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Mount Point Issues?

SquidWeaselYay

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
You have to have a shop do it. There are steps in the process that you really want a shop tech to do anyway.
That is what I figured. Also, I don't trust myself, haha! Just curious what they use for it, since there doesn't seem to be a commercial product aimed at doing this for normal bindings.
 

SquidWeaselYay

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
So according to the person that wrote the website I posted earlier, it’s a sign of too much forward lean. I don’t think I’ve ever experienced too much forward lean in a boot (I have encountered not enough), so I don’t know what impact it has on skiing. Might be some info a good bootfitter can work with though.

Did your balance feel best in the set up you currently have? Or did an elevated toe or heel feel any more balanced?
Elevated toe definitely feels more balanced.
 

SquidWeaselYay

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
I'm not familiar with Stockli Nela 96 skis, but I just mounted my new 179cm Santa Ana 104 Frees 2cm forward and they ski perfect. I wouldn't mount a ski more than 1-3cm forward, as I had a friend who went more and kept going "over the handlebars". My rule of thumb is to mount forward if I want to be more turny, and 1cm for smaller to 3cm for bigger or burlier skis. The exception is my bumps skis which are skinny but mounted 2cm forward because ... zipper lines. For a powder ski, I also wouldn't mount forward because you don't need to be super turny, unless you're skiing in trees and bumps. It's really about experimenting. You can remount a ski twice before you start to run the risk of snapping it (depending on how hard you ski it). Also, for new skis, check to make sure it's properly detuned. Sometimes skis come out of the factory so sharp that it's hard to steer them. Hope that's helpful!

Welcome to the forum and the thread! Thanks for chiming in!

I'm currently trying to assess if my issues are due to fore/aft alignment issues that are a boot issue. How did you come to the realization that you liked a forward mount better?
 

SquidWeaselYay

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
Update: I measured the bindings on all my skis with calipers, and this is what I came up with.

Squire Demos: -1.0
Warden Demos: -1.0

Squires: +5
Wardens: +5

Attacks 12 that I had shimmed in the toe: +2

Please be advised that my caliper skills are NOT expert level. I did the best I could and took multiple readings.

It seems like I need a flat or slightly negative delta. I know the easiest way to do that is to gas pedal the boot but then my skis with demo bindings are going to ride weird. Can you shim a binding toe piece as much as 5mm?
 

LucieCZ

Certified Ski Diva
Welcome to the forum and the thread! Thanks for chiming in!

I'm currently trying to assess if my issues are due to fore/aft alignment issues that are a boot issue. How did you come to the realization that you liked a forward mount better?
My husband got me into bump skiing a long time ago. Mounting forward is pretty common in bump skiing circles. We just moved to UT a year ago and I'm doing a lot more powder skiing now. The Santa Anas are the fattest skis I've owned, so I haven't experimented with mounting a fat ski forward before. I don't really take my Armadas in bumps so they are mounted at recommendation. But since I want to use my Santa Anas as all mountain, I tried mounting them forward. And I love it!
 

SquidWeaselYay

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
Hey there, bit of an update. Picked up a set of ZJ Soft boots. Pretty much like the ZJ+, but 110 flex. Saw PJ at Race Stock in Vermont, and he switched my surefoot liners and footbeds over, canted the boots, and gave me a 2mm gas pedal. he notes that without the gas pedal, my knees were pretty far forward.

Skiied the Nelas, and there was improvement in being able to pressure the tips and control the skis in general. I didn’t feel like I was falling over the handlebars as much when trying to pressure the front. However, it’s still not quite there. I think I need more lift in the toes to get me closer to flat delta. The demo bindings were -1.5, and with the gas pedal, I’m still at +3. I’m thinking of having the toe of the binding shimmed up instead of doing more boot work so I can make sure that is really what I need. Binding shim is reversible, boot work not so much.

Any thoughts? Am I missing anything?
 

contesstant

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
Hey there, bit of an update. Picked up a set of ZJ Soft boots. Pretty much like the ZJ+, but 110 flex. Saw PJ at Race Stock in Vermont, and he switched my surefoot liners and footbeds over, canted the boots, and gave me a 2mm gas pedal. he notes that without the gas pedal, my knees were pretty far forward.

Skiied the Nelas, and there was improvement in being able to pressure the tips and control the skis in general. I didn’t feel like I was falling over the handlebars as much when trying to pressure the front. However, it’s still not quite there. I think I need more lift in the toes to get me closer to flat delta. The demo bindings were -1.5, and with the gas pedal, I’m still at +3. I’m thinking of having the toe of the binding shimmed up instead of doing more boot work so I can make sure that is really what I need. Binding shim is reversible, boot work not so much.

Any thoughts? Am I missing anything?
I recommend skiing your other skis to see how they feel since they have different bindings. I do think keeping the gas pedal on the boot to a minimum is a good call, then be mindful of what bindings you use going forward. I've decided I'll only use Wardens on all my skis from here on out just to maintain consistency there. I'm sure they'll change them at some point. I'll just stock up in the meantime :becky:

FWIW I'm still having some issues on my Nelas with the new boots--they feel super stiff since I got the boots without the gas pedal, but my other skis feel amazing so I'm going to do some more experimenting as I think it's a fore/aft issue involving the cuff. The Nelas now feel like a high-performance sports car with stiff suspension which are fun as hell but I really have to be on my game, and the right side in particular is giving me issues so I'll keep skiing them and playing with tongue shims, etc. I'll probably do a 1.5 mm gas pedal (temporarily) to see if that makes things feel any easier. But I REALLY don't want to permanently modify my boots again as overall, I am standing taller with the new shells and have less fatigue. I might be able to get on some demo Nelas to see if moving the binding forward helps.

Small feet and skiing are a real PITA!
 

SquidWeaselYay

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
Another update: I skied at Roundtop today, and took out most of my quiver. Conditions were soft spring slush and 65 degrees. No updates to gear since last post, just updating what it all felt like on different conditions than in Maine.

Nela 96 (Warden 11): Better, but still can't quite get the pressure on the tips as much as I'd like. Overall felt more confident on them today and could play a little more in the slushy conditions. Still feel like all my weight is just bearing down HARD on the balls of my feet to keep my balanced when I try to pressure the tips, kinda like when you try to lean forward in high heels. I'm going to call a local shop tomorrow about getting the binding shimmed another 2-3mm. 3mm would bring me to flat.

Santa Ana 93 (Marker Squire): First time on this ski since the gas pedal. Really hard to tell how much of a difference it made because it felt like I had suction cups instead of skis! I had these treated with DPS Phantom last year, and they say a base grind refreshes it. I'm...skeptical after today. None of my other skis stuck, but these were a complete pain. Either the claim that a base grind will somehow refresh the phantom is bogus, or Phantom just doesn't do well in spring slush. Would love to hear from any other ladies if you had this experience, or if your Phantom is holding up for slush.

Sheeva 10 (Warden 11 Demo): So. Much. Fun. The gas pedal on my boots puts me in a very slightly negative delta in these bindings, similar to the Squire Demos. I had a ton of control and felt like I had my groove back.

We are heading back out to Big Sky on March 26th, so I'm hoping I can get my bindings on the Nelas and Santa Anas shimmed before we go. If not, I'll have to try to find a shop out there (either in Big Sky or in Bozeman) willing to shim the Nelas for me. I'll most likely leave the Santa Ana's at home this time.
 

SquidWeaselYay

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
I recommend skiing your other skis to see how they feel since they have different bindings. I do think keeping the gas pedal on the boot to a minimum is a good call, then be mindful of what bindings you use going forward. I've decided I'll only use Wardens on all my skis from here on out just to maintain consistency there. I'm sure they'll change them at some point. I'll just stock up in the meantime :becky:

FWIW I'm still having some issues on my Nelas with the new boots--they feel super stiff since I got the boots without the gas pedal, but my other skis feel amazing so I'm going to do some more experimenting as I think it's a fore/aft issue involving the cuff. The Nelas now feel like a high-performance sports car with stiff suspension which are fun as hell but I really have to be on my game, and the right side in particular is giving me issues so I'll keep skiing them and playing with tongue shims, etc. I'll probably do a 1.5 mm gas pedal (temporarily) to see if that makes things feel any easier. But I REALLY don't want to permanently modify my boots again as overall, I am standing taller with the new shells and have less fatigue. I might be able to get on some demo Nelas to see if moving the binding forward helps.

Small feet and skiing are a real PITA!
That is interesting - I am standing taller WITH the gas pedal. It's so crazy how our individual makeup and physics interplay so that one person's cure is another's poison.

I'm glad to hear your other skis are feeling great with the changes. Keep us updated on how things go with your Nelas.

And yes, small, hyper mobile noodle feet are Thee Absolute Worst.
 

contesstant

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
That is interesting - I am standing taller WITH the gas pedal. It's so crazy how our individual makeup and physics interplay so that one person's cure is another's poison.

I'm glad to hear your other skis are feeling great with the changes. Keep us updated on how things go with your Nelas.

And yes, small, hyper mobile noodle feet are Thee Absolute Worst.
I thought I was standing taller with the gas pedals, but video proved otherwise. Once in motion on skis, I am able to stand a lot taller and am more forward in the new boots.

Too many stinkin' variables for sure.
 

badger

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
@SquidWeaselYay , Thought I would let you know that my experience with Phantom in Spring slush is not good. It never has been on any of my skis treated with it. I used it to help with Spring skiing, but have not been impressed as it doesn't seem to make any difference. I skied yesterday and had to quit by noon as the slush continued to grab my skis like an old car with carburetor issues. My concern is for the potential injury of my knees in that stuff, so I leave early. :(
 

marzNC

Angel Diva
@SquidWeaselYay : to the question about Phantom and slush . . . Phantom probably doesn't help much. But then neither does wax.

What I did before I treated my second pair of skis was a direct test between skis I owned with Phantom and skis with warm weather wax (applied at home) on a warm day in Oregon in May. Wasn't slush, but there was sticky snow for sure. I ended up skiing my narrower skis treated with Phantom, instead of my BPs with wax. Meaning after the first couple runs on the BPs with fresh wax. With Phantom I would slow down in sticky snow, but not feel in danger of coming to an unexpected stop. I didn't trust the waxed BPs at all.

I did another experiment at Alta the next season in April. That compared my Stockli Stormrider 85 and the old BPs. On warm days with temps in the 40s at the base, I was out having fun after lunch on the BPs while most other people staying at Alta Lodge had given up for the day. Again, not slush but some sticky patches where the sun was a factor.

After my Stormriders needed a stone grind, I treated them with Phantom. Had a good time last April at Alta.

I won't bother to bring the BPs when flying for late season trips any more. They were good fun as rock skis during an Indy Pass ski safari in late Feb that included some warm days.
 

SquidWeaselYay

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
@SquidWeaselYay , Thought I would let you know that my experience with Phantom in Spring slush is not good. It never has been on any of my skis treated with it. I used it to help with Spring skiing, but have not been impressed as it doesn't seem to make any difference. I skied yesterday and had to quit by noon as the slush continued to grab my skis like an old car with carburetor issues. My concern is for the potential injury of my knees in that stuff, so I leave early. :(
YES - that is what I experienced. Really jerky, like a car not being shifted properly. I had zero trust by the end of my first run on them. My other skis (no phantom, just wax) were completely fine.
 

mustski

Angel Diva
YES - that is what I experienced. Really jerky, like a car not being shifted properly. I had zero trust by the end of my first run on them. My other skis (no phantom, just wax) were completely fine.
Folks I know with phantom add a spray on wax for sticky spring conditions. https://www.toko.ch/en/wax-tools/

I use this liquid wax, but I don’t have phantom so I don’t know how it would work. This is easy to apply and makes a big difference for those stop and go conditions. I gave some to @ski diva during our spring in February at diva west.
CA7173D0-D182-4FDD-B528-D0137E228464.jpeg
 

Bookworm

Angel Diva
Have you considered having your bindings mounted a bit back of the line? I wonder if that would help with the stance.
 

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