Asymmetrical turns

[NewEnglandSkier]

I know if's not uncommon to have one direction of turn be stronger than the other (for me it has always seemed like my turns to the right are better than my turns to the left and my use of CARV seems to confirm this)---but is it weird have one leg get tired and not the other??? I've noticed this before that my right quad gets tired but not my left one sometimes! Anyone ever heard of getting backseat in one direction but not the other? It mostly happens in more challenging conditions/heavier snow conditions, not on a daily basis.

 

[Aerlind]

Absolutely. I'm far more comfortable turning to the right, but I'd rather travel to the left (meaning the uphill side is my left side). Sometimes, if I'm doing a long traverse, or several long traverses, whichever is my uphill leg gets much more sore than the downhill leg! All of this is on challenging/steep stuff.

It's very very normal for beings (human AND animal) to be asymmetrical. I spend my non-ski time riding horses, and I can tell you, my horse is much stiffer when travelling left vs right. The best thing you can do is work your hard side mindfully, to get more comfortable and stronger!

I'm told, though can't confirm, this is also the root of the difference between snowboarders riding "normal" vs "Goofy". It has everything to do with which way you're more comfortable travelling.

 

[contesstant]

100% yes.

 

[marzNC]

Even after doing lessons regularly for 6-7 years, my turns to the bad side were noticeably worse. It look a few solo lessons with a PSIA Examiner at my home hill over two seasons to finally feel making a turn correctly on the bad side. He had to try assorted cues and suggestions to make it happen. Took another couple season before the new movement became ingrained. I got other suggestions from the favorite instructors I worked with at more than one destination resorts related to improving that side.

The irony of all that work is that now my good side turn needs work. I realized that last season at some point. My instructor at Wolf Creek noticed a slight difference when we were working on carving a few weeks ago.

One indication of my asymmetry is that one hip is far more flexible than the other.

 

[diymom]

I know if's not uncommon to have one direction of turn be stronger than the other (for me it has always seemed like my turns to the right are better than my turns to the left and my use of CARV seems to confirm this)---but is it weird have one leg get tired and not the other??? I've noticed this before that my right quad gets tired but not my left one sometimes! Anyone ever heard of getting backseat in one direction but not the other? It mostly happens in more challenging conditions/heavier snow conditions, not on a daily basis.

Totally get it. For the longest time I claimed a "lazy left" until an instructor showed me how to run my booster strap under the shell. Then after my new ACL I had issues with my wonky leg fatiguing well before the other one. But I've been focusing on getting that leg stronger. Umm, now I am noticing weaker turns on the other side on steeper runs. So now I guess I need to work on getting what had been my good side stronger to match what had been my weaker side? But yes, unequal strength, stamina, whatever is not unheard of.

 

[HuntersEmma57]

That difference is why I never fully got comfortable as a telemark skier. I have sprained my right knee 3 times and never could fully commit - learned timidity. This isn't as obvious alpine skiing, but I still have a favorite side for hockey stops and when dropping the first turn. I've checked myself on that, but I have to be thinking about it and sometimes I just wanna cruise. I have worked strengthen my right knee and build confidence while on my bike. I force myself to start on the right side and intentionally focus on even effort on pedal strokes.

 

[ilovepugs]

100000000%. It’s so, so common. Several members of this forum have seen me get stuck trying to turn right on bump runs.

 

[Amplify]

omg ilovepugs I feel this so hard. A lot of the time, as long as I keep moving I am pretty okay on bumps but sometimes if I stop, and my next move necessitates turning to the left, I just CANNOT get started again. I will side-slip down that bump to the next good option and try to trick myself back into a flow state like that, like "see, you're moving just like normal" but nope - it's going to take some interminably long moments of getting myself unstuck first. wtf.

Nine times out of ten, if I suddenly realize I have randomly traversed across an entire width of bumps and run out of "one more and THEN I'll turn" options, it just so happens that I've traveled all the way right, subconsciously avoiding committing to a hard left turn. It happened this season on a tricky section of a bumpy run right under the lift line, and some like 6-year old or whatever kid kept shouting encouraging things down at me and I was like I KNOW, KID!! lol. I did eventually turn, and continue merrily down, as evidenced by the fact that I am here typing. But it felt a little dicey there for a while.

I was a very serious ballet dancer as a teenager, and one day doing some random thing, I broke a toe on my right foot and just told no one. Kept dancing in pointe shoes on it every single day for hours, etc. It was absolutely excruciating, was purple for a couple weeks, and I've never had full motion in it since, but I was young and dumb and figured if I told anyone, they might somehow hold it against me (?) so I just forced myself through the pain. dk if that's why, but it never really got fully better. It used to be very painful in certain situations, even into my 20s, but it has since faded into mostly just a conditioned expectation of pain - I definitely instinctively shy away from putting full weight on that foot, even though I actually can't remember the last time it truly hurt in the course of normal activity. This affects me in rock climbing as well, where I very instinctively avoid "right foot facing in" kind of hip maneuverability, and have to really think consciously to move like that on that side of my body.

 

[marzNC]

I know if's not uncommon to have one direction of turn be stronger than the other (for me it has always seemed like my turns to the right are better than my turns to the left and my use of CARV seems to confirm this)---but is it weird have one leg get tired and not the other??? I've noticed this before that my right quad gets tired but not my left one sometimes! Anyone ever heard of getting backseat in one direction but not the other? It mostly happens in more challenging conditions/heavier snow conditions, not on a daily basis.

Thinking more about your question . . . if one leg is more tired then perhaps it's because that leg is not being as "efficient" as the other. The ideal for making a turn is to use relatively little muscle by using gravity based on an optimal body position. Of course, there are a lot of moving parts to make that happen.

When I tweaked a calf muscle a while back, it took months to heal completely. What I discovered is that if my technique was good then it didn't hurt. If I rush a turn, then it would twinge. That was especially true in heavy spring snow.

 

[Ms Mia]

I know if's not uncommon to have one direction of turn be stronger than the other (for me it has always seemed like my turns to the right are better than my turns to the left and my use of CARV seems to confirm this)---but is it weird have one leg get tired and not the other??? I've noticed this before that my right quad gets tired but not my left one sometimes! Anyone ever heard of getting backseat in one direction but not the other? It mostly happens in more challenging conditions/heavier snow conditions, not on a daily basis.

This is me 100%!!!! Literally today on mushy spring snow, the whole time my right quad was burning and my right leg is way more tired this afternoon at home. I know turning left is my problem, when my right leg is the outside leg, I see it because my skis aren't properly aligned on those turns. I don't initiate properly with my right ski.

My ski instructor suggested practising lots on a piste we have here which is canted to the right, I.e. the right turn is easy (my good turn) and the left turn is always a bit against gravity, so i really need to use my weight properly and train my right foot to get out in front to initiate the turn. No surprises, I kind of hate that piste!

 

[TiffAlt]

Reading advice here closely, because I'm also in this boat but I don't know how to fix it. I feel that if I'm not going fast, I can't buy a right turn to save my life. I'm much better turning left and heavily favor that side because I feel so much more stable. I have a weaker side due to a childhood TBI. It's not too apparent to the layman but doctors can tell without me saying it. I can also trip spectacularly just walking. That bias translates to my skiing.

 

[scandium]

Reading advice here closely, because I'm also in this boat but I don't know how to fix it. I feel that if I'm not going fast, I can't buy a right turn to save my life. I'm much better turning left and heavily favor that side because I feel so much more stable. I have a weaker side due to a childhood TBI. It's not too apparent to the layman but doctors can tell without me saying it. I can also trip spectacularly just walking. That bias translates to my skiing.

Given that there's permanent imbalance I wonder if there's any equipment modification that might help compensate and also allow you to feel more confident. I was thinking like 4-track skiing where you have the tiny skis attached to a crutch-style ski pole so that becomes a more important part of your technique, but maybe just a single outrigger would work better since it's a one-sided concern. However I'm not sure how that translates to the classic model of using feet and legs primarily...

 

[Verve]

I have been doing a lot of work on this in my clinic this year! The cue that helped for me was a hip lifting cue on my inside leg when initiating the turn - like popping your butt up onto a high barstool on that side. My uphill leg was getting "stuck" behind my downhill leg in the turn initiation (not in a dramatic way, my turns look pretty good to an outside observer, but I wasn't getting the same smooth, round turn with good inside edge hold when turning left). Working on this has helped with everything - and most noticeably bumps skiing where I would always strategize to favor my strong side and now I feel like I have more options of lines.

There were a lot of different cues offered, that was just the one that clicked for me.

 

[ilovepugs]

I have been doing a lot of work on this in my clinic this year! The cue that helped for me was a hip lifting cue on my inside leg when initiating the turn - like popping your butt up onto a high barstool on that side.

Ha! I learned that cue in my women’s clinic too.

 

[BlizzardBabe]

I love this thread. I have to focus, focus, focus, to ensure that my left turn is correct. The good feedback I've gotten in skiing heavy slush (interspersed w/ice) the last 3 days is that my legs are equally tired. I must be doing something right.

 

[BlizzardBabe]

I have been doing a lot of work on this in my clinic this year! The cue that helped for me was a hip lifting cue on my inside leg when initiating the turn - like popping your butt up onto a high barstool on that side.

Hah!! I've been using that barstool analogy for years - with a lot of PSIA clinicians. It seems to resonate w/many (though maybe not quite as many in Utah ).

 

[Ms Mia]

I have been doing a lot of work on this in my clinic this year! The cue that helped for me was a hip lifting cue on my inside leg when initiating the turn - like popping your butt up onto a high barstool on that side.

Wait, so if you're about to turn left, and your right foot is initiating and becoming the new outside ski, you lift your left hip/ butt cheek up and behind? Like the barstool is on your left behind you?

 

[TiffAlt]

I have the same question as @Ms Mia ! I'm planning to try this on Friday then.

 

[Verve]

@TiffAlt and @Ms Mia I'll defer to the PSIA divas but what I think of is just pulling that inside hip straight up, like pulled by a string up from the front of the hip socket, but not back. Because you're driving into the turn. I think it essentially ends up keeping your hips neutral by fighting the urge to drop that inside hip into the turn. I'll look around for a video if folks are interested!

 

[santacruz skier]

@TiffAlt and @Ms Mia I'll defer to the PSIA divas but what I think of is just pulling that inside hip straight up, like pulled by a string up from the front of the hip socket, but not back. Because you're driving into the turn. I think it essentially ends up keeping your hips neutral by fighting the urge to drop that inside hip into the turn. I'll look around for a video if folks are interested!

Taos instructor clarified same thing!