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Alterra to acquire Crystal
- Thread starter Jilly
- Start date
Christy
Angel Diva
Well that is truly shi**y horrible news.
John Kircher just bought it!
It seems like everything in this whole f***ing state is being ruined.
There is so much good at Crystal. It's geared toward good skiers and families not bros or young dudes (no half pipe or even much of a terrain park for instance). It's got the funky places like the Snorting Elk Tavern and the RV lot. (I don't RV but this is a much loved budget option for NW skiers). How much will survive?
GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR
John Kircher just bought it!
It seems like everything in this whole f***ing state is being ruined.
There is so much good at Crystal. It's geared toward good skiers and families not bros or young dudes (no half pipe or even much of a terrain park for instance). It's got the funky places like the Snorting Elk Tavern and the RV lot. (I don't RV but this is a much loved budget option for NW skiers). How much will survive?
GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR
Christy
Angel Diva
https://www.rei.com/blog/snowsports/why-john-kircher-decided-to-sell-crystal-mountain
I still don't get it. Stevens are Crystal are totally different directions from Seattle. They have different amenities and attract different crowds. It's not even possible for Stevens to take all the business because they have parking lots that fill if you aren't there by 10.
I still don't get it. Stevens are Crystal are totally different directions from Seattle. They have different amenities and attract different crowds. It's not even possible for Stevens to take all the business because they have parking lots that fill if you aren't there by 10.
marzNC
Angel Diva
That's the case now. But what about in 2-3 years after Vail Resorts puts money into Stevens? John Kircher is not that young. His son is 26 and not quite experienced enough to take a lead role. John knows first hand the amount of work and money it will take to continue making needed improvements to Crystal so that it remains competitive for the next 10-20 years. He knows what it took to make Big Sky successful after buying it for Boyne Resorts and running it for quite a while.
The Mueller family made a comparable decision to walk away from Okemo and Crested Butte. They were very invested personally in terms of how long they have been in charge of Okemo. Their adult children will also have to figure out what to do next while the parents are close enough to retirement age to take it easy for a while.
It's one thing to have a successful family business like Berkshire East or Jiminy Peak or Wachusett, but quite another for a large ski resort like Crested Butte or Crystal that has to deal with the reality of competing with resorts owned by Vail Resorts or Alterra. Snowbird, Jackson Hole, Aspen are big enough and well-established enough to do well as independent companies. But few ski resorts are in that category.
Christy
Angel Diva
I don't mean to downplay how tough it is to run a ski resort. But that's part of it – – Stevens isn't a resort, and it never will be. It can't be anything more than a day use area, and one that is also very limited by the fact that they can't build any more parking. The Forest Service generally takes about a decade to even approve a lift replacement. There is no way in hell they would ever allow something like a hotel. It can be hard to get to in winter. Four-wheel-drive or chains are commonly required, and the highway routinely closes for avalanche control, sometimes for days. Crystal is a far easier drive.
I just can't imagine that Vail could do anything to it that would hurt Crystal's business. As much as many of us want to believe that Seattle will stop growing and that the million people who just moved here will move away, it's not going to happen. Crystal is so much bigger than any other Washington resort, even taking into account the modest expansion plan at Stevens; it's the only Washington area with lodging; It's the only spot that even could remotely be considered a destination resort or a resort at all. It's the only place that has anything in summer for tourists. It serves a different geographic area, in large part).
This article gives a good overview of skiing in the area:
https://liftblog.com/2017/09/15/in-a-booming-region-stevens-pass-looks-to-expand/
I mean, I get that I am not privy to all the details of these businesses, but the competition with Stevens reason does not make any sense. I wonder if after a year he just realized he was in over his head. Maybe to run any kind of ski area at all you have to be much better capitalized or something.
I just can't imagine that Vail could do anything to it that would hurt Crystal's business. As much as many of us want to believe that Seattle will stop growing and that the million people who just moved here will move away, it's not going to happen. Crystal is so much bigger than any other Washington resort, even taking into account the modest expansion plan at Stevens; it's the only Washington area with lodging; It's the only spot that even could remotely be considered a destination resort or a resort at all. It's the only place that has anything in summer for tourists. It serves a different geographic area, in large part).
This article gives a good overview of skiing in the area:
https://liftblog.com/2017/09/15/in-a-booming-region-stevens-pass-looks-to-expand/
I mean, I get that I am not privy to all the details of these businesses, but the competition with Stevens reason does not make any sense. I wonder if after a year he just realized he was in over his head. Maybe to run any kind of ski area at all you have to be much better capitalized or something.
I've always felt that Alterra was yes, buying resorts etc, but also getting people on this all inclusive pass.
I've never before been able to ski another area at the same cost as my season pass at my home mountain. So maybe Alterra is also "buying" pass holders. I ski Tremblant as my home mountain, but with the Ikon, now I can ski other places at no cost for lift tickets.
I know we're going to see a lot of the Toronto crowd up at Tremblant. There were a lot on the MAX Pass last year. This year their Blue Mtn Ikon pass will allow to ski Tremblant at no cost for lifts.
I've never before been able to ski another area at the same cost as my season pass at my home mountain. So maybe Alterra is also "buying" pass holders. I ski Tremblant as my home mountain, but with the Ikon, now I can ski other places at no cost for lift tickets.
I know we're going to see a lot of the Toronto crowd up at Tremblant. There were a lot on the MAX Pass last year. This year their Blue Mtn Ikon pass will allow to ski Tremblant at no cost for lifts.
mustski
Angel Diva
To quote from the article ....“I always thought it would be better to own 100 percent of something smaller than 35 percent of a larger company and be in control of your own decisions,” he said. This may have been in the back of his mind all along.
This is the heart of it right here. Alterra needed to get a foothold in the PNW and everyone has their price. It's a business, not a hobby. There would definitely have been folks from Seattle that would have switched to Stevens simply because the Epic pass would have opened up so many vacation destinations - including Whistler. Even if Crystal is currently the most popular area (I know nothing about this - just speculating) there would have been some attrition to the Epic pass because of the variety of options. As to parking ... are shuttles a possibility from parking down below?
This is the heart of it right here. Alterra needed to get a foothold in the PNW and everyone has their price. It's a business, not a hobby. There would definitely have been folks from Seattle that would have switched to Stevens simply because the Epic pass would have opened up so many vacation destinations - including Whistler. Even if Crystal is currently the most popular area (I know nothing about this - just speculating) there would have been some attrition to the Epic pass because of the variety of options. As to parking ... are shuttles a possibility from parking down below?
marzNC
Angel Diva
Sometimes perception is reality. Vail Resorts bought three ski areas in the midwest. A bunch of money was spent to upgrade lifts and lodges in the first few years after the changes from family owners to VR. Those are are still fundamentally small ski hills that are very crowded on weekends. But I bet all the other ski hill owners in the region are feeling pressure to compete against the Epic pass.
My guess is that Boyne was willing to join Ikon as a full partner for all their ski resorts because Boyne Mountain and Boyne Highlands in Michigan were included as well. That's where the Kircher family started out back in the 1950s. John Kircher is no longer part of Boyne management, but I'm sure he is still watching what's happening closely.
marzNC
Angel Diva
From a business standpoint, it's not just about winter sports. Begin part of Vail Resorts will make it easier for Stevens to expand summer activities. Crystal has to compete year round with Stevens. Financial success in the long run may well be based more on summer revenue than winter revenue. I know that's true in the southeast and Mid-Atlantic. Seems to be the case in New England as well but I've only been paying attention to that region for a few years. The successful ski areas that have no lodging have solid summer activities, even if the ski terrain quite limited. Meaning under 300 acres total, with no off-piste terrain at all.
Christy
Angel Diva
It's hard to imagine how Stevens could compete with Crystal in summer. Stevens has mt biking and I don't know how there'd be room for anything else, or the appeal--it's so scarred up and ugly in summer, Hikers go out of their way to avoid it even though the PCT goes on the edge of it. Meanwhile Crystal is across the street from Mt Rainier NP and actually has the bulk of the lodging for NP tourists in that area, plus the gondola, and a nice space for weddings, etc.
I think you are right, and that this is the long and short of it.
It will be interesting to see what they do, and they have to do something--otherwise it's not possible to increase business. Right now Stevens does have some old school buses that they shuttle people up from the valley (42 miles away) but it's now mostly a "drop your teenager off there" kind of thing, since no one wants to ride an old bus with teenagers for 40+ miles. Vail will likely be good for Stevens.
I think you are right, and that this is the long and short of it.
It will be interesting to see what they do, and they have to do something--otherwise it's not possible to increase business. Right now Stevens does have some old school buses that they shuttle people up from the valley (42 miles away) but it's now mostly a "drop your teenager off there" kind of thing, since no one wants to ride an old bus with teenagers for 40+ miles. Vail will likely be good for Stevens.
marzNC
Angel Diva
Alterra is wasting no time in gearing up for Crystal. They have selected Frank DeBerry to be Pres. and COO for Crystal. He's been running Snowshoe since 2011 and was part of Intrawest before that. By all accounts, the regulars at Snowshoe have been quite happy. That includes people who own condos there that they use themselves and as rentals.
https://www.alterramtnco.com/news/2018/09/10/new-president-coo-crystal
Snowshoe has a comprehensive free shuttle system. People have to drive to Snowshoe but once they get there, the car stays parked. There are two bases that are a 10 min drive apart, plus resort lodging that is in another location even farther from the ski lifts. While there is only a couple hundred acres of ski trails, Snowshoe owns thousands of acres that are used during spring/summer/fall.
https://www.alterramtnco.com/news/2018/09/10/new-president-coo-crystal
Snowshoe has a comprehensive free shuttle system. People have to drive to Snowshoe but once they get there, the car stays parked. There are two bases that are a 10 min drive apart, plus resort lodging that is in another location even farther from the ski lifts. While there is only a couple hundred acres of ski trails, Snowshoe owns thousands of acres that are used during spring/summer/fall.
marzNC
Angel Diva
That was fast. Private companies can really make things happen. On 10/01/18 Alterra announced the closing is done for the purchase of Crystal in WA. The news was posted on the Crystal website on 10/4.
