Does Fear Betray You?

[Blue Diamond]

It seems to me that when I am feeling confident on the slopes, my skis respond perfectly. I sometimes even feel as if my skis were an extension of my legs. During those moments, I ski almost without thinking, having my brain, my legs and my skis perfectly in sync. It has been during these moments that have conquered most of my "skiing goals" (more advanced slopes, more challenging terrain, more difficult conditions, etc.)

But when I get scared and can't control that fear, it is a whole different story. It is as if everything all of a sudden got disconnected: my brain does not communicate with my legs, and my skis don't seem to respond to my legs. This becomes a mess, and if it doesn't end up in a fall, I find myself snowplowing the whole way down. This happens to me when I get scared for whatever reason, and even if I have skied successfully on similar terrain/conditions before. It is as if my skiing skills had suddenly disappeared.

Have you girls felt betrayed by fear like this? And if so...how do you tame fear?

 

[RhodySkier]

I can definitely relate to having fear take over my skiing abilities!

During my last lesson, I got scared going down a new black run which culminated in me falling down. And I knew I was going to fall because I started leaning uphill instead of downhill--happens every time I get too scared! :mad: My instructor had me get up and just stand on my edges for a few moments. He had me take a few breaths and just look around at my surroundings (which were beautiful!). He made the point that sometimes adrenaline is a bad thing, and I needed to dump some of that sympathetic surge before I started skiing again. He also reminded me that skiing is about the near future, not the distant future. I needed to just concentrate on the next few turns not the bottom of the slope. I made it down the rest of the slope in decent form and without falling anymore.

I think taking that time out to relax and reset was really helpful to me to get over my fear.

 

[badger]

Definitely. Funny how fear seizes and strangles us when we least expect it. My most recent episode occurred after having wiped out on a very simple catwalk, just cruising. (and as AltaGirl pointed out, that was what doomed me. Cruising along without thinking of my edges.)
Once I regained my composure I actually felt fine, no injury, and headed toward my destination...
BUT I COULDN'T SKI. And I couldn't ski the next day either. Coming off double-blue Utah runs to barely making turns on a green not only had me flumoxed, but extremely discouraged. This weird fear was like a parasite eating away at my composure and confidence. To get rid of it, I waited until I could ski my home mountain
and just worked my way back into skiing, starting with a green run and then doing the runs where I always have confidence; relaxed to gain control. Had a wonderful day! I try not to dis myself with negative head talk, and enter the "This is all about Fun" zone. Letting go is the best way to move forward!

 

[contesstant]

Fear is my absolute worst enemy. It holds me back like nothing else. I found that while in a private lesson, I was flying down the hill in the tracks of my instructor, without even thinking about it. I just WENT. Left to my own devices, my brain gets in the way BIG time! I have yet to conquer it. I don't get to ski often enought to work on it :(

 

[bounceswoosh]

Have you girls felt betrayed by fear like this? And if so...how do you tame fear?

Oh, yes. Oh, hell yes.

So first of all, if you're routinely putting yourself on ski slopes that paralyze you with fear - you're doing it wrong! That kind of fear is not going to make you a better skier; as you mentioned, it will tense you up, making it more likely that you'll get hurt, and if you do get hurt on something that was already terrifying, it could set back your skiing for a long time.

So I'm going to assume that for the most part, you aren't skiing terrifying stuff, but every now and then you find yourself on a scary run ...

(Nothing wrong with being challenged or feeling apprehensive, but I would say that's different from pure terror)

Some things that help me:

* Someone to follow (like an instructor). Following the person ahead of you, assuming that they are skiing in a way you can match, keeps your brain busy *and* your eyes ahead.
* If it's something I can ski down with normal turns, focusing on one particular, concrete action, like "push the grip of the pole forward after you plant"
* If it's not something I feel I can ski with normal turns, using side slipping and falling leaf, and realizing that there's *absolutely nothing wrong with that*
* Singing! Something loud and raucous and gutsy. When I'm not "feeling it", I sing Henry the Eighth. Sometimes funny beats scary =) It gives me a rhythm. And as someone in another thread mentioned, singing engages your core and gets you breathing.

... for a long time, skiing typically included runs where I would be stuck, crying, not knowing what to do next. I'm not sure if I've actually taught myself how not to freak out like that, or if my skills have just progressed to the point where there's not much on the mountain that challenges me that badly. I know that there's terrain out there that would terrify me - but it's not going to be easily accessible. I would have to choose it.

 

[Perty]

I was a very scared skier-something to do with suffering from fear of heights and the sense that the drop is sucking me down. Legs to jelly and tummy churning. I don't get that very often now, but only cos I'm a better skier. Once I get to a really steep drop I feel it again...but usually I can get through it.

However....

A few weeks ago I went by cable car to the top of the Aiguille du Midi (3800 m), which is the starting point for the Vallee Blanche off piste ski run in Chamonix. We didn't go to ski it, we just went to see the view, and I wanted to see the famous "arete" that everyone has to hike along before the start of the ski route. The Vallee Blanche itself is apparently well within the ability of an average intermediate. How can one explain the sense of standing on top of a needle (albeit with a restaurant) and a knife edge with a 2000m drop everywhere you look. ... and the bridge which links the needle through a tunnel to the knife edge. I could not look down...I walked about with my eyes fixed upwards, with occasional sideways glances downwards. My stomach was in my mouth. Not helped by hyperventilation in the thin air at that altitude which makes your heart race and feel light headed anyway. The arete is a snow covered ridge with the same 2000m drop each way (well....one side may be a mere 500m but what the heck!). They have put in railings and apparently you are roped to your guide to tackle it. I really really want to ski the VB one day, but the thought of walking that ridge in ski boots, carrying my skis.... I have been known to freeze. Even if I don't, I know my legs will barely move if I step out, and they will feel sooo wobbly....
In a way I wish I had never been to check it out, and just had to face my demons on the day I do the VB. I feel such a pathetic wimp!

 

[ski diva]

Perty, you are not a wimp. Because if you are, I am, too.

I've never been to the arete, and from the way you describe it, I don't know if I want to, either. I'm sure I would have reacted the same way. I have height issues, and there are some things that just get the better of me. This is okay; I've decided, at my ripe old age, that I don't have to do it all. I've given myself permission to let go; to say, nah, I think I'll pass. It's a freeing experience, if I do say so myself.

Nonetheless, there's a book by Mermer Blakeslee called In the Yikes Zone that addresses many of the fear issues many of us encounter while skiing. It was making the rounds on the forum a while back; I'm not sure what happened to it, but it's certainly worth investigating.

I interviewed Mermer a while ago in my blog. You can check it out here. She's a remarkable individual with some great insights, and has become an industry guru on this topic.

 

[Blue Diamond]

Rhodyskier,
I also tend to lean uphill instead of downhill when I get. This messes up my balance and that doesn't help with the fear at all! It is like a vicious cycle. I like the exercise you did with your instructor. I have also found that stopping for a few seconds to breathe deeply and enjoy the landscape helps. I guess we need to remember to "breathe" (yoga style).

badger,
I have totally felt that "parasite eating away at my composure and confidence" (I love your metaphor) when I get scared, and then I am afraid to ski any longer. I will follow your strategy of continuing skiing on slopes where I feel safe in order to regain my confidence.

contesstant,
Fear is my worse enemy too! I think a little fear is actually good (maybe to make you aware of your limits), but when fear takes over it's not good.

 

[Blue Diamond]

Oh, yes. Oh, hell yes.

So first of all, if you're routinely putting yourself on ski slopes that paralyze you with fear - you're doing it wrong! That kind of fear is not going to make you a better skier; as you mentioned, it will tense you up, making it more likely that you'll get hurt, and if you do get hurt on something that was already terrifying, it could set back your skiing for a long time.

So I'm going to assume that for the most part, you aren't skiing terrifying stuff, but every now and then you find yourself on a scary run ...

(Nothing wrong with being challenged or feeling apprehensive, but I would say that's different from pure terror)

Some things that help me:

* Someone to follow (like an instructor). Following the person ahead of you, assuming that they are skiing in a way you can match, keeps your brain busy *and* your eyes ahead.
* If it's something I can ski down with normal turns, focusing on one particular, concrete action, like "push the grip of the pole forward after you plant"
* If it's not something I feel I can ski with normal turns, using side slipping and falling leaf, and realizing that there's *absolutely nothing wrong with that*
* Singing! Something loud and raucous and gutsy. When I'm not "feeling it", I sing Henry the Eighth. Sometimes funny beats scary =) It gives me a rhythm. And as someone in another thread mentioned, singing engages your core and gets you breathing.

bounceswoosh,
My DH is an advanced snowboarder who likes to do steep runs (blacks and double blacks), deep powder (I mean DEEP) and tree skiing. I guess I do often (not routinely, but often enough) get myself into scary situations by trying to reach his level too fast. I know some challenge is good for your progress, but as you said, it shouldn't be too much as to freak you out and set you back. I have totally freaked out on a non so steep terrain doing "tree-skiing" with him. I didn't fall or crash, but I saw each tree much closer than they actually were and I ended up almost hating them, instead of enjoying that nice powder between the trees.

I love your advice! I have used that "side slipping and falling leaf" on steep terrain. It is really helpful. I have not tried the singing, though. It would have never occurred to me. I'll give it a try.

Thanks!

 

[Blue Diamond]

Perty,
That sounds both scary and beautiful! I need to google up some pictures of that. I was in Chamonix last year, but we didn't go to the Aiguille du Midi, we just skied Grand Montets. However, I did fall in love with Chamonix (my DH already was) and we would love to be back. I would like to improve my skills a lot more before I return, though. But I think I will check out that arete, as you did, before hiking with boots and skis (or shouldn't I?).

SKi Diva,
I will look up that book. It sounds interesting.

Thank you all for your feedback!

 

[maggie198]

It seems to me that when I am feeling confident on the slopes, my skis respond perfectly. I sometimes even feel as if my skis were an extension of my legs...

But when I get scared and can't control that fear, it is a whole different story. It is as if everything all of a sudden got disconnected: my brain does not communicate with my legs, and my skis don't seem to respond to my legs. This becomes a mess, and if it doesn't end up in a fall, I find myself snowplowing the whole way down. This happens to me when I get scared for whatever reason, and even if I have skied successfully on similar terrain/conditions before. It is as if my skiing skills had suddenly disappeared.

Have you girls felt betrayed by fear like this? And if so...how do you tame fear?

Absoluely! I was just going to post a similar thread. I get so frustrated with myself when I let fear get the better of me and I end up skiing like a beginner on a slope I have the skills to handle. Confidence is everything! Fear makes us sit back and hang back, and freeze up as well. The very opposite of what we should be doing. What has stuck in my head advice-wise is to go straight down into the fall line, telling myself I CAN turn whenever I want, and my speed WILL decrease when I traverse the slope. And to make myself consciously lean forward, counteracting the hanging back that fear induces.

Sometimes it's easier said than done! I'm gonna try the singing suggestion, I like that one!

 

[bounceswoosh]

bounceswoosh,
My DH is an advanced snowboarder who likes to do steep runs (blacks and double blacks), deep powder (I mean DEEP) and tree skiing. I guess I do often (not routinely, but often enough) get myself into scary situations by trying to reach his level too fast. I know some challenge is good for your progress, but as you said, it shouldn't be too much as to freak you out and set you back. I have totally freaked out on a non so steep terrain doing "tree-skiing" with him. I didn't fall or crash, but I saw each tree much closer than they actually were and I ended up almost hating them, instead of enjoying that nice powder between the trees.

Been there, done that, have the t-shirt! It took me a few years of skiing double blacks (because that's what my husband liked to ski, and I didn't want to ruin his fun - which of course I did anyway because I was so freaked out) without actually seeming to improve or feel more confident that I realized, hey, I need some lessons. Lessons have been huge for both of us. He is still much more confident on difficult terrain than I am, but at least now he says that the gap is narrowing, and he has to work to keep "ahead" of me =)

I love your advice! I have used that "side slipping and falling leaf" on steep terrain. It is really helpful. I have not tried the singing, though. It would have never occurred to me. I'll give it a try.
Thanks!

I can't take credit - well, I can for the particular song, but not for the idea. My instructor Kevin is always and forever "talking to the flakes," as he puts it. If you listened to him skiing, you'd think he was crazy. He said that it helps him when his rhythm feels off. So then in a lesson a couple of months ago, he suggested that we come up with a chant or saying that we can use. Somehow Henry is what came to mind ... and it really works for me!

(I am plotting to start singing "I like big butts ..." when Henry gets boring, but I will need to study the lyrics. I know them up to a certain point, but then I lose them. Now *that* will get some looks as I ski down the mountain!)

 

[contesstant]

Been there, done that, have the t-shirt! It took me a few years of skiing double blacks (because that's what my husband liked to ski, and I didn't want to ruin his fun - which of course I did anyway because I was so freaked out) without actually seeming to improve or feel more confident that I realized, hey, I need some lessons. Lessons have been huge for both of us. He is still much more confident on difficult terrain than I am, but at least now he says that the gap is narrowing, and he has to work to keep "ahead" of me =)



I can't take credit - well, I can for the particular song, but not for the idea. My instructor Kevin is always and forever "talking to the flakes," as he puts it. If you listened to him skiing, you'd think he was crazy. He said that it helps him when his rhythm feels off. So then in a lesson a couple of months ago, he suggested that we come up with a chant or saying that we can use. Somehow Henry is what came to mind ... and it really works for me!

(I am plotting to start singing "I like big butts ..." when Henry gets boring, but I will need to study the lyrics. I know them up to a certain point, but then I lose them. Now *that* will get some looks as I ski down the mountain!)

I, too, have fallen victim to the "come on down this run, you can do it!" I now send the boys on their way, or make it very clear that we need to ski MY level for few hours, THEN send them on their way.

Last trip, I took to whistling to relax me. I'm glad I'm not the only one who folks might think is a little nuts!

 

[Blue Diamond]

I get so frustrated with myself when I let fear get the better of me and I end up skiing like a beginner on a slope I have the skills to handle.

maggie198,
I totally feel that way in those circumstances. I even say to myself "I'm a beginner today. The intermediate skier that was here last week stayed home today." I will take your advice of concentrating on the fall line and the turns...aside with the deep breathing and singing ;)

bouncewoosh,
Lessons! That is a key word. This was only my fourth season skiing. My first two seasons I took several lessons and I did improve a lot: from first-timer to easy blacks. But last season I did not take ANY lesson and just kept trying to improve by myself, getting into those scary situations every now and then. This season I was going to take a women's ski clinic at Alpine every Wednesday, but on my very first day I freaked out (icy terrain off-piste), fell, and broke my tibial plateau. I should have gone with an easier group, but I guess I didn't asses my skill level (partly due to having been skiing without formal instruction the whole previous season), nor the snow conditions, appropriately. Lesson learned! And next season when I'm back on the mountains I will start my lessons with an easier group.

contesstant,
I actually enjoy the challenge of skiing with someone better than me. My DH and my BIL push me, and, if I don't freak out, I normally conquer new goals and feel so proud of myself. I guess it could apply a little that saying regarding tennis, "if you want to improve your game, choose a player who is better than you."
However, sometimes they can push "too hard", and then it back fires at you

All in all I think challenge is great for improving...but there is a fine line to it.

 

[Serafina]

Definitely this has happened to me!

A couple of weeks ago I was skiing Okemo with Mr. Serafina, who can competently navigate a green slope using the most uncomfortable stance I can imagine and doing wedge-christy turns. I'd promised not to take him on any hair-raising runs, but we did go the summit to find the top of the super-long super-easy green cruiser that runs down the edge of the ski area.

Unfortunately, the top of the mountain was experiencing a full-blown blizzard (which no one thought important enough to mention at the base) and we immediately got lost. I don't lose it easily, but as it turns out, being lost in a white-out with the wind whipping around at the top of an unfamiliar mountain while responsible for another skier with less advanced skills was enough to send me toward the edge. And, bloody hell, I totally forgot how to ski. I found myself doing a freaking *snowplow* across the summit, like I'd only learned to clip into bindings that morning, or something.

It was absurd, and I knew it at the time, so I just laughed and lectured myself out of my fear. Realizing we'd made a wrong turn and we at the trailhead for one of the blues that heads directly down the face of the mountain, and consequently taking the skis off to hike back up to the patrol station, also helped. I was so winded by that hike there wasn't room in my body for fear.

 

[B.E.G.]

Like Bounceswoosh said, I find it so helpful to be following someone else down the hill - especially an instructor. That's how I did my first blue WELL - I was concentrating on following my instructor and didn't even realize I had been on a blue until hours later when I looked at a trail map.

The singing is a great idea! I talk to myself out loud to get over the few seconds on top of a steep hill - basically sternly telling myself to point those damn skis down the hill and GO already Sometimes I need to kick myself in the butt to get going!

But fear is always with me on any runs that aren't green because I'm so new to this. I am very conscious of what can go wrong, of injuries I can accumulate, of Bad Things Happening. But I also tell myself - I would not be on this run if I didn't think I could handle it and if I didn't have the skills to get myself down it safely (if not gracefully). And I learn to let my fear propel me along as an adrenaline rush. That said, I work my way slowly to harder runs because I have been in situations where I was on a run I was not ready for (I blame a guy I used to date) and it was Not Fun. So I don't think I put myself into situations where I am so scared that I freeze, you know?

But honestly, I think having a healthy amount of fear is a good thing to have. It keeps me responsible and gives me a healthier perspective towards my skills in relation to the runs I am choosing to do - I'm not old by any means, but I'm also not a 16 yo daredevil teen. I would like to STAY healthy for many years after and being safe and conscious of my abilities and letting a small amount of fear temper any rash decisions is part of attaining that goal.

 

[Liquid Yellow]

A few weeks ago I went by cable car to the top of the Aiguille du Midi (3800 m), which is the starting point for the Vallee Blanche off piste ski run in Chamonix. We didn't go to ski it, we just went to see the view, and I wanted to see the famous "arete" that everyone has to hike along before the start of the ski route. The Vallee Blanche itself is apparently well within the ability of an average intermediate. How can one explain the sense of standing on top of a needle (albeit with a restaurant) and a knife edge with a 2000m drop everywhere you look. ... and the bridge which links the needle through a tunnel to the knife edge. I could not look down...I walked about with my eyes fixed upwards, with occasional sideways glances downwards. My stomach was in my mouth. Not helped by hyperventilation in the thin air at that altitude which makes your heart race and feel light headed anyway. The arete is a snow covered ridge with the same 2000m drop each way (well....one side may be a mere 500m but what the heck!). They have put in railings and apparently you are roped to your guide to tackle it. I really really want to ski the VB one day, but the thought of walking that ridge in ski boots, carrying my skis.... I have been known to freeze. Even if I don't, I know my legs will barely move if I step out, and they will feel sooo wobbly....
In a way I wish I had never been to check it out, and just had to face my demons on the day I do the VB. I feel such a pathetic wimp!

I skied the Vallee Blanche a few years ago, and I honestly don't remember it being that bad. Unless they've changed the start of it, we weren't roped to anyone, we just had to get to the end of a walkway then kind of hang off the end and drop. After that it was all fine.

Here are a couple of pics, it was truly spectacular:

As for fear, I know that feeling well. Many years ago I got 'stuck' on a very steep and icy piste at Les Arcs, at the top of the Aguille Rouge. People were sliding down it out of control and falling all the way to the bottom, and I was literally paralysed with fear. I stood there for what seemed like an hour, before realising that no-one was going to save me.

I sidestepped the whole way down.

Since then, I've had a horrible phobia about ice. Every time I was on a steep slope, I'd panic about it being icy and sliding to the bottom. In the end I went to a hypnotherapist, which did actually help. She taught me some techniques to deal with the panic attacks (including breathing deeply and also saying to myself "I strong like bull!" in an Italian accent haha)

It did help a lot, but I do still have the occasional 'moment'.

In Zell Am See last month, we were at the top of a steep black which was VERY icy. I had my new skis, and I knew the edges were good but even so I had to pluck up the courage to get that first turn in - I got the weight transfer wrong and nearly straightlined it , but luckily managed to correct myself and turn. I carried on to the bottom, my edges held on the boiler plate and I was VERY proud of myself!

I'm not sure what the answer is, but for me I think my new skis are finally starting to rebuild my long-lost confidence.

 

[snow addict]

I often need to have quite words with myself. I think I might have some sort of altitude sickness, but often when I ski a new and difficult terrain which is above all is at a high altitude, I need a few minutes to catch my breath and loosen up. It gets better especially if i ski this terrain repeatedly, like Mont Fort in Verbier doesn't cause me a vertigo anymore, though I am not yet ready for its backside. I had a bad moment when I went to ski the Vallee Blanche last year, like 'OMG! What did I get myself into?' and walking the Aiguille du Midi Ridge was unnerving. Not difficult skiing but with potentially no-fall places. Some traverses can be like that - no superior skills are required but if for some freakish reason you fall you'll be dead. And when we skied in Argentier I was a bit overwhelmed. Thin air, terrain, the vue, all these made me feel really small and kind of wonder if I could really get down this on two planks strapped to my feet, if this was a good idea. If I was a smoker they would probably be moments that I would be reaching for a cigarette. It's very difficult to start moving in this situations even if I know how and can see my turns. but usually once I finally get going it becomes better. I want to drive there with a friend in a couple of weeks to see if this feeling becomes less acute as the novelty disappears. But I think these moments are generally normal, there is nothing wrong with a healthy doze of fear. Mountains shouldn't really be taken lightly.

 

[SkiBam]

Interesting topic. I agree that one of the main ways to instill fear in someone is to take them to a run that's way above their ability and tell them to "just ski it." This happened a number of times to my sister, who to this day HATES skiing.

Key to overcoming the fear of steeps is, I think, to work your way up. Start on not-steep and gradually go steeper. It's interesting that over the years some runs I used to think were very steep and scary (the U.N. at Jay comes to mind) seem much less so now that I've done way steeper.

And when you do get to that run that seems too steep for you, you have two choices: don't do it at all (nothing wrong with that – there's no way in the world I would have jumped into Corbet's Couloir!) or go for it. If the latter, remember, the first turn is the hardest. I often tell myself, just make that one turn and it will be okay – and it is. Also, there's no shame at all in (as others have said) sideslipping or in some cases stemming to make the turn.

All this said though, some fears are irrational. I would be terrified to sit on a chair lift without the bar down. Not that I think it's really protecting me, but I have the feeling that without it down, I might be somehow tempted to jump off. Like if I'm near the edge of a cliff, I might just jump. Totally weird and irrational, but a fear nevertheless. I know that if ever I'm somewhere where there's no bar, I'll be holding on to the back of the chair the entire way up!

 

[crutchesgirl]

liquid courage!

This may be a bit controversial, but I think most women do have a tendency to be overly cautious...at least I do. I have a routine that works for me. I take 3-5 runs to get warmed up. then take a break to rest my muscles and have one drink...maybe a shot of tequila with half a beer or a mixed drink. then I ski the next two hours straight. My skiing is tremendous with just a little liquid courage. I'm not tentative and I ski agressively, but carefully. don't drink any more than that, and if you aren't used to alcohol, start with half a drink. Seriously, it makes a huge difference.