Help Needed: About to Give Up

[contesstant]

@2ski2moro, what a great reminder. This thread is timely, too! I beat myself up ALL.THE.TIME. It doesn't help that I feel like I'm under constant MA, skiing with an L3 all the time.

SallyCat, you need a day of fresh snow to just go PLAY in! Go fart around in the kid's tree zone, go play on easier off-piste stuff, etc. We had an epic powder day a week ago, and all the work went out the window--we played! It was good for the soul.

 

[Fluffy Kitty]

The bottom line is that I can't ski anything but a groomed trail, which means I can't take advantage of the incredible resource in my backyard of mown-but-ungroomed trails. I can't ski with my friends here, and I can't enjoy the exercise of skinning up because I can't ski down. I'm sick of skiing crowded resorts; bored of sitting on chairlifts, and most of all, furious at how f-ing weak my ability is after all this time and all the work I put into it. I think I need a time out.

I think I understand your frustrations better now.

1) You live in a place where there are fabulous backcountry terrains, but you have to go to crowded resorts to ski. You have friends who can tackle those, but you can't go with them.

2) You find boring any time that you are not actually skiing (unlike me, who needs the chairlift time to rest and catch my breath).

I can understand that you just want to take a break, and that might not be a bad thing, so you can come back with a fresh perspective. I also understand the frustration of having all that great terrain nearby that you cannot access. On top of all this, your work schedule does not allow you to just take the time off to just go and ski; you can't just go on a non-crowded weekday, for instance. I have felt similar things... including your resolution to not focus so hard on improving... since that's just more work that takes away from the precious few hours of fun you get to have... except it's not so fun not to improve if you cannot have fun without improving... (See my little tantrum at @volklgirl last season.)

I don't have a good solution for you, since this comes down to balancing out all of your priorities and needs, and only you know what's important to you. We can offer you tips, programs, encouragement, what worked for us, but not the values--those are just yours. I hope one of us does say that one thing that makes sense to you, be it something like the tips from @Skier31 or the encouragements from @2ski2moro, but none of these would work unless that is what you are already seeking.

So, having said that, here is a tip, at the risk of sounding like a stereotypical therapist: it's OK to feel discouraged. Maybe you need to feel discouraged today, and be frustrated, and be hard on yourself, and want to give it up. Maybe this whole week. Maybe this whole season Sometimes, we just need to feel it; only then can we work through and figure out if there is a solution at the end of the long, dark tunnel. It could mean deciding that skiing is an entirely foolish, wasteful endeavor (see the thread I started a few weeks ago; I mean, really, it is...); it could mean deciding that you want to find the time—make the time—to polish up your skills and become an expert skier, dammit, by next season. Regardless, for now, you have the right to fume and be furious.

I think we are all so far in agreement that your potential is obvious, and the speed at which you've progressed is the proof, and that your backcountry days are not far out of reach. Still, it is completely up to you if you want to bother.

 

[SallyCat]

SallyCat, you need a day of fresh snow to just go PLAY in! Go fart around in the kid's tree zone, go play on easier off-piste stuff, etc. We had an epic powder day a week ago, and all the work went out the window--we played! It was good for the soul.

Yeah, if we get another storm or two the mountain will be more accessible. I just can't deal with resorts lately; groomers are not where I want to be and I either get bored or frustrated. I'd rather be frustrated trying the thing I really want to do.

 

[liquidfeet]

SallyCat, I hope you don't mind that I did this. Someone upthread linked some videos from Elate Media, and your video was linked. So I did a comparison for you of this Elate Media instructor's short radius turns and yours. The words in red are suggestions on how to get your turns more like his, if you're interested. You sound so frustrated! Maybe this will help.

 

[kiki]

@SallyCat i've so enjoyed you on this forum the past couple years, this is not sounding like you! Sometimes something we like stops being fun for a bit, but it will come back.
I am in season two after a few years away. It is so hard now--my body just won't do what i want, i don't have the stamina or strength i wish for---and clearly i am a very slow learner. But i keep going as i expect it will get better.
one day we will pass that barrier! You will be out there in the backcountry eventually!!!
When i took up golfing it wasn't until season 4 that i felt comfortable and had fun. We'll get there with skiing too! We just need to help each other off the cliff now and then
Sending hugs!!!

 

[Analisa]

@SallyCat - I totally feel you when you say you'd rather be frustrated doing the thing you ultimately want to do. My first ever ski setup was a touring setup, even though at the time, I could only cruise some blue groomers. I really only wanted to learn enough to take them along on alpine climbs for quicker descents (which is pretty common here).

A few things really worked for me - short skis that made tight, quick turns was #1. Then I also learned to side slip and "falling leaf" like a pro. After a few weeks, my skiing looked like dogshit, but I was confident that I could get safely down just about anything. Since then, technique, confidence, and speed improve every year.

I have a few friends that really hate the resort or can't afford it, but are still building skills (well behind your level), who stick to unplowed forest service roads or skinning the resorts when their uphill policy allows.

Where's this backyard of yours? I'm a firm believer that there's no minimum skill level for touring and know of a few tools and resources to find some "Rated E for everyone" routes and tours.

 

[SquidWeaselYay]

SallyCat, I hope you don't mind that I did this. Someone upthread linked some videos from Elate Media, and your video was linked. So I did a comparison for you of this Elate Media instructor's short radius turns and yours. The words in red are suggestions on how to get your turns more like his, if you're interested. You sound so frustrated! Maybe this will help.
View attachment 10009

That is downright awesome.

 

[SquidWeaselYay]

Also, one more time, then I'll shut up about it. Promise.

Canting can really have a big effect for some people. If your edging is off, it can mess with your confidence. If your confidence is down, you hesitate and can't quite make yourself do the things you know you are supposed to. And when you DO push it, it can feel sketchy because if feels unstable. Your body will reflexively keep you from doing things that don't feel stable, so you basically fight yourself. Then you compensate unconsciously in ways that keep you from progressing.

I had a serious A frame and I was keeping my feet so close together on turns that my boots were clicking together and the insides of my bindings were getting scraped up from my ski edges. It really held me back. Once I got the canting and cuff alignment, I was able to leave the plateau behind and my practice paid off. It took time to unlearn the bad habits, but I wasn't stagnating anymore, which was the biggest frustration to me.

Sometimes the smallest thing can have a ripple effect.

Okay, done talking about alignment issues.

 

[santacruz skier]

@SallyCat you said you've only been skiing years? You're doing great! I've been skiing 40+ years and get frustrated now and then when skiing thick Sierra cement... also on what western skiers call ice... "oh it's icy " I said to another skier on a chairlift . "Are you kidding me" was the response... I was skidding all over the place!
Cheer up. You're doing fine !

 

[Skisailor]

Thanks, everyone.
The bottom line is that I can't ski anything but a groomed trail, which means I can't take advantage of the incredible resource in my backyard of mown-but-ungroomed trails. I can't ski with my friends here, and I can't enjoy the exercise of skinning up because I can't ski down. I'm sick of skiing crowded resorts; bored of sitting on chairlifts, and most of all, furious at how f-ing weak my ability is after all this time and all the work I put into it. I think I need a time out.

Hi SallyCat.

First of all, I haven’t looked at your video yet. I love what @elemmac says. You DO have to re-explore the reasons you were out there to begin with.

But with regard to the frustrations - it is SO common for skiers to hit the same plateau you have. It’s almost universal. You are not alone ! And many skiers ski for years before they even get to the plateau and then years or decades before they get off it!

Here’s the thing. Skiing is one of the most counterintuitive sports I’ve ever encountered. We all have to go easy on ourselves with the self criticism because when we simply follow our human instincts and do what our body says it requires for safety and preservation - it’s invariably wrong in skiing. Lol!! So I do think it’s a sport where it’s generally hard to make progress by yourself.

But skiing also offers the possibility of a lifetime of adventures - getting to see places and do things most people never will. I hope you can hang in through this tough patch and not give up. Ok - I’m off to watch the video. Hang in there.

 

[Abbi]

Yeah, if we get another storm or two the mountain will be more accessible. I just can't deal with resorts lately; groomers are not where I want to be and I either get bored or frustrated. I'd rather be frustrated trying the thing I really want to do.

Wish you'd been out with Mary Ann and me yesterday. There were some fun drills. That said, just go when you get a chance on any conditions that you find. I have not mastered powder but throw myself in a little each time. Sue offered to take us in the (NOOOOOO) bumps yesterday. If you want to try that, you know there is a likely person to take you along.

And if you are having a frustrating ski day ... snow shoes? I've gone back out that way when I can't get my brain around skiing. I can't answer for you; I know I am my own WORST enemy some days. You have helped so many out in other areas, let those around help you.

I was lucky to find a group of friends, including a coach out playing today. Two days of practice. And my ankles/calves are barking today.

Big hugs for you while you work this out.

 

[Fluffy Kitty]

I'd rather be frustrated trying the thing I really want to do.

That sounds good. It occurs to me, alpine skiing started out with a bunch of people hurtling themselves down the hill strapped to misbegotten wooden planks on seriously ungroomed snow on unrefined terrain. If they figured out a way to enjoy it, surely you can, too, with your superior equipment.

Hope you have a trustworthy buddy/guide you can go with, and make sure your avalanche beacons can talk to each other. Even if you still get frustrated, I hope it is fun frustration!

 

[Skisailor]

Dang girl! You have alot of great things going on, especially for someone who hasn't been skiing very long! I echo the others who say you are being too hard on yourself!

Wish we could ski together! I feel confident I could give you the tools you need in a couple of lessons so you could make the skill refinements that would get you off the plateau with practice. That said, you've gotten alot of specific technique advice and I don't want to muddy the waters or overwhelm you.

So I will give you the eagle view:

To get off the groomed and into steeper things, narrower things, trees, bumps, powder, etc. . . . you need to develop a bomb proof short radius turn on a pretty flat ski - that is - learn how to reliably get OFF your edges. Most people on the intermediate plateau have well developed edging and weight shift skills. The underdeveloped skill tends to be "rotation" - the ability to flatten the ski at will so we can pivot and steer it with our legs. Rotation is the poor bastard child of the 3 main skiing skills but is the one that gets us off the groomed into all the fun stuff!

 

[Tvan]

Wow. This thread is amazing.

@SallyCat - I don’t have any ski advice to offer you. I spent my first four years skiing on the greens. I’m still the slowest, and the scardest and the most reticent to try something new.

What I can offer is that the fine women of the Ski Diva site have done what they do best. Encourage, coach, support, and share, all in the spirit of compassion. I’m reminded of my recent chair lift ride at Christmas... when I experienced an unexpected blessing. This thread strikes me in the same vein.

“Hey Skier, keep going... you’re almost there!”

 

[Serafina]

You're not initiating your turns with both feet simultaneously in those videos. There's a brief lag between starting your turn with your outside ski and having your inside ski join it. It's a very brief lag, and the main reason I notice it is that I used to have that very problem, and when I did still have that problem, I'd catch an edge when skiing crud, chowder, ungroomed stuff. And when a person is catching an edge, or even worried about catching an edge, that's going to suck the confidence right out, which will then create more problems.

Solution: line up a private lesson and tell the instructor that you want to ski the chopped up stuff. If you get a good instructor (get referrals from people that you trust at your ski area) s/he will be able to identify the component pieces and help you sort it out pretty quickly.

 

[Little Lightning]

Also, one more time, then I'll shut up about it. Promise.

Canting can really have a big effect for some people. If your edging is off, it can mess with your confidence. If your confidence is down, you hesitate and can't quite make yourself do the things you know you are supposed to. And when you DO push it, it can feel sketchy because if feels unstable. Your body will reflexively keep you from doing things that don't feel stable, so you basically fight yourself. Then you compensate unconsciously in ways that keep you from progressing.

I had a serious A frame and I was keeping my feet so close together on turns that my boots were clicking together and the insides of my bindings were getting scraped up from my ski edges. It really held me back. Once I got the canting and cuff alignment, I was able to leave the plateau behind and my practice paid off. It took time to unlearn the bad habits, but I wasn't stagnating anymore, which was the biggest frustration to me.

Sometimes the smallest thing can have a ripple effect.

Okay, done talking about alignment issues.

I'll second your comments. Don't want to get into details but being slightly off can cause huge issues with turning.

 

[Skisailor]

Also agree that alignment is way important. Don't necessarily jump to canting though. See a good bootfitter. Work done inside the boot may be preferable. For example, if your feet and a ankles pronate (collapse to the inside when you flex), the fix may be tilting the footbed inside the boot to provide support for the inside edge of your foot. You can always still add canting, but first making corrections inside the boot may be a better approach.

 

[santacruz skier]

But would we expect someone who has only been skiing a few seasons have perfect form and be able to ski the entire mountain?

 

[Skisailor]

But would we expect someone who has only been skiing a few seasons have perfect form and be able to ski the entire mountain?

No. We wouldn't necessarily "expect" it. But it's not like that is an unachievable goal. If she is bored on groomers, and getting off piste is what it takes to keep enjoying the sport, I say go for it.

Also - "perfect form" is never really necessary. We just need the movements that are effective to take us into the terrain we want to ski safely.

 

[santacruz skier]

No. We wouldn't necessarily "expect" it. But it's not like that is an unachievable goal. If she is bored on groomers, and getting off piste is what it takes to keep enjoying the sport, I say go for it.

Also - "perfect form" is never really necessary. We just need the movements that are effective to take us into the terrain we want to ski safely.

True! I was not venturing off piste after a few years......I certainly don't have perfect form and probably never will.....