Help Needed: Please help me Divas! Carvers wanted...but need advice

[Liquid Yellow]

Hiiiiii, Hope everyone's having a good summer and not missing the snow too much.

I'm in the market for a pair of carvers, but simply don't know what to buy. DEMOOOOOO you will tell me, but this isn't really possible. In the UK we only have 'fridges' I can go to, and their selection of skis to try is pretty small.

My requirements are as follows:

1) death-hold grip on ice BUT
2) wide enough to cope with a foot of fresh on piste
3) stable at speed and all turn shapes
4) smooth transition through crud/chop (ie won't throw me around too much)
5) no tip flap
6) not too heavy
7) no chatter!
8) quite lively and fun
9) can get round moguls

Is there ANYTHING that can fulfil this? The main things I'm after is the death-grip on ice and hard-pack, and stability at speed.

I'm guessing a waist of 78-80mm is what I'm looking for (I have Black Pearls for softer/deeper snow)

I've just bought a pair of K2 Potion 80 Xtis in a sale, but they are going straight back. I managed to find a load of reviews I didn't see before saying they're terrible, don't hold an edge, are chattery and 'only good for blue run skiers'. At least 5 reviews say this, they can't all be wrong. I've also discovered they weigh an absolute TON, probably mostly due to the bindings.

So far I'm thinking Head Total Joy or Absolute Joy, something Volkl, or whatever is around 80 waist in the Nordica Line (Hell's Belles?). I liked the Wild Belles when I tested them, but I think they've changed quite a lot since and are now wider. Volkls are quite hard to find in the UK, other than the Kenja (how about the Kenja!??).


Helppppp meeeeeeeeeeeee pleeeeaaaaase!!

 

[surfsnowgirl]

I just went through this last year. I have Kenjas and LOVE them. They are my true versatile ski that can handle ice/hardpack/crud/wet snow and I've had them in 6" of powder and they handled even that like a champ. Although the Kenja's handle ice better than most skis in its class I found I personally prefer something narrower for when its icy/hard pack all day long.

Volkl is my first go to ski. I have limited experience with the Head Joy line but I didn't like the Head Total Joy at all but some do love it. My experience with this ski was that it sucked in the soft spring snow and at 85 underfoot I expected more. However, if you are similar stats of divas that loved it maybe you would feel comfortable taking a chance. I have heard really good things about the Absolut Joy (79 underfoot) and the Super Joy (75 underfoot). I don't have any experience with Nordica skis. Just my 2 cents

I just bought a 80 underfoot Blizzard Magnum 8.0 ti on a wicked sale for $110. I hadn't demoed these skis but on paper they seem fabulous and from the diva's that have them I was willing to take the chance for $110. Now my Kenja's will come out and play when the conditions will be mixed or when we get 6-10" of powder. If we get more than that I'll demo a 90-100 underfoot ski.

DH has Volkl RTM 81's and its his only ski, they don't do so spectacularly in powder but do great in east coast ice and can handle some softer snow as well. Seems to be a good all around ski for him. Other skis I demoed that held in the ice like a rabid dog were Volkl Charisma, Rossignol Pursuit HP and Rossignol Pursuit 16.

 

[MaineSkiLady]

Have you tried Nordica's Belle to Belle? Nice ski. My best single word description of it: "Quiet." Quite competent. Not wildly exciting but totally gets the job done. Demo'd on very hard, refrozen snow late last March. I liked it. Don't recall waist width, but it was around 80. The new Wild, while wider at 88, is excellent. Don't dismiss it due to waist width. It was solid. (I have the 13-14 Wild Belle, for reference).

 

[badger]

I wholeheartedly second MSL's recommendation of the Belle to Belle @ 78.
Dynastar also has the Glory line this season. I skied the 2016 Glory at a demo last season and loved it!

 

[VickiK]

Hey, @Liquid Yellow didn't you have the Dynastar Legend Idyll whatever's, at some point, and you loved them? Hope my memory serves me correctly. I know those are awesome skis, as I bought them, loved them, but shame on me, I bought them too short, they were a little squirrely at higher speeds. After a couple of seasons on them, I got the Blizzard Viva 8.0 to use instead. That's 80mm under foot. I think the Blizzard Viva 810 Ti is a beefier edition, perhaps that's a more advanced ski. Might be worthwhile to check on those.

 

[Soujan]

I demoed the Head Super Joy. Super lightweight. Worked well in the frozen morning corduroy. I didn't really feel confident in them because I kept waiting for the edges to slip, but they didn't. Terrible in the afternoon chop. Too narrow and lightweight to cut through it. I kept getting thrown around.

 

[Liquid Yellow]

Hey, @Liquid Yellow didn't you have the Dynastar Legend Idyll whatever's, at some point, and you loved them? Hope my memory serves me correctly. I know those are awesome skis, as I bought them, loved them, but shame on me, I bought them too short, they were a little squirrely at higher speeds. After a couple of seasons on them, I got the Blizzard Viva 8.0 to use instead. That's 80mm under foot. I think the Blizzard Viva 810 Ti is a beefier edition, perhaps that's a more advanced ski. Might be worthwhile to check on those.

I did indeed have the Idylls and you remember correctly, I LOVED them! However, I did exactly the same as you and bought them a little too short and had the same problem: squirrely (and a bit terrifying) at high speeds. Fabulous in every other way though.

As we share a love of the same ski, I'll definitely have a look for the Vivas! Thank you for the tip.

Have you tried Nordica's Belle to Belle? Nice ski. My best single word description of it: "Quiet." Quite competent. Not wildly exciting but totally gets the job done. Demo'd on very hard, refrozen snow late last March. I liked it. Don't recall waist width, but it was around 80. The new Wild, while wider at 88, is excellent. Don't dismiss it due to waist width. It was solid. (I have the 13-14 Wild Belle, for reference).

That is exactly how I'd describe the older Wild Belle (which I think maybe you have), when I demoed that. I liked it a lot. I will have a look around, see what's available. I'm a bit wary of going much over 80, I must admit, as the Pearls are 88.

I wholeheartedly second MSL's recommendation of the Belle to Belle @ 78.
Dynastar also has the Glory line this season. I skied the 2016 Glory at a demo last season and loved it!

Oooh I've not heard of them! Having loved my Idylls, I'd happily go back to Dynastar.

Thanks for all the suggestions so far! Any other tips on Volkls? I may not be able to find much over here though. I've not seen the Charisma anywhere and they sound ideal.

I also have the Blizzards, Belle to Belles and Glories to look into, great stuff!

 

[MaineSkiLady]

@Liquid Yellow, I will keep my “ear to the rail” for you with this. I remember well your great fondness for the Idyll. Oh, how you would have loved its predecessor, the Exclusive Legend (no sub-name), which did not have this “speed limit” issue when skied at proper length. I was disappointed in the Idyll, switched to the Eden. One is still in my quiver and is a “giant slayer” in terms of your checklist. It was only produced for 2 seasons, the second and final one in ‘12-‘13.

Demo weekend here is in early December; I will seek out that Dynastar Glory and hope the rep is on site.

In the meantime, remember that in terms of numbers 1 and 2 on your list, #1 is a function of ski construction and technique (the 85 wide Eden does ice well, as does the earlier Wild Belle - I own both). #2 is a function of the ski’s flotation (so - width and length) and the pressure exerted on it, both via pressure control and your overall body weight. Length will be your friend. It’s a fine line to meet both - but it CAN be done. The only time length would work against you would be if you spend much time in very tight trees and glades. In Europe, I doubt this is ever-present?

I’ve not been on that narrower Blizzard so can’t comment. I’ve determined I’m not a fan of Blizzard’s rocker. Volkl Yumi is a nice ski - but where it might let you down would be the liveliness/pop department. Volkls tend to dampness. Still liking the Nordica Belle to Belle. Difference between Dynastar Eden and Nordica Wild Belle (pre 2016) is ski heft. Wild Belle is lighter and easier. Best skied longer.

I've tried the 2016 Wild Belle, but at 88 wide, its specs are too close to your Black Pearls (although it skis and engages quite differently).

Will keep you posted and put up some info after demos.

 

[Liquid Yellow]

I demoed the Head Super Joy. Super lightweight. Worked well in the frozen morning corduroy. I didn't really feel confident in them because I kept waiting for the edges to slip, but they didn't. Terrible in the afternoon chop. Too narrow and lightweight to cut through it. I kept getting thrown around.

Just noticed this - thanks for the tip. I was actually leaning towards them a bit, but I need a ski that copes with afternoon chop as it's a condition I will almost certainly be skiing on every day.

Oh well!

The Dynastar Glory 79 looks interesting, I wonder how similar it is to my old Idylls...it could be the one if it doesn't have its predecessor's speed limit!

@Liquid Yellow, I will keep my “ear to the rail” for you with this. I remember well your great fondness for the Idyll. Oh, how you would have loved its predecessor, the Exclusive Legend (no sub-name), which did not have this “speed limit” issue when skied at proper length. I was disappointed in the Idyll, switched to the Eden. One is still in my quiver and is a “giant slayer” in terms of your checklist. It was only produced for 2 seasons, the second and final one in ‘12-‘13.

Demo weekend here is in early December; I will seek out that Dynastar Glory and hope the rep is on site.

In the meantime, remember that in terms of numbers 1 and 2 on your list, #1 is a function of ski construction and technique (the 85 wide Eden does ice well, as does the earlier Wild Belle - I own both). #2 is a function of the ski’s flotation (so - width and length) and the pressure exerted on it, both via pressure control and your overall body weight. Length will be your friend. It’s a fine line to meet both - but it CAN be done. The only time length would work against you would be if you spend much time in very tight trees and glades. In Europe, I doubt this is ever-present?

I’ve not been on that narrower Blizzard so can’t comment. I’ve determined I’m not a fan of Blizzard’s rocker. Volkl Yumi is a nice ski - but where it might let you down would be the liveliness/pop department. Volkls tend to dampness. Still liking the Nordica Belle to Belle. Difference between Dynastar Eden and Nordica Wild Belle (pre 2016) is ski heft. Wild Belle is lighter and easier. Best skied longer.

I've tried the 2016 Wild Belle, but at 88 wide, its specs are too close to your Black Pearls (although it skis and engages quite differently).

Will keep you posted and put up some info after demos.

Thanks so much for the big post MSL, plenty of food for thought there....

No, you will never find me anywhere near tight trees LOL, I never venture far off the piste. However my turns still need work, and I do find I struggle a bit on longer skis (I couldn't properly handle my Rossi S86Ws in a 170). Somewhere around 16o-163 max always feels a good length to me.

I've tried the Yumi, it was fun but didn't grip on boilerplate at all, sadly.

The choice these days is just bewildering!!

 

[nopoleskier]

Have you tried the Atomics?? the Cloud 11's are fantastic front side carvers.. quick,nimble, stable on ice.. my favorite front side for ripping...

 

[Jilly]

Now you made me go and look at the Dynastar site. Like MSL I should be able to demo early in the season. I liked the Elite series for front side. Last year's PRO was in the running for me. The Active Pro reminds me of my Attraxion 8's in it's dimensions. Have to try the Glory's.

 

[Jenny]

FWIW I loved my Nordica Victory, which then became the Infinite, which then I'm almost positive became the Belle to Belle.

They held well on the hard stuff, and I could use them in soft new snow, but they certainly weren't made for it. However, I did have some people say that I shouldn't have been able to use them at all, but I still did. Not sure they aren't considered heavy, and honestly have no idea about moguls, as I tend to avoid them at all costs.

I replaced them with the pre-change Wild Belle last year, as I did find that I got thrown around more than I wanted to in the crud, but there's a great deal of operator issues in that stuff - for me, anyway. I wanted to see if something a little wider helped me out, which it did. The thing with the Wild Belle's for me was getting used to the tip rocker - I felt they were flapping, and didn't know if it was just becoming accustomed to it, or if I wasn't skiing them right.

However, take this all with a grain of salt, as I demoed the K2 Potion 84xti and liked them. So we may not like the same thing at all . . .

 

[lisamamot]

I ski in New England and did not care for my pre-change Belle to Belle on ice/frozen at all. Replaced them with the 2015 Blizzard Viva 810 ti (81mm) and fell in love - fantastic biters and very stable; certainly not a deep snow ski though. I wouldn't be happy in a foot of freshies on anything narrower than my Atomic Elysian (95mm).

 

[Liquid Yellow]

Have you tried the Atomics?? the Cloud 11's are fantastic front side carvers.. quick,nimble, stable on ice.. my favorite front side for ripping...

No I haven't, I will take a look - thank you!

Now you made me go and look at the Dynastar site. Like MSL I should be able to demo early in the season. I liked the Elite series for front side. Last year's PRO was in the running for me. The Active Pro reminds me of my Attraxion 8's in it's dimensions. Have to try the Glory's.

I get a bit confused with the Dynastars, there seem to be so many of them around!

FWIW I loved my Nordica Victory, which then became the Infinite, which then I'm almost positive became the Belle to Belle.

They held well on the hard stuff, and I could use them in soft new snow, but they certainly weren't made for it. However, I did have some people say that I shouldn't have been able to use them at all, but I still did. Not sure they aren't considered heavy, and honestly have no idea about moguls, as I tend to avoid them at all costs.

I replaced them with the pre-change Wild Belle last year, as I did find that I got thrown around more than I wanted to in the crud, but there's a great deal of operator issues in that stuff - for me, anyway. I wanted to see if something a little wider helped me out, which it did. The thing with the Wild Belle's for me was getting used to the tip rocker - I felt they were flapping, and didn't know if it was just becoming accustomed to it, or if I wasn't skiing them right.

However, take this all with a grain of salt, as I demoed the K2 Potion 84xti and liked them. So we may not like the same thing at all . . .

Did you not find the Xti very heavy? That's part of the reason I sent back the 80 xtis, they were heavier than my longer and wider Pearls - by some way! They weighed 15.2 kilos..(had to weigh them to send them back!)

Thank you for the B2B feedback - I think I'll have to discount them though as they're too close to the BPs in dimensions.

I ski in New England and did not care for my pre-change Belle to Belle on ice/frozen at all. Replaced them with the 2015 Blizzard Viva 810 ti (81mm) and fell in love - fantastic biters and very stable; certainly not a deep snow ski though. I wouldn't be happy in a foot of freshies on anything narrower than my Atomic Elysian (95mm).

I can't find those Vivas available anywhere!! They must only have been sold in the States.

My Idylls were happy in a foot of fresh - but not much deeper.

I'm still wondering about the Kenjas, I know they're almost as wide as the Pearls but they're a very different animal.

 

[Jenny]

Did you not find the Xti very heavy? That's part of the reason I sent back the 80 xtis, they were heavier than my longer and wider Pearls - by some way! They weighed 15.2 kilos..(had to weigh them to send them back!)

I honestly didn't notice the weight but then I didn't have to carry them anywhere, either, as I got them from a demo tent right at the bottom of our itty bitty hill! Plus, I just think I've always had heavy skis. The ones I have now are the first skis I've ever had without demo bindings.

 

[lisamamot]

My daughter has the Dynastar Legend Eden (85mm) - the orange ones and loved them on everything last season. We had one day of pretty deep new snow where she struggled a bit, actually we both did, but our issues were definitely operator error! We had a blast, but it was more new snow than we had ever skied and it showed.

I hear the new Kenja has less metal - I hope to hop on it this season so I can try to mentally compare it to the one I demoed last year.

 

[MaineSkiLady]

My daughter has the Dynastar Legend Eden (85mm) - the orange ones and loved them on everything last season. We had one day of pretty deep new snow where she struggled a bit, actually we both did, but our issues were definitely operator error! We had a blast, but it was more new snow than we had ever skied and it showed.

Edens were only made for 2 years (darn), the orange being year 2 (and final, alas). As I recall, she's a lightweight like I am - thus the ski is wide enough to do some float in around a foot, but probably can get tossed in crud, as lightweights often experience on almost anything. I've been skiing a variation of Dynastar's Exclusive Legend 85 wide for around 6 years (among a few other skis).

 

[NZfarmgirl]

The Kenyas are a great ski I have talked bout them a lot here BUT I am NOT going to recommend them today. And they are too close to the size of your other skis.
I am now finding the Volkl Code to be an incredibly versatile ski!
It carves on edge really well, is stable, grips ice, handles bumps, off piste, some powder, heavy wet snow, crud, marbles, I used them for my exam and have been using them to teach and train all season. Normally I swap skis a lot but I can use these all over the mountain. They are much more technical than my Kenja's, I can make a higher performance turn on them.
Radius of 14 means it can handle a range of turn shapes.
Stiffness great for stability
I am going to buy a more powder specific ski to compliment the code (Cham 97) and then probably won't ski my Kenja's much- my Daughter can have them.
Disclaimer- my codes are 2 years old, they may have changed a bit. But I've seen many experienced instructors and skiers on the new blue ones this year.
The code is for an advanced skier, and great for learning to ski a true performance turn. However I don't find them hard work to ski compared to say a racetiger SL for example -which I find exhausting!

 

[NZfarmgirl]

I recommend to narrow your list to a few brands that you already trust. Otherwise it is overwhelming.

 

[LauraVa]

If you like your BP's, you may like the Blizzard Cheyennes. I took a couple runs on them on groomed mid Atlantic snow and thought they felt light and nimble, with good edge hold.