "grown"! I had a feeling because my athletic shoes all seem a little shorter, especially on my left foot. Sure enough, I am measuring a 24.5 on the left and still a 23.5 on the right. The fitter asked if I was sure I didn't want to try a 23.5. LOL no, thank you! My left toes are at the end of the boot, but it's still nothing like they were in the 21.5.

Bonus: Black boots match everything.

How is it no one warned me that it's not uncommon for feet to lengthen (arches to fall?) as we age? Sometime in my late-50s, my shoe size went from 8 to 8.5 seemingly overnight. And yet my arch is still stupidly high. All my treasured well-loved shoes and BOOTS had to go. I still mourn the cowboy boots in particular. My mother-in-law took all my dress shoes. I learned my lesson and only replaced about 10% of my dressy shoes. But my boot collection somehow got bigger.

 

[BlizzardBabe]

How is it no one warned me that it's not uncommon for feet to lengthen (arches to fall?) as we age? Sometime in my late-50s, my shoe size went from 8 to 8.5 seemingly overnight.

Unfortunately, this also applies to noses and ears.

 

[contesstant]

How is it no one warned me that it's not uncommon for feet to lengthen (arches to fall?) as we age? Sometime in my late-50s, my shoe size went from 8 to 8.5 seemingly overnight. And yet my arch is still stupidly high. All my treasured well-loved shoes and BOOTS had to go. I still mourn the cowboy boots in particular. My mother-in-law took all my dress shoes. I learned my lesson and only replaced about 10% of my dressy shoes. But my boot collection somehow got bigger.

I hope mine don't flatten out more, but they likely will. The footbeds in my boots do seem to pull the toes back which is good, and part of their function.

@BlizzardBabe, I'll keep my hair long enough to hide the growing ears.

 

[skinnyfootskis]

I have the Atomic Hawks Ultra 115 with a custom liner, but I might go back to the original one. I had so much boot work done because my calves are too small. There still is a bit of movement but it's a process. I need heaters in them too. They are light to carry. I was in a race boot before. Dalbello DRS 110 25.5. It's for sale, we'll I probably will just donate them. About 20 days only on them. They were just too tight for my 11s

 

[Cinski]

Check out America's Best Bootfitters website. www.bootfitters.com. They have extensive boot reviews, specs, etc. I just got new boots. Actually ended up in a traditional 4 buckle boot, the Lange Shadow but tried on BOA boots and liked how they felt also. The bootfitter I went to had good things to say about them.

 

[BlizzardBabe]

Check out America's Best Bootfitters website. www.bootfitters.com. They have extensive boot reviews, specs, etc. I just got new boots. Actually ended up in a traditional 4 buckle boot, the Lange Shadow but tried on BOA boots and liked how they felt also. The bootfitter I went to had good things to say about them.

You won't be disappointed in the Shadow @Cinski . I've had mine for two seasons and love them. Unfortunately, the liners are shot so I'm looking into ZipFits. The liner in the Shadow was specially designed to work with the innovative shell, so I'm not sure how the ZipFit integration will work. I have an appointment w/a fitter next Friday, so we'll see. I have an extremely LV foot, so even with the Shadow LV I had to shim the ankles and heels after about 30 days. Still, the best boot I've ever had, hands down.

 

[contesstant]

Check out America's Best Bootfitters website. www.bootfitters.com. They have extensive boot reviews, specs, etc. I just got new boots. Actually ended up in a traditional 4 buckle boot, the Lange Shadow but tried on BOA boots and liked how they felt also. The bootfitter I went to had good things to say about them.

I might be missing something, but I don't see many reviews on current equipment? I don't give too much credence to boot reviews, but do like to read about what features are offered.

I heated my ZipFit liners to snug into the Hawx shells. I now have 3 liner options for this boot, although I doubt I'll use the stock liners because the ZipFits and the Sidas I had for the Lange's feel great in the Hawx. It will come down to which one feels best on snow. Everything feels super snug in ski boots after a summer of sandals and being barefoot a lot. I did stock up on ZipFit Omfit just in case.

 

[Skibarbie]

You won't be disappointed in the Shadow @Cinski . I've had mine for two seasons and love them. Unfortunately, the liners are shot so I'm looking into ZipFits. The liner in the Shadow was specially designed to work with the innovative shell, so I'm not sure how the ZipFit integration will work. I have an appointment w/a fitter next Friday, so we'll see. I have an extremely LV foot, so even with the Shadow LV I had to shim the ankles and heels after about 30 days. Still, the best boot I've ever had, hands down.

I put ZipFits in my Shadows 95 LV and never skied the original liners. I have a wide forefoot but very narrow heels but my boot guy is a magician as never in a bazillion years did I imagine I would be in a lv boot but here I am!
ZipFit appears to be having some issues with things getting to the US this Fall. Boot guy has been waiting on the cork products to take up a bit more volume on my right ski shoe.
not enough snow here in Utah yet so I wait…..⛷

 

[BlizzardBabe]

ZipFit appears to be having some issues with things getting to the US this Fall. Boot guy has been waiting on the cork products to take up a bit more volume on my right ski shoe.
not enough snow here in Utah yet so I wait…..⛷

Same here, @Skibarbie . I had an appointment on Friday and the shop cannot get the size I need. They've been waiting, waiting, waiting, for their second Zipfit shipment. Supply chain issues + the fact that Zipfit is a small company.

The good news is that my boot fitter himself skis in the Zipfit/Shadow combo. He swears by both products and he's been doing this for 40 years. He knew Sven Coomer as well - originally met him in 1972. I just bought Coomer's book so we had a great jaw session even though I couldn't get the liners . . . yet.

 

[contesstant]

I finally skied a couple runs with the new Hawx Ultra double BOA and my old ZipFits. I am really pleased so far! I have the Atomic dual strap on the boots, which has an elastic booster type strap and a non-elastic upper strap. With the BOA cuff and the dual strap, I was actually LOOSENING the cuff--this never happens! I am always cranking things tighter and tighter. It wasn't too tight, but I'm in early-season mode and needed a bit more give in the cuff. I felt no decrease in control. I am so happy about this because I know that in powder, I will want the cuff to be a bit looser, but in past boots, I would feel a loss of control or connection with the boot.

We are in a bad snow situation, so I'm not sure how soon I'll really get to put them to the test, especially in colder conditions. The forecast is not looking good, and it is too warm for snowmaking

 

[contesstant]

The more I ski in these boots, the happier I am. I pulled the ZipFit liners out because I feel like they were pushing my knees forward (almost like a spoiler behind my calf) and causing my knees to hurt. I used some Sidas foamed liners I have and skied in some of the nastiest snow I have ever seen and I had no knee pain, no quad burn (always a good sign) and actually enjoyed the crappy "good for you" snow. I feel so much more control without having to crank the dials and squeeze my feet and calves. I heat molded the stock liners and will try those next, as they are more comfortable than the Sidas liners.

As someone who has overtightened buckles, padded liners in spots to take up volume, etc. to go to loosening the lower BOA during the day and not have to fiddle with the cuff BOA at all, I am so happy. Is it the BOA? Is it the Hawx Ultra being the correct shape for my foot and calf? Is it the lower flex than I have been in for several years? I have no idea. It'll be interesting to see how others with wider feet and calves feel about BOA, and double BOA in particular.