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Type II vs. Type III skiers?

marzNC

Angel Diva
At this point, I figure I'll just lie and stay 49 forever, starting in 2027. At some point I'm sure I'll want to dial it down, but so far the by-the-book skier type 3 number seems perfect.
I find it more fun to be Type III+ and my actual age. Perhaps because by Chinese tradition, every year after 60 is gravy. The Chinese cycle of 12 animals completes for the fifth time after 60 years.

Although what I'm really looking forward to is 65 when at least some senior discounts kick in for lift tickets and season passes. My ski buddy turned 65 over the summer, so I've been paying closer attention to what makes sense for him to do for 2018-19.
 

mustski

Angel Diva
Truth is that I am a finesse skier and become more efficient with age. I am quite happy at 4.5-5 as my setting. My understanding is that a Type II skier skis a variety of terrain at a variety of speeds in a variety of conditions. A Type III skier skis all terrain and all conditions aggressively. This is my DH. He is super aggressive and does pre-release in steeps with the standard DIN setting. I always take his skis in for mounting, etc. I give all his stats accurately except his age. I tell them he's 21. I also classify both he and Gavin as III+.
 

bounceswoosh

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
Truth is that I am a finesse skier and become more efficient with age. I am quite happy at 4.5-5 as my setting. My understanding is that a Type II skier skis a variety of terrain at a variety of speeds in a variety of conditions. A Type III skier skis all terrain and all conditions aggressively. This is my DH. He is super aggressive and does pre-release in steeps with the standard DIN setting. I always take his skis in for mounting, etc. I give all his stats accurately except his age. I tell them he's 21. I also classify both he and Gavin as III+.

When my DIN was lower, I preleased. Noe I don't. So I figure III is right for me.
 

santacruz skier

Angel Diva
When my DIN was lower, I preleased. Noe I don't. So I figure III is right for me.
When my DIN was lower, I was pre-releasing like crazy when demoing skis. I went back to the shop and told the guy I was really going to get hurt if they didn't change the DIN. That's when I signed the liability waiver.....
 

DeeSki

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
Pretty crazy that you have to sign a liability waiver when you’re pre-releasing. Surely they’d be in the wrong if they didn't change the DIN after you’ve explained the situation and it happened again resulting in injury?
 

bounceswoosh

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
Pretty crazy that you have to sign a liability waiver when you’re pre-releasing. Surely they’d be in the wrong if they didn't change the DIN after you’ve explained the situation and it happened again resulting in injury?

You can have a lot of debate about whether it was a pre-release vs a valid release or something else entirely. Maybe your boot had some ice, etc. The charts at least are based on accumulated data and study.

BTW, binding DIN settings are about protecting from bone breaks. They are not built to protect you from ACL tears, etc. The Knee Binding is supposed to help protect from soft tissue injury - no idea on the numbers.
 

SnowHot

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
I've always been told that the difference between Type II and Type III skiers isn't necessarily ability, but rather aggression. Someone who races and is really hard driving would be a Type III because they really, really don't want their bindings popping off (then again, who does?), and someone who isn't quite that aggressive would be Type II.
When we did the Ski and Snowboard Binding Mechanics Workshop, this is something that they reinforce a lot.
The I, II, or III is not skill level, but aggressive level.
Some of the aggressive level is based on the type of terrain you ski, as much as how you ski that terrain.

There was a guy on the Whistler trip skiing in a group that Jilly was leading and I was skiing the back door. He was a fairly new skier and had his bindings set at a "I" for aggressiveness, but we were skiing terrain that was a little steeper than he probably should have been on. He was skiing the terrain timidly, but it was steep enough that his ski kept popping off.
I'm betting that his new skis will have different settings. ;)
 

alison wong

Angel Diva
There was a guy on the Whistler trip skiing in a group that Jilly was leading

I think I remembered who that person was because I was in the same group. I recalled you commented on his bindings, I thought they were mal-functioned. Did not realize it was the setting.

I also remembered it was the blue "Saddle" trail, usually is groomed but happened to be ungroomed that day we were on. It was fun though!
 

SnowHot

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
I think I remembered who that person was because I was in the same group. I recalled you commented on his bindings, I thought they were mal-functioned. Did not realize it was the setting.

I also remembered it was the blue "Saddle" trail, usually is groomed but happened to be ungroomed that day we were on. It was fun though!
Yup.
He's a good guy and handled himself well, but it had to be frustrating for him to keep popping out of his ski bindings. And, even that pitch were groomed, it was still steep for the setting he had his bindings set.
 

echo_VT

Angel Diva
i didn't know that but good to know. i did mark myself last year as a type II skiier and my instructor corrected me to type III. my ski did keep popping off at first while skiing - but we quickly changed it. never really thought about why.
 

bounceswoosh

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
Sometimes I think the type 1/2/3 business is just an attempt to formalize a fudge factor. Actually, upon reflection, that's exactly what it is. After all, I choose type 3 - not because I'm a particularly aggressive skier, but because the definition of type 3 includes (chooses version from random site) "As a type 3 skier they prefer decreased releasability in a fall in order to gain a decreased risk of inadvertent binding release." If you feel that way, you're a type 3 skier. But if you look at it with clear eyes, again, it's just a way to formalize "I want a slightly higher DIN." And type 1 is "I want a slightly lower DIN."
 

alison wong

Angel Diva
He was a fairly new skier and had his bindings set at a "I" for aggressiveness

Curious to know: how do you know the bindings is set at "I"? You mean the DIN # setting?

I thought there is a grid to determine the DIN, from age, wt, ht., skier type....i.e. something not so easy to figure out just by looking at the #?
 

SnowHot

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
Curious to know: how do you know the bindings is set at "I"? You mean the DIN # setting?

I thought there is a grid to determine the DIN, from age, wt, ht., skier type....i.e. something not so easy to figure out just by looking at the #?
This is where this gets tricky.
DIN is short for Deutsches Institut für Normung - Your DIN can be set in the indicator window at a 6 but actually test out at a different number, depending on the actual test.

That being said, If you put on a sheet that you're a I, then there is an assumption that you won't be skiing aggressively and you're going to be skiing on extremely mellow terrain, so the DIN needs to be set low enough that you're going to pop out when you should on extremely mellow terrain. If you stay at that aggressiveness and on that kind of terrain, this shouldn't be an issue, but if you start venturing out on more aggressive terrain, say moderate instead of mellow, then you may want to have your bindings adjusted so that you don't accidentally pop out on steeper pitches or when you're starting to pick up more speed.
 

alison wong

Angel Diva
@SnowHot - OK, I understand that.
But my question is: when you were with the guy that day, how did you figure out his settings were too low on the slope? Did you know just by looking at it?

e.g. Do you know just by experience that if the DIN is set at "xx", then it is type I; if DIN is "yy", the it is type II???

You know what I am asking?
 

WaterGirl

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
I like visuals
skier-type1.png
Type 1
skier-type2.png
Type 2
skier-type3.png
Type 3
skier-type3plus.png
Type 3+

But what about these skiers -- are they 2 ? or 3?

images
273452_12449_L.jpg
 

SnowHot

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
@SnowHot - OK, I understand that.
But my question is: when you were with the guy that day, how did you figure out his settings were too low on the slope? Did you know just by looking at it?

e.g. Do you know just by experience that if the DIN is set at "xx", then it is type I; if DIN is "yy", the it is type II???

You know what I am asking?
Part of this is an experience thing.
Part of it is asking the right questions.
At one point this guy was getting frustrated and I told him to stand still for a minute while I checked to make sure there wasn't any ice in his binding. I noticed that his window said, 4.5. YIKES! I asked him how long he had the skis and how many days he'd been skiing, how many lessons, etc.
I quickly figured out that he had advanced as a skier and these bindings were clearly set for a guy on the beginner slopes.
 

SnowHot

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
i didn't know that but good to know. i did mark myself last year as a type II skiier and my instructor corrected me to type III. my ski did keep popping off at first while skiing - but we quickly changed it. never really thought about why.
An instructor can tell you how you've progressed in the class, and can change your level on a ski lesson evaluation, but they can not and should not tell you what to choose on a binding adjustment form.
 

SnowHot

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
Sometimes I think the type 1/2/3 business is just an attempt to formalize a fudge factor. Actually, upon reflection, that's exactly what it is. After all, I choose type 3 - not because I'm a particularly aggressive skier, but because the definition of type 3 includes (chooses version from random site) "As a type 3 skier they prefer decreased releasability in a fall in order to gain a decreased risk of inadvertent binding release." If you feel that way, you're a type 3 skier. But if you look at it with clear eyes, again, it's just a way to formalize "I want a slightly higher DIN." And type 1 is "I want a slightly lower DIN."
Again, this is about aggressiveness, and the type of terrain you're skiing, not the level skier you are.
When you came back from your knee repair, the binding setting should have been adjusted for that, and reconsidered after you made progress.
 

bounceswoosh

Ski Diva Extraordinaire
Again, this is about aggressiveness, and the type of terrain you're skiing, not the level skier you are.
When you came back from your knee repair, the binding setting should have been adjusted for that, and reconsidered after you made progress.

I didn't do that. Then again, all terrain was "no fall zone" for me when I got back to it.
 

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