Tween Daugher - Ski Advice

[amyles]

Hi -- I am in the process of purchasing skis for my 12 yo daughter and I am getting mixed feedback from various sources including local ski shops and researching online. She is 5'3" and around 99-100lbs soaking wet (ie skinny). She is a solid intermediate East Coast skier (can handle groomed black runs pretty easily in the Poconos and in VT). That said, she is a cautious, nonagressive skier who does not ski, by any means, with power. She still has a lot of growing to do and will likely top out around 5"8" or so.

I am looking for a good East Coast ski that she can use for two years at which point her younger sister will inherit the skis. I think I am pretty set on length (148-152 range). The issue is, do I purchase junior or adult skis? I have been told by several people (somewhat forcefully by some) to not purchase "adult" skis for a kid because they will be too stiff/heavy and she will not be able to bend them. Others have said that its perfectly fine to get a beginner soft flex adult ski in a short length for her. Moreover, the junior skis available just seem to be longer versions of the kiddie skis that you see 5 year olds skiing (she is also not into the pink bubbles and flowers that seem to be the graphics of choice for younger girl skis).

What I am looking for is a good wood core East Coast ski, for a solid intermediate skier based on her height and weight and skiing style. I dont really care if its classified as junior or adult as long as its a good ski for her.

Thanks much for the assistance!

 

[marzNC]

Good to see you over here! When are you thinking of making the purchase? Are you looking to save a bit or is buying a current model a possibility?

 

[amyles]

Thanks! I am looking at both current models and models one or two years old.

 

[Jilly]

Would she be interested in a twin tip....not really for park but for looks?

 

[amyles]

Sure. As long as it will carve on the Pocono ice sheets

 

[artistinsuburbia]

we are in western pa. Ski mostly seven springs, hidden valley, snowshoe, and holiday valley. I put my two daughters on Atomic Affinity Pure's and Dynastar Neva 78 XP's I have rode both pairs and can't say enough good about them.

 

[Pequenita]

It sounds like she's basically the size of a small adult and probably leggier and has a higher center of gravity than a full-grown woman.

The only distinction that I can think of between junior and adult skis that you haven't already mentioned could be the mount point for the bindings. Manufacturer recommended mount points for adult women tend to be forward, ostensibly to accommodate a lower center of gravity. I have no idea where the mount point for juniors skis are, but if you figure that junior skiers don't have curves, then the recommended mount point should be center, rather than forward.

I don't have specific models or anything in mind, but I think that adult skis are fine. For years I couldn't figure out who on earth would be the market for some of the way shorter women's skis (130s, 140s), and someone pointed out to me, "tweens."

 

[marzNC]

I bought some used Volkl AC1 149cm for my daughter as her next ski when she was 12. Got them from a very gear savvy father who had them for his tween daughter for a season before that. (Bought the previous pair of used skis from him too.) I assume those are women's skis, not juniors. My daughter skied on them just fine. She was about 4'10" and 100 pounds that season. They were a tad long, but she was an advanced skier and didn't have any issues with them at Whiteface. She isn't super cautious but isn't particularly aggressive either.

 

[WaterGirl]

Hi @amyles - I was similarly situated the beginning of last season with my "tween" daughter. She was 11 and a few inches shorter and a few pounds lighter than your DD is now, but faced w/ the same problem -- in need of a ski that was a bit more worthy of her ability than a typical JR entry ski, but not quite big enough to drive an adult ski.

With the help of my favorite mountain shop who also sponsors some of the JR race team, we found her a pair of used mid level Elan Race skis in a 140. These were a fabulous fit for her as she had a bit stiffer ski that had a great edge - her carving really improved last season. Best of all, they are on the trade in program and under $150.

Well half way thru the season despite the snow starved slopes, we had pleasure of a trip w/ a nice little dump of powder. So being the Diva enabler I am, she demo'd a pair of Volkl Gotama JR in a 148 - fun! so of course after paying $$ to demo, I applied the days demo and bought them from the mountain -- really they paid for themselves in 4 days. One other factor in buying them was there were not that many 148s floating around on the internet or the local shops at that time. Apparently they don't make that many of the bigger JR size? (they do make them in a 158 also)

So up to this point in time, DD had only been on JR skis. One factor that has not been touched on yet in this thread --- is Boot size and BSL --- b/c DD is a 23.5 -- and ironically the same size and BSL as myself, she is able to fit into a "adult binding". Both her skis have demo or movable bindings so BSL/size did not make a difference. I am assuming that your DD is also in a bigger boot... that would open up more options. Despite being in a JR Lange race boot, DD's BSL is actually considered an adult size and she can ski an adult ski.... which was great b/c ......

At the end of the season we were on a trip visiting family out of state we had brought our boots and were planning on renting skis. A fresh 8" of powder the night before and still snowing that day. So choices at the mountain -- a JR ski (more of an entry level ski) or Line Celebrity in a 148. She decided on the Line, which I think is actually a "softer adult ski." In the fresh snow it was great, she had no issues in the untracked, however on some of the windblown groomers that were icy she was not happy.... so back to the un-groomed we went. Fun.

She has also demo'd very end of last season and I bought the Volkl Ledge in a 147. This is sold as an adult ski, but again its a bit softer. She is intending on joining the free ski team, and this is what they suggested as a good entry level park/ pipe ski. When she demo'd this it was spring, mixed ice/ slush and she said they skied like a mix between the Gotama and the Race skis.

Her favorite last season were the race skis -- probably b/c she could get a response out of them and really get a hold on the snow and was not having any yard sales on the ice as she did with the basic jr rental skis the year before...... For east coast I think it would be a great if you could find a used pair of JR race skis ....

DD is now a few inches taller and a few pounds heavier -- the Ledges did seem to ride a bit "short" but for park and pipe that will be fine, and she did try them and like them at the end of last year after she had "grown." I can see her possibly going longer in her "powder ski" later this season, but we will see how the Gotama JRs work -- they seem to have plenty of float. I know there are other Diva moms who also like the Gotama JR, but not sure if best for east coast?

While DD and I could technically share skis, I don't think she has anywhere near the power or strength to handle a stiffer adult ski. Thats why the softer 148 ish skis work for her now, but a shorter stiffer jr race ski was better for her the ice/groomers in the beginning of the year. Btw she is just getting more comfortable on some of the "bigger" black runs but likes the bumps (really my body can't handle the short black mogul runs she wants to do over and over again) and she seeks out little jumps which is why we are trending towards the free ski team.

Hope that helps....

 

[artistinsuburbia]

my son rides the Gotoma Jr. He is on his second pair, went up to the 158. I've rode this ski as well and I'd say that I'd be careful buying these for an intermediate, I'm an advanced skier and this ski rode me a little more than I rode it. Especially in east coast crud. On powder, that would be a different story, but in ice, they require a bit more leg strength. My daughters are 15 and 18 now and have been skiing since they were 5. They get their fair share of turns each season as we ski every weekend of winter. The Atomic affintiy pure's are my favorite of the two pairs, but they are a bit too short for me to tell for certain. If you can get her to demo, that's the route I'd take for sure. And try to limit her choices to skis you pick or she'll just pick em because of the sticker. Lol #tweenprobs

 

[Albertan ski girl]

Hi - I used to ride the Atomic Affinity Pures, and can't say enough good things about them. While I don't know how they would do on east coast ice, they are very versatile skis. If you search them on the forum, you will find my review in the gear reviews section. My DD is younger - 9 - but I was looking at the Gotama Jrs for her. But like @artistinsuburbia and @WaterGirl , I am not sure that they are the best for east coast ice. They are fully rocketed and pretty wide, though turn initiation is really easy. DS is closer to your DD's age - 11 - and he's very light, similar to your DD in height and weight. He spent last season on the K2 Juvys and loved them. They are twin tips, not too wide, easy to turn and definitely softer than an adult ski. I would definitely encourage you to look at the Juvys - they are a fun ski for an intermediate - advancing young skier.

 

[amyles]

Wow. Thanks for the advice. The Atomic Affinity Pures are getting a lot of love on this forum. I also looked at the K2 Juvys but the longest I can find them is 139 and I think my daughter needs a 148-150 (she will be 5'3" by Xmas and we hope to get two years out of them). I hear a lot of great things about the Gotama Jr.s but as suggested I think they are too wide for our purposes. Also, my daughter will be in a 25.5 boot (8.5 shoe) this year so yes, she is definitely in a bigger boot (my 8 year old will be in a 22.o boot).

There is a new junior girls ski on the K2 website called the Remedy 75 Jr. Its a twin, 75 at the waist, wood core and K2's All Terrain Rocker (70% camber/30% rocker). It looks like its the same ski as the boys Shreditor 75 Jr. What do you think of that ski?

Interestingly, on another website where I posted the same question, pretty much all of the replies are suggesting multi-event junior race skis for my DD (similar to WaterGirls post above), such as
https://www.rossignol.com/US/US/hero-junior-multi-event--2014--RADBB01--product--alpine-boys-skis.html


https://www.dynastar.com/US/US/team-comp_DACBB01_product_dynastar-skis-junior-racing.html

https://www.head.com/ski/products/skis/junior/worldcup-irace/7996/?region=eu


My girls (8 and 12) are not racers. I would classify them as intermediate skiers as they are not using great technique but last season they began to confidentally work their way down hard snow bumped up blacks in the Poconos (around 1000 ft vert) such that that is pretty much all we did the last half of the season because they were bored with the Pocono greens and blues. We will also make several trips to VT where they do pretty much the same thing although so far they prefer the groomed blacks to the bumped blacks and in VT. Also, they dont do any park (not yet at least). That said, they are improving so much each year that I would not be surprised if they want to ski the whole mountain in VT this year (inlcuding some 2x blacks and some trees).

This means our annual ski season pretty much consists of several days each of all of the following: bullet proof ice (esp in PA), corduroy, bumped up black runs, crud, ungroomed natural and man-made (likely no more than 6 inches), and a few easier tree runs (when in VT).

So, I am currently debating between a junior ski like the Remedy 75 Jr., a junior race ski or a soft beginner adult ski...all in about 150 length. I am a little concerned about the rocker in the K2 but that said most all mountain skis have some rocker these days.......

Thanks again!

 

[marzNC]

Thanks for sharing the info about junior multi-event race skis. Since neither I nor my daughter have any interest in racing, never heard of the category before.

 

[WaterGirl]

DD has an older version the Elan Race RC in a 140 length; 111-68-96 - comprex woodcore Radius is 10.6
Seems similar to their current ski (dimensions a bit different) https://www.elanskis.com/ce/product/rc-race-qt.htmlPROFILE

• Conventional
• TECHNOLOGY
  WaveFlex™, Full Power Cap, Dual Woodcore, Fibreglass
  GEOMETRY
• 114/70/98, 114/70,5/99, 115/71/100, 116/71,5/101, 117/72/102
  LENGTH / RADIUS
• 110(6.2), 120(7.5), 130(8.9), 140(10.3), 150(11.9)
  SYSTEM / PLATE
• QuickTrick
  BINDINGS
• EL 4.5 AC QT / EL 7.5 AC QT BLK
  RECOMMENDED LENGTH
• 
  
  - 15 / 0
  SKIING LEVEL
• 

She was about 90+ lbs and under 5ft start of season. A solid intermediate.
I was looking for a ski that was a more advanced groomer ski. There is a K2 Junior carving ski "the Bolt" that we also looked at, but didn't seem like a good fit at the time. After talking at the shop, we settled on the Elan from several of "trade in ski team skis," as well as the Armada Coda twin tip for her to demo. She preferred the feel of the Elan, and so we went with that. She has had a blast with them. She has taken them every where you mention skiing -- WRD early man made snow; ice; slush; a sprinkling of new snow; bump runs; little jumps; etc. Everywhere but 8" new snow, for which she has the Gotama JR (again these are not her favorite on piste, but she loved them in the deeper snow).

What the Elans did do for her is gave her a full season of confidence on a much more responsive ski -- She can now translate that confidence to other types of skis --
Since they were used and on the trade in program they were cheap; I will trade them back in when she decides to let them go....

As far as some of the other skis you mentioned, my first comment is don't you love how K2 has SIX skis for the BOYS and only THREE skis for the girls? Hmmm..... Yes I looked at the bad apple/ bad seed last season etc... and as I mentioned above, they do now have a devoted Jr frontside ski which looks to be similar to a JR race ski. I think the Remedy is interesting it seems like an around ski, but similar maybe to some of the other softer adult skis others have mentioned. I think what you need to determine is how much she really wants to get out of the ski. Don't be afraid of the race ski - its not going to be "fast" its just more responsive b/c of the camber and tail. Is there anyway she can demo some of the skis--- or at least a twintip/ vs all mountain rocker vs JR race ski?

Most of the companies make a JR twin tip -- the reason we went with the Ledge for her next ski was b/c it has a fully symmetrical twin-tip for riding switch. It is an adult ski, but like I said before, at 147 it seems to ride short; and she demod it at the end of the season and like it -- a mix between the gotama and race ski.

 

[Albertan ski girl]

The K2 Juvy does come in a 149, and its on sale at evo.com right now: https://www.evo.com/outlet/ski-packages/k2-juvy-skis-marker-fastrak2-70-bindings-youth-boys.aspx

I looked at the Remedy 75, and I think they are very similiar to the Juvy. They are both aspen core, cap construction etc. The only differences I can see is that the Juvy is twin tip, the Remedy is not. From what I can tell too, the Juvy has a slightly larger turning radius (12 as opposed to 10) and is a bit stiffer than the Remedy. I think that, as a solid intermediate, you would want to go with a slightly stiffer ski for her, no ? If she is going into black territory, I think you want to go beyond the beginner ski softness. The race skis sound good - but I really don't know much about them. They're a little skinny for out here. I would think that a good all-mountain ski would give her much more versatility as well a tool to go to more unfamiliar terrain - including ungroomed runs. I should mention that the K2 Juvy have DS the confidence to try bumps last season, and he really was able to attack the moguls on short runs with his skis. You could also try a women's ski that is softer, like the Atomic.

Maybe she should see if she can demo an adult ski and let you know what she thinks? With her height, I would veer away from anything more than 150 or 152. With a 150, or 152 ski, she could also probably use it for more than 1 season, depending on growth spurts, of course

The Atomic Affinity Air is also on sale at evo.com in a 152:
https://www.evo.com/outlet/ski-pack...to-10-demo-bindings-used-women-s-2013-140.jpg

This is very similar to the Pure and maybe a bit softer, and just slightly narrower - its got a 79 waist so still all-mountain versatile, and turns on a dime.

I know many divas are fans of the Rossi Temptation series - I think @Jilly has some thoughts on that? Maybe look at the Temptation 76 as well in a 146 or something in that length.

 

[Jilly]

What boot and BSL does your daughter have? Reason I'm asking is that will help determine her DIN setting. Some, not all, junior skis might have junior bindings. First adult boots might not fit and secondly the DIN setting may not go high enough.

We have a lot of light weight and vertically challenged Diva's. Most ski on a softer ladies ski.

 

[mustski]

Also, my daughter will be in a 25.5 boot (8.5 shoe) this year so yes, she is definitely in a bigger boot (my 8 year old will be in a 22.o boot).

It looks like she is definitely in adult sizes

 

[lisamamot]

I posed a similar question at the end of the last ski season for my tall/thin then 13 year old daughter who wore a 25.5 boot (Fischer MyStyle Soma 55?) and was skiing the Elan Zest 152. I wanted to get her in a ski that she could continue to grow with; as New England skiers we were looking for a carver that could also handle a bit of all mountain.

Based on advice here, and additional research, we got her the 2014 Rossignol Temptation 78 158 on clearance at the end of last season. She was out on them a few times in the spring (here in MA and at Loon) and loved them; they were light, stable, and lively enough to give her the fun she was looking for. We will be skiing at Sunday River this season and she is soooo excited for it to snow. She had another height spurt (not so much on the weight...too much soccer?!) and is now 14, 5'7" 108#. She is a very athletic girl and I am so glad I did not allow the shop guys to put her in a shorter ski...despite their questioning my length choice!

Sadly she grew out of her boots - bonus, I was able to sell all our unused ski gear at a local ski sale. With the proceeds, I will be taking her in to find the right boot for her...she now wears a 9-9.5 women's shoe, but with her scrawny calf, narrow heel, and medium width foot, I want to make sure she is in the right boot. No use having the great new skis if the boot is wrong!